Should Spider-Man be a dad?

[Miles To Go]

Where does it stop? Does the baby became a toddler? A grade schooler? A teenager? An adult? Does Peter become a pensioner?

You'll be long dead before that happens, why should you care?

[MajorHoy]

. . . Does Peter become a pensioner?

Probably not since that term isn't quite as common here in the U.S. as it is in places like Britain/the U.K.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

That doesn't take younger readers and future generations into account.

Young people will like Spider-Man at any age and for the exact same reasons his first audience did.

[Lee]

You'll be long dead before that happens, why should you care?

With that attitude, why should anyone care about anything left behind to future generations? Why make a will? Why try to curb global warming?

At which point in the scenario do you imagine I will die? At what pace is Peter Parker's kid going to age?

Young people will like Spider-Man at any age and for the exact same reasons his first audience did.

I liked him because I was a kid and he was younger and more relatable in a way Superman and Batman and Captain America weren't.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

I liked him because I was a kid and he was younger and more relatable in a way Superman and Batman and Captain America weren't.

I liked him because he was married and preferred the company of his wife rather than little boys unlike Adam West's Batman and Didn't lie and gaslight his girlfriend. And besides the bestselling Spider-Man comics have a married spider-man. Likewise Lee Romita's college Peter outsold by several times ditko's high school Peter. In 616 sales increased whenever Peter advanced and aged.

Peter was still older than you right? He wasn't the same age you are.

And ask yourself is Peter the major teenage hero of this generation? No it's Harry Potter. And Harry grows up from baby to dad of three. More recently you have Katniss Everdeen. Peter will never again be the great teenage hero he was once. Teen culture has changed. Going kids are more sophisticated. They like game of thrones and stuff that plays for keeps.

[MASTER-OF-SUPRISE]

I say yes. It can and has been done well before. Now there is a possibility that marvel can royally screw it up. However I think that with the right creative team it can be done very well. Honestly I find the idea that heroes can't be relatable because of thier relationship status to be obsolete and unimaginative.

I personally think trying to keep him as the fsce of youth is only going to make him less and less relevant and interesting. Now I'm sure not everyone will agree with that but I think a character that shows growth will have much more sustainability. Besides eventually we will reach 2099 Then what do ya do?

[Lee]

I liked him because he was married and preferred the company of his wife rather than little boys unlike Adam West's Batman and Didn't lie and gaslight his girlfriend. And besides the bestselling Spider-Man comics have a married spider-man. Likewise Lee Romita's college Peter outsold by several times ditko's high school Peter. In 616 sales increased whenever Peter advanced and aged.

Peter was still older than you right? He wasn't the same age you are.

And ask yourself is Peter the major teenage hero of this generation? No it's Harry Potter. And Harry grows up from baby to dad of three. More recently you have Katniss Everdeen. Peter will never again be the great teenage hero he was once. Teen culture has changed. Going kids are more sophisticated. They like game of thrones and stuff that plays for keeps.

Well, I guess I was wrong for liking what I liked. Thank you for proving that with science. What issue will Spider-Man end?

[MajorHoy]

Well, I guess I was wrong for liking what I liked. Thank you for proving that with science. What issue will Spider-Man end?

Do you mean permanently or when will it end again so it can be relaunched with a new "#1 ISSUE!" and a gazillion meaningless variant covers?

[Zeitgeist]

Reed Richards and Sue Storm are not an acceptable substitute for Peter/MJ contrary to what others say.

But making Peter a substitute for them is?

The question is, is it in character for Peter to want to get married? The answer is yes, he has always been "the marrying kind" and "the forever guy". He thought about marrying Betty Brant, then Gwen, proposed to MJ, pictured a future with Felicia, and so on. Does Peter want children, yes?

Has it been in character for Bruce Banner want to rid himself of The Hulk? For Professor X to see peace between humans and mutants? For Thanos to have all of the infinity stones? Just because a character has generalised goals, doesn't mean they need to be realised, especially in terms of narrative.

and expected since Peter is the guy who grows up and grew up.

He hasn't grown up any more than any other character has in the 616 and it's sliding scale.

Most of their children have been written out of their active lives. I wonder why that is.

Heh.

That doesn't take younger readers and future generations into account.

There's a possessiveness at play here that sadly doesn't care about that. The toys always go back in the box, it's a well established mainstream comic book trope everyone knows - but in this case for some reason, some people just doesn't want it to apply.

[Zeitgeist]

And ask yourself is Peter the major teenage hero of this generation? No it's Harry Potter. And Harry grows up from baby to dad of three.

Harry becomes a dad of three... in the final epilogue of his 7 book series. It's literally the end of his tale.

