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  1. #61
    duke's casettetape lemonpeace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by married guy View Post
    I enjoyed the character much more in Teen Titans than in Flash. I don't think Williamson got a real good grasp on the character and he definitely came across as the 'angry young teen'.
    That said, I'm not a huge fan of the character at all. He seems kinda superfluous when there's Wally AND Bart back in the DCU.
    I don't think it was a good move to bring back Bart honestly. it felt like one of those nostalgia trip moves because there is no role for him in the DC landscape as it stands now. I mean, sure he has a spot on Young Justice but Wallace has been filling the Kid Flash role for a minute now, Bart's not gonna be able to all of a sudden become the Kid Flash role that he was designed for. I guess they could co-exist, they're personalities are very different, but they'd need to figure out an angle for Impulse if Young Justice ever starts playing a role in the main DC landscape.
    THE SIGNAL (Duke Thomas) is DