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  1. #106

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    Quote Originally Posted by Twickster View Post
    Ares diddn't seem the brickiest of bricks though. At the very least, I don't recall any significant durability feats from him.
    Wonder Woman ground and pounded him after Steve died and he was kinda "meh" from it as he kicked her off. He seems in the Aquaman/Diana/Steppenwolf range to me.

    Again that was point blank AoE though. At that range she has better options to use 9/10 times anyways.
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  2. #107
    Extraordinary Member The Drunkard Kid's Avatar
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    One correction: *Carol* is the experienced soldier here, not Diana, who has far more training, but relatively little known field experience and probably none of that as an actual soldier, unlike her opponent who has comparatively few years of training (because she has a human lifespan), but presumably years of experience as a non-frontlines pilot before she was allowed to work on Project Pegasus and then enough time training with her new powers to be integrated into StarForce, what seems to be the Special Forces equivalent of a highly militant space race and somewhere less than six years of participating in actually military operations with them.

  3. #108
    Extraordinary Member The Drunkard Kid's Avatar
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    I'm not really all that comfortable using it as a reflex speed considering how the MCU often doesn't really seem to get how fast ordinance that aren't bullets should actually be traveling, but technically speaking, Carol did stop that missile in less time than it took for the following missiles to catch up to it, then threw that missile into the still-accelerating missiles before they could reach her, against the thrusters of the missile that she was holding.

  4. #109
    Cruel and Unusual Twickster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Arbiter View Post
    Wonder Woman ground and pounded him after Steve died and he was kinda "meh" from it as he kicked her off. He seems in the Aquaman/Diana/Steppenwolf range to me.

    Again that was point blank AoE though. At that range she has better options to use 9/10 times anyways.
    I'm not saying he's not durable, but taking some hits from WW, specifically without a sword (which magnifies Diana's damage output considerably), isn't beyond say Aquaman. Certainly not enough to consider him in the upper echelons of durability like Superman or Doomsday.

  5. #110

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    Quote Originally Posted by Twickster View Post
    I'm not saying he's not durable, but taking some hits from WW, specifically without a sword (which magnifies Diana's damage output considerably), isn't beyond say Aquaman. Certainly not enough to consider him in the upper echelons of durability like Superman or Doomsday.
    Yeah, Aquaman, SW and Diana herself is exactly where I put him in the post you quoted. I don't think I argued DD level?
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  6. #111

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Drunkard Kid View Post
    I'm not really all that comfortable using it as a reflex speed considering how the MCU often doesn't really seem to get how fast ordinance that aren't bullets should actually be traveling, but technically speaking, Carol did stop that missile in less time than it took for the following missiles to catch up to it, then threw that missile into the still-accelerating missiles before they could reach her, against the thrusters of the missile that she was holding.
    They dont look super fast in the scene, comparative to their size and how fast they are catching up to Carol wrestling the thing, so I'm choosing to ignore that as just regular Hollywood missile stuff and keeping it as the strength feat they intended.

    Adding math to the relative velocities of the things based on on screen appearances probably doesn't do her any favors is my point. Easier to stick to the strength stuff imo
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  7. #112
    Astonishing Member Captain Morgan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Drunkard Kid View Post
    One correction: *Carol* is the experienced soldier here, not Diana, who has far more training, but relatively little known field experience and probably none of that as an actual soldier, unlike her opponent who has comparatively few years of training (because she has a human lifespan), but presumably years of experience as a non-frontlines pilot before she was allowed to work on Project Pegasus and then enough time training with her new powers to be integrated into StarForce, what seems to be the Special Forces equivalent of a highly militant space race and somewhere less than six years of participating in actually military operations with them.
    I don't really think that is relevant. Diana had a century between appearances, and it is extremely unlikely she wasn't actively dealing with conflict in that time.

    Carol, by comparison, spent 6 years having her true potential suppressed and honing a skill set that became obsolete once she started flying and unleashing giant waves of energy. She's not gonna win at close quarters; she needs to stay away and blast.

    But experience isn't really a relevant metric for rumbles. Wolverine has more experience than Dare Devil, but he is no where near as skilled.

  8. #113
    Mighty Member moonknight11's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Drunkard Kid View Post
    I'm not really all that comfortable using it as a reflex speed considering how the MCU often doesn't really seem to get how fast ordinance that aren't bullets should actually be traveling, but technically speaking, Carol did stop that missile in less time than it took for the following missiles to catch up to it, then threw that missile into the still-accelerating missiles before they could reach her, against the thrusters of the missile that she was holding.
    She also dodges Kree lasers after they've been fired (and then gets tagged by a few). Her reflexes are decent enough to be high in the air before Diana clears the starting distance imo.

  9. #114

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    Quote Originally Posted by moonknight11 View Post
    She also dodges Kree lasers after they've been fired (and then gets tagged by a few). Her reflexes are decent enough to be high in the air before Diana clears the starting distance imo.
    So, to be clear, you are forwarding the idea that zipping around and dodging sub light generic weapons in a space dog fight gives you bullet timing + reflexes?
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  10. #115
    Extraordinary Member The Drunkard Kid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Arbiter View Post
    So, to be clear, you are forwarding the idea that zipping around and dodging sub light generic weapons in a space dog fight gives you bullet timing + reflexes?
    Moonkniht11's post seems to more be forwarding the idea that zipping around and dodging sub light generic weapons in a space dog fight gives you reflexes fast enough to activate your hypersonic travel speed power before a person with sub bullet travel speed can run approximately 100 feet to use their bullet timing + reflexes in melee.

  11. #116

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Drunkard Kid View Post
    Moonkniht11's post seems to more be forwarding the idea that zipping around and dodging sub light generic weapons in a space dog fight gives you reflexes fast enough to activate your hypersonic travel speed power before a person with sub bullet travel speed can run approximately 100 feet to use their bullet timing + reflexes in melee.
    She doesn't appear to have reflexes any faster than say, Peter Quill or most other MCU characters is my thing. Dodging blasts in a space battle is standard sci fi stuff. Like many many people have managed her feats in larger space ships (Millenium Falcon, Star Lords ship etc).

    I think Diana can cross 100' in the 1 second or so time frame of Carol gathering her aura and taking off. Mileage obviously varies here, but I think she's got the feats for it personally.
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  12. #117
    My Face Is Up Here Powerboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Arbiter View Post
    She doesn't appear to have reflexes any faster than say, Peter Quill or most other MCU characters is my thing. Dodging blasts in a space battle is standard sci fi stuff. Like many many people have managed her feats in larger space ships (Millenium Falcon, Star Lords ship etc).

    I think Diana can cross 100' in the 1 second or so time frame of Carol gathering her aura and taking off. Mileage obviously varies here, but I think she's got the feats for it personally.
    Shades of the Six Million Dollar Man and the Bionic Woman. Slow motion messes us up again. In other words, the slow motion can be great artistically but it really messes with us on Rumbles trying to estimate how fast someone really is. When it comes to bullets, it's different because we have a solid idea of how fast they are. But running speed is another matter. In fact, it's worse than TSMDM and TBW because at least with them we have repeated statements that it's sixty miles per hour.
    Power with Girl is better.

  13. #118

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    Quote Originally Posted by Powerboy View Post
    Shades of the Six Million Dollar Man and the Bionic Woman. Slow motion messes us up again. In other words, the slow motion can be great artistically but it really messes with us on Rumbles trying to estimate how fast someone really is. When it comes to bullets, it's different because we have a solid idea of how fast they are. But running speed is another matter. In fact, it's worse than TSMDM and TBW because at least with them we have repeated statements that it's sixty miles per hour.
    Which slow motion sequences did you have in mind?
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  14. #119

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    It should also be noted that Superman's best strength feat is probably not the apartment or the ship, but instead his casual dismissal of Arthur, Diana and Cyborg actively trying to restrain and subdue him simultaneously.

    Especially Arthur. He wrestles Arthur to a complete standstill while casually holding Diana. Neither are able to break his grip or particularly budge him. This is important because Arthur is just stupid strong.

    Normally, I'm not huge on calculations, but since we've decided to throw them around for Carol's sake, I have no problem giving the others the same treatment.

    Arthur's submarine feat is ridiculous. Factoring in the mass of the sub, the drag (friction) and weight of displaced water and the relative speeds he accomplishes the feat, the calculations show he lifts about 500k tons.
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  15. #120
    My Face Is Up Here Powerboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Arbiter View Post
    Which slow motion sequences did you have in mind?
    I don't remember specifically, just that some of Wonder Woman's speed feats, especially running, were in slow motion.
    Power with Girl is better.

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