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  1. #1
    Astonishing Member DochaDocha's Avatar
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    Default Justice League vs. Fatal Five (Spoilers, I guess)

    Just got around to watching this movie. It borrows many designs from JLU, and even brings back the old cast (Conroy, Newbern, Eisenberg, etc.). However, it doesn't really feel like it's in continuity with JLU and the rest of the DCAU in the sense that there are no callbacks to Supergirl's joining the Legion, no references to the Legion's first appearance in the DCAU (meeting teenage Clark Kent in Smallville), and I think they changed some of the designs of the Legion members (though Emerald Empress looks similar).

    Anyone else see this? As for me, I'm a bit disappointed in the lack of Superfamily connection to the Legion. Also, it kind of follows the formula of a lot of recent Justice League movies: the team can't really do much to save the day, so the movie's main characters have to step up, which I'm not too fond of.

    Overall, it felt like a 4-part JLU episode: interesting, but not necessarily something I'd be happy to have paid $20 for.

  2. #2
    Extraordinary Member Robotman's Avatar
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    One of my biggest issues with the movie was Kal having no knowledge of the Legion. Not only are the LoS a big part of the Superman lore but he has actually met them in the Bruce Timm continuity.

  3. #3
    Mighty Member Vordan's Avatar
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    It was ok but basically confirmed to me that I don’t really have much interest in seeing the DCAU again. It was fine for its time but I’ve moved on since then.

  4. #4
    AT EASE, LOO-SUH! Superlad93's Avatar
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    I dug the hell out of the movie, honestly.

    Didn't really mind that Superman didn't know the Legion. This seems to be only borrowing the style of classic Timm stuff rather than putting it in its actual continuity, and I'm cool with that since that continuity is pretty dang old, and they likely don't expect everyone watching this film to be so well-read on it.

    Speaking just on Superman in the film: I kind of loved him here. Clearly the most powerful, always looking out for civilians, almost comically matter-of-fact, dry wit, a clear pro, and smart. I would've loved more of him and Mr. Terrific science broing it up. That implied dynamic was fun. And the ending with the race to the sun and Star Boy's sacrifice were great.

    Side note: the one thing about the DCAU that always kept me coming back was the interpersonal stuff and the distinct and reasonable flaws of each hero. Its level of verisimilitude remains unmatched, imo. This film's two mains were super endearing because of the continuation of this trend. That said, I think more could've been done with Mr. Terrific and Miss M using the relatively little screen time they got. I'm fine with this move placing Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman in their sort of default state though. Though, it did lead to a slight feeling of dryness to their performances that wasn't present at their apex in JLU (recently found myself really appreciating what Timm and co were going for with Superman's mega arc. Makes me wish we got just one more season of Superman:TAS)

    I really, really, really wanna see them do Crisis on Infinite Earths in this style. Make it a two parter and take liberties. Similar to this film, I'd love to be a sort of spiritual companion to the classic DCAU.
    Last edited by Superlad93; 04-04-2019 at 10:36 AM.
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  5. #5
    Fantastic Member magha_regulus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robotman View Post
    One of my biggest issues with the movie was Kal having no knowledge of the Legion. Not only are the LoS a big part of the Superman lore but he has actually met them in the Bruce Timm continuity.
    That's pitiful! I haven't seen it yet, and don't think I'll like it based off of this fact. The Legion is one of my favorite concepts in comics specifically because of their ties to Superman. I can't get behind this direction. Not my cup of tea. Hopefully others enjoy it though.

  6. #6
    AT EASE, LOO-SUH! Superlad93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robotman View Post
    he has actually met them in the Bruce Timm continuity.
    Just wanna point out that the episode you're talking about Clark also gets his mind erased.

    And given that Mr. Terrific seems some what new to the team--if you really, really wanna put this in the DCAU continuity--so this is likely before JLU, thus Supergirl hasn't gone off with the Legion yet. So that means Clark would be the only one who has seen the Legion, but he wouldn't remember, and they likely won't remind him.

    In my opinion, not that big of a deal since it wasn't at all the aim of the film.
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  7. #7

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    I liked the movie, but didn't love it because it felt a little unfocused. Was this Jessica's movie? Miss Martian's? Star Boy's? None of the three was compelling.

    There were large parts where it was just Jessica Cruz, but I was never sold on her being the star or her character arc in learning to believe in herself. It was too pat and undersold.

    I don't understand why Miss Martian was in this movie. She didn't really get a wow moment, and we didn't need to see another young, insecure female.

    The plot was kind of basic: Fatal Five travels back to the present to free Emerald Empress and Validus from Oa. That's it.

    I did like Star Boy calling Jessica "Limelight." It's cute and would be a good superhero name for her in the comics.

  8. #8
    Astonishing Member DochaDocha's Avatar
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    I'm a fan of JLU, but I'm not a huge fan of the continuity itself, if that makes sense. So, if it's not in continuity with the series, I don't mind. That continuity is one that I don't care to see resurrected.

    I do think not making a strong tie-in between the Supers and the Legion is a missed opportunity. It almost feels like what's the point?

    I would also agree that the movie feels largely unfocused. Superman is kind of cool in the movie, in the sense that they give a lot of slight nods to how powerful he is, but he doesn't really do a lot.

  9. #9
    The Nature Boy AnakinFlair's Avatar
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    Having just watched this, I thought it was a very good story. My only real problem was Wonder Woman basically harassing Jessica into joining the League, just because she's the new Green Lantern on the block. No means no, Diana.

  10. #10
    Mighty Member Adekis's Avatar
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    Just finally got around to seeing it a few days ago.

    Couple things: I appreciated the attempt to focus on mental health, but I thought the way they did it could have used some work. Both Jessica and Thom had a moment I found extremely questionable. For Jessica, it was that her traumatic experience had happened three years ago, and Jessica brings up the prospect of medication, apparently the first time anyone has done so, to a comically unhelpful psychiatrist. For Thom, it was simply the premise that if he stopped taking his meds for long enough, they would stop working forever. Not for a while until the levels build back up in his blood or anything like that, just, forever. It's ludicrous. Also, if in the middle of a panic attack, not entirely convinced that Jessica's mere presence would help Thom to calm down, since, you know, they just met. That didn't bother me as much as the other two things I mentioned though. Oh yeah, and Wonder Woman attacking Jessica with a sword in order to get her to use her powers wasn't just a poor characterization for Diana, it was a tired cliche, and she should be far better than that. Thom and Jessica were otherwise really fun to watch, but their best scene was just when they ate fast food together.

    I felt like M'gann was really underused and was constantly getting knocked down by hits she should have been able to tank. Honestly, I didn't think she was used well enough to justify not bringing back J'onn J'onzz, a personal favorite of mine.

    Batman got too much focus. He was frequently callous and insensitive, reminding me of his worst moments in DCAU stories, without the redeeming warmth of his earlier BTAS appearances. Still, I don't mind Batman being kind of a douche on occasion, even though it's not necessarily my preference. My problem is that oh man, why is he given so much narrative primacy when there are so many other characters that I liked! Mr Terrific always needs more love, for example, and while he was awesome and fun in this movie, he just didn't have as much primacy in the narrative as I might have hoped.

    Superman was, contrary to my expectations, very solid! He didn't seem nerfed, he came across as strong, smart, funny, etc. He's not a top tier Superman, but I had low expectations and he exceeded all of them with flying colors. Awesome! And I loved his little "science bros" moment with Mr. Terrific as well. Just generally a very solid portrayal. His sarcastic reaction to Bruce assuming he's okay after being cut wide open was funny, but fails to reach the wonderful heights of Justice League Action, in which Superman's response to breaking his leg is positively cheerful! I'm a little disappointed about his lack of Legion knowledge. I didn't and still don't consider this movie to be truly in the DCAU, owing to Supergirl's notable absence in either present or future, so giving him a more classical awareness of the Legion would have been a nice touch, and a good way of expanding his role. That said, this movie doesn't want Superman to have a huge role, and I have to be okay with that - so I am.

    I do truly regret however both that Supergirl didn't make an appearance and that Lar Gand was in an animated movie, with Superman, and they don't so much as say hi to each other. Rats!

    Also, did anyone else feel like Thom's death was basically All-Star Superman's ending? Heck, it makes me want to see a crossover where Kal gets into the sun at the end of that story and finds Thom still there.
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  11. #11
    Obsessed & Compelled Bored at 3:00AM's Avatar
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    The continuity of this thing seems to be a merger of the JLU (which had a John and a Kyle/Hal hybrid) with the GL: TAS (which had Hal, Guy & was about to introduce John).

    I would have liked Superman to be more heavily involved in the Legion parts of the story, but I understand them not wanting to over-complicate an already complicated story by adding even more backstory into it. The Mr. Terrrific and Miss Martian stuff is already undercooked.

    It would have been nice to see Superman ask about Supergirl at least.

  12. #12
    Astonishing Member DochaDocha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adekis View Post
    Also, did anyone else feel like Thom's death was basically All-Star Superman's ending? Heck, it makes me want to see a crossover where Kal gets into the sun at the end of that story and finds Thom still there.
    I guess Superman only can save our sun when he's dying.

  13. #13
    Mighty Member Adekis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DochaDocha View Post
    I guess Superman only can save our sun when he's dying.
    Pretty annoying honestly. Wasn't there another animated movie where Superman flies up at the end to save the world from the sun and can't do jack? I feel like there was, but can't remember in a lot of detail.
    "You know the deal, Metropolis. Treat people right or expect a visit from me."

  14. #14
    Mighty Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adekis View Post
    Pretty annoying honestly. Wasn't there another animated movie where Superman flies up at the end to save the world from the sun and can't do jack? I feel like there was, but can't remember in a lot of detail.
    Might be thinking of Final Night where a Sun-Eater kills Sol and it takes Parallux Hal Jordan sacrificing himself to reignite it.

  15. #15
    Fantastic Member WalterO5james's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DochaDocha View Post
    I guess Superman only can save our sun when he's dying.
    actually, at least in the animated movie he says that if Lex hadn't overloaded him, Clark wouldn't have the power to save the Sun

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