[Lee]

Harry becomes a dad of three... in the final epilogue of his 7 book series. It's literally the end of his tale.

Yep, and it's the same for most YA literature. The teenage lead can get older and learn life lessons, but once they become fully realised adults the story ends. The author has ownership of the IP and characters, and future revenue comes from keeping those 3 or 4 or 7 novels in print for as long as possible, always aimed primarily at the teenage demographic.

Marvel Comics' model of business is completely different. The company owns the characters and they sell new stories every week, as they have been doing for decades now.

A kid can become a Harry Potter fan, buy the 7 novels and get the complete and consistent story of the character growing up.

With Spider-Man, it's nigh-on impossible for a new fan to read the entire saga of Peter Parker's life. Even if Marvel finished its Amazing Spider-Man Epic Collection book series and kept it all in print, the reader would miss out on important developments and new character introductions that happened in Spectacular Spider-Man, Web of Spider-Man and Marvel Team-Up. Even if Marvel made every Spider-Man comic available digitally, they'd need a thorough reading order guide... and that would be tricky because issues of Amazing/Spectacular often didn't slot in neatly between each other, there was a lot of continuity overlap, sometimes even contradictions. Then there's all the changes in tone and language and setting and art style to contend with, not to mention the retcons, dated real world events, abandoned plot threads and sudden changes in charcterisations. Imagine if the first Hunger Games book was written by Stan Lee and the last was written by Nick Spencer.

So Marvel isn't really in the business of selling readers a complete saga with a beginning, middle and end. They're in the business of selling:

A. Their current product.
B. A curated selection of perennials from the back catalogue.

The current product needs to always stay appealing to the demographic they're targeting, to the newcomers and future generations. They can't count on everyone going back to read decades old comics in order to appreciate what's being done in the current product. The current product has to stand on its own.

[Jonathangoop1811]

You all forget that there is a simple way to solve this discussion, Spider-Man: Life Story is going to be about some of the greatest stories of Spider-Man in each decade, with Peter aging at a normal pace, which means that he is bound to become a father, in the solicitations of issues #3 it was mentioned that he had a family now, that might be his wife and child, so now hopefully we will se him with his family, perhaps even see his son become Spider-Man, we will have to wait and see.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

But making Peter a substitute for them is?

No it won't for a variety of numerous reasons. The Fantastic Four have never been a top-selling title since the 70s when the X-Men dethroned them and unlike the Avengers who did it with events like House of M, the X-Men did it fair and square, by popularity, word-of-mouth, zeitgeist.

And in any case, Peter does admire Reed Richards a great deal, that goes back to the earliest stories, so unconsciously he would model himself on Reed, more logically than Tony IMHO. Reed grew up in modest middle-class house and became the greatest scientist of the Marvel universe. If you are a young kid from Queens starting out in science, who is your logical role model...the guy who did it all by himself (Reed) or the guy born with a silver spoon (Tony).

Has it been in character for Bruce Banner want to rid himself of The Hulk? For Professor X to see peace between humans and mutants? For Thanos to have all of the infinity stones? Just because a character has generalised goals, doesn't mean they need to be realised, especially in terms of narrative.

In terms of overall series goal, those aren't comparable. Peter's overall goal is to keep people safe from danger, and protect his friends and loved ones. His main problem is trying to balance and navigate between the greater good, the general good, and the more immediate personal good. That remains constant and unchanging, and indeed reinforced when Peter gets married or hypothetically becomes a father. After all for Peter to protect friends and loved ones...he needs friends and loved ones to start with.

And in any case, Thanos did get all the Infinity Stones in The Infinity Gauntlet, and then after being a God for a while gets bored and subconsciously allows himself to be punk'd and retires for a while. Professor X did see peace on occassions, and then he got power-mad with Onslaught, enslaved by the Danger Room, got killed and nobody cares what Prof. X wanted anymore. And Bruce Banner and Hulk have separated, most famously in John Byrne's run. It has happened in comics. Creating an active character goal is better on the whole. Alan Moore took Swamp Thing, a character trapped in a doomed attempt to reclaim his humanity and said he was never human to start with. Resolving and providing catharsis and resolution to his original goal and then reconfiguring him into a more dynamic and effective character. Alan Moore has always expressed hatred, and indeed contempt, for "the illusion of change".

He hasn't grown up any more than any other character has in the 616 and it's sliding scale.

He's grown up more than the FF. In the FF, Johnny Storm is always the young goofball, Reed Richard has always been late-30s, pushing 40, The Thing is ageless. Susan Storm is more ambiguous, but I am guessing about a 10-7 years younger than Reed. The arrival of the kids pushed that back and forth, but Reed isn't pushing 50 or anything.

Peter grew up from 15 to 20 in the Lee-Ditko Era, and from 20 to around 23 when he got married. And then he became slightly older as time passed. JMS wrote him late-20s, around 27 or 28. And in any case, Peter was always written to be older than his years. Post-OMD has locked Peter in mid-20s. Which means that at the very least a full decade of 10 comics years has passed in his life.

Harry becomes a dad of three... in the final epilogue of his 7 book series. It's literally the end of his tale.

He grows older in each and every book, one book shows one year. And now there's a play showing him as a Dad. Teeenagers these days like protagonists who grow up and don't stay teenage for long.

The current product needs to always stay appealing to the demographic they're targeting, to the newcomers and future generations. They can't count on everyone going back to read decades old comics in order to appreciate what's being done in the current product. The current product has to stand on its own.

But it does not stand on its own. The primary audience for 616 Spider-Man are older readers, as is the case for all superhero comics. Spider-Man Comics in the Dan Slott and even the Nick Spencer era are not teen or child friendly. Spider-Man is definitely "your Dad's or your Uncle's comics", that "60s cartoon, that 90s cartoon, this old Sega game and so on". He is an old character and there's nothing lamer for a teenager than a teenage character from the old days.

In general whenever Marvel tried to do high school Spider-Man in comics again, they failed with Ultimate Spider-Man being the crowning exception. Untold Tales of Spider-Man was critically acclaimed and didn't do too badly, but it was too continuity heavy and depended on some familiarity with the Lee-Ditko era. The John Byrne Chapter One series crashed and burned. USM was the exception because 1) You had Brian Michael Bendis. 2) It basically combined and streamlined the familiar stuff from Spider-Man's college and adult days to his teenage self. So Teenage Peter and Teenage MJ are already future soulmates in the high school era. As someone who read USM from around 2002-2003, I can tell you that Bendis' Teenage Peter felt pretty consistent to the Adult Peter in JMS'. Even if it was not in continuity, a reader could broad-strokes that Peter growing up into being JMS' Peter and it felt in-synch.

Spider-Man Homecoming which had teenage high school Peter didn't make as much money as Raimi's Spider-Man Trilogy, even Spider-Man 3, which showed a Peter aging from teenager to adult. It was also outperformed significantly by Black Panther. And MCU Spider-Man had Tony Stark in a major supporting role unlike Black Panther who was totally solo for the entirety of the runtime (barring a winter soldier cameo in the credits).

So there's nothing inherent about teenage Spider-Man that is appealing to demographics or lasting. Spider-Man would never have become the icon he is if he remained a teenage high schooler forever. He will never be as important to teenagers of this generation as Harry Potter. He can only be himself, which means he should grow up.

[Snoop Dogg]

Reed and Sue are around the same age when they both met in college.

If Spider-Man had a baby who functioned as a non-character that would have to be a little baby for years and years while Spider-Man books were always in publication, rapidly shipping with perhaps even satellite books, someone would find a way to write them out of the book.

[Lee]

He grows older in each and every book, one book shows one year. And now there's a play showing him as a Dad. Teeenagers these days like protagonists who grow up and don't stay teenage for long.

And the Harry Potter novels ended with his final year of school. In most YA fiction with a teenage protagonist, the series concludes when (or before) they reach adulthood.

But it does not stand on its own. The primary audience for 616 Spider-Man are older readers, as is the case for all superhero comics.

If you don't think Marvel Comics should be approachable for newer readers, for kid/teenage readers, then we're looking at the situation through entirely different lenses.

But for Marvel Comics, as a periodical comics publishing business, it's in their best interest to do everything they can to bring in new generations of readers.

Spider-Man is definitely "your Dad's or your Uncle's comics", that "60s cartoon, that 90s cartoon, this old Sega game and so on". He is an old character and there's nothing lamer for a teenager than a teenage character from the old days.

This is out of touch with reality. Spider-Man is a hugely popular character and brand with the youth audience.

So there's nothing inherent about teenage Spider-Man that is appealing to demographics or lasting. Spider-Man would never have become the icon he is if he remained a teenage high schooler forever. He will never be as important to teenagers of this generation as Harry Potter. He can only be himself, which means he should grow up.

All of the Spider-Man movies have starred a Spider-Man who was a high school or college student. Most of the animated TV shows have portrayed Spider-Man as a high school or college student. That's a long legacy.

But let's say Spider-Man is more successful as the grown up in the room and sales would sky rocket if he had a kid. How should Marvel handle Ms Marvel? Runaways? Young Avengers? Squirrel Girl? How do they handle any of their IPs aimed directly at teen/YA audiences? Is it worth making Kamala Khan and the Runaways 30 year olds just so Spider-Man and Norah Winters can have a 13 year old son? Or does the kid remain a baby forever?