View Poll Results: Who's The Better Hawkman?

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  • Carter Hall

    21 56.76%
  • Katar Hol

    16 43.24%
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  1. #31
    Uncanny Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by married guy View Post
    What a loaded question!!!
    Hawkman continuity is a straight up cluster f**k and has been since Crisis.
    Actually, just after CoIE wasn't a big problem.

    It was when DC had the three-issue Hawkworld prestige series in 1989 (three years later) and decided to not only make that Katar Hol's new origin story, but also decided it occurred in the (then) present-time (ignoring they already had done a post-CoIE Katar Hol-Hawkman series)!

  2. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaijudo View Post
    Gotta go with Carter. Katar was fine, but ultimately his place in the DCU was just another space cop, like Hal Jordan, with not enough in his character to distinguish him from that (unlike, say, Superman vs. Martian Manhunter). But Carter as winged hero/archaeologist/barbarian has a unique role within the universe, especially when you add in the reincarnation angle.
    This. 1940's Carter >> 1960's Katar

  3. #33
    Astonishing Member kingaliencracker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    Actually, just after CoIE wasn't a big problem.

    It was when DC had the three-issue Hawkworld prestige series in 1989 (three years later) and decided to not only make that Katar Hol's new origin story, but also decided it occurred in the (then) present-time (ignoring they already had done a post-CoIE Katar Hol-Hawkman series)!
    Such a huge gaffe by editorial.

    I understand their thought process - Hawkworld was an AMAZING story and they wanted to continue from that foundation.

    But boy, it definitely screwed things up. We can't even assume that the post-Crisis Hawkman series featured Fel Andar because he pretended to be Carter Hall's son! And we can't just ignore the post-Crisis Hawkman series because it had a crossover with Byrne's Action Comics run at the time.

    I guess Superboy-Prime punched a cosmic wall and yada, yada, yada...

  4. #34
    Mighty Member C_Miller's Avatar
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    I'm definitely a Carter fan. Not only do I tend to prefer the Golden Age aesthetic, I genuinely also find him more interesting. He has an origin which is fully his own and while Katar doesn't have a perfect analog, there are a lot of aliens who come to Earth storylines and IMO, nothing about the character makes him stand apart.

    I'm actually kind of surprised by the poll, I always thought Katar was more popular around these parts.

  5. #35
    Astonishing Member kingaliencracker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by C_Miller View Post
    I'm definitely a Carter fan. Not only do I tend to prefer the Golden Age aesthetic, I genuinely also find him more interesting. He has an origin which is fully his own and while Katar doesn't have a perfect analog, there are a lot of aliens who come to Earth storylines and IMO, nothing about the character makes him stand apart.

    I'm actually kind of surprised by the poll, I always thought Katar was more popular around these parts.
    Well, most modern depictions of Hawkman post-2000 are of Carter Hall, including Justice League Unlimited, Smallville, and Legends of Tomorrow.

    And Carter Hall was THE Hawkman for about 10 years before Rob Liefield made things murky with The New 52 version.

    So the poll isn't really that surprising to me. HAVING SAID THAT, I don't care what the poll says or who is ultimately more popular - Hawkworld is still THE best Hawkman story of all-time.

  6. #36
    Boisterously Confused
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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    Gentleman Ghost was a Golden Age Carter Hall/Khufu foe.
    Originally, but Katar also had one of his own.

    Image.jpg

    I voted Katar, because I feel there's a wider range of things that can be done with him, and I always liked that he had a more fully fleshed out supporting cast, and homelife (and, admittedly, he was "my original" Hawkman). That said, I liked each of them, in their own worlds.

    Carter interested me in that he was the JSA's leader. That somewhat surprised me back in the early 1970s, when Superman always seemed to get all the deference in JLA.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Midnight_v View Post
    oooohh... so confused...

    Went to look up the origins.... MORE CONFUSED! I thought it was one guy, multiple lives... but I guess its earth one/two type stuff? At this point I'm just voting for the hawk avatar, from kingdom come.

    Can't we just have them all be rolled into ONE concise story? Or is it just too far gone?
    Oh yeah, don't do that to yourself. You'll just hurt your brain.
    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    Actually, just after CoIE wasn't a big problem.

    It was when DC had the three-issue Hawkworld prestige series in 1989 (three years later) and decided to not only make that Katar Hol's new origin story, but also decided it occurred in the (then) present-time (ignoring they already had done a post-CoIE Katar Hol-Hawkman series)!
    The limited series was a good story, and really did no harm. IMO, the Hawkworld on-going was where DC broke the Hawks.

    It was a really, really bad idea, to set The Hawks arrival in the "now" of the continuity, and it was executed with absolutely no thought toward "then what?".

  8. #38
    Uncanny Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrNewGod View Post
    The limited series was a good story, and really did no harm. IMO, the Hawkworld on-going was where DC broke the Hawks.

    It was a really, really bad idea, to set The Hawks arrival in the "now" of the continuity, and it was executed with absolutely no thought toward "then what?".
    If DC had just decided to make the Hawkworld prestige limited series the "new" (post-CoIE) origin of Katar Hol but have it set back in the past, it would have been much simpler to make some small retcons that would fit in with all the other post-CoIE Hawkman stuff that had previously been published.
    The two-different Hawkmen and Hawkgirls/Hawkwomen stuff wouldn't have been a big problem going forward since the Golden Age versions had been removed to the never-ending Ragnarök soon after CoIE was finished (in the Last Days of the Justice Society Special from 1986).

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    But (not having read it) how well did it incorporate Carter Hall / Golden Age Hawkman?
    I though Venditti had limitations on that since the JSA-aspects haven't been revealed yet in Doomsday Cluck?
    Well, Carter Hall is the base template for Venditti's Hawkman. But the Thanagarian mythos still play a crucial role in the new origin, that is still being revealed.

    As far as the JSA aspects go, Venditti's run has pretty much sidestepped that. I haven't read Dark Metal yet...presumably that delves deeper into Carter's Rebirth history.

  10. #40
    Jewish & Proud Feminist Shadowcat's Avatar
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    Tim Truman intended to have the Hawkworld mini be set in Thanagar’s past, fortunately/unfortunately it was a smash hit, and DC shot itself in the foot. Ostrander and Truman did a wonderful job with what they were handed, unfortunately DC can’t help but sabotage itself.

    That said: Katar is my pick. Specifically the Truman/Ostrander Katar.
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  11. #41
    Savior of the Universe Flash Gordon's Avatar
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    I like both, tbh.

    Carter is much more interesting to me, creatively though. I love the Indiana Jones/Ancient Aliens adventures he could have.

  12. #42

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    Katar Hol. Though I prefer Shayera more. With the alien Hawks you get a whole world of characters to play with whereas with the reincarnation versions you just have these two characters and their past selves.


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  13. #43
    Jewish & Proud Feminist Shadowcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Venus View Post
    Katar Hol. Though I prefer Shayera more. With the alien Hawks you get a whole world of characters to play with whereas with the reincarnation versions you just have these two characters and their past selves.

    Hawkworld is especially poignant right now, especially concerning our current political and economic climate.
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  14. #44
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    I've always preferred Katar Hol, but at the same time, I understand how generic yet another alien is. That said, Thanagar does manage to have a pretty distinct identity unto itself.

    The Egyptian stuff just never really hooked me. This is really a sign of Hawkman's core problem. People are quite split on which is the better take on Hawkman so we keep getting both, or weird merger attempts. I guess this is a nightmare example of what can happen when no one person definitively owns an IP, so to speak, and stewardship of it keeps getting passed to different people.

  15. #45
    Fantastic Member mikelmcknight72's Avatar
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    Honestly, I like both a lot. I give a slight edge to Carter, both pre and post COIE. Classic JSA & pre-52 JSA both made great use of him, as did having a son in Infinity Inc. Personally, I thought the re-incarnation angle was a great thing. He's smart, but he's also a hot-tempered barbarian. The Nth metal gave him a tie to Thanagar in post-Crisis.

    On the other hand, I'm incredibly fond of Silver-Age/Satellite era Katar and Hawkworld Katar.

    I don't know which of them I read first, as JLA and All-Star Squadron/Infinity Inc were favorites as a kid. I've always had a great fondness for classic Earth 2 (Two?). Nevertheless, I was pleased when the JSA came out of their Ragnarok limbo and were incorporated into post-COIE present day.

    On a tangent, I do like having them on the main Earth. They are more likely to get used in crossovers, and the elder statesmen mentoring the new generation of heroes is great usage.

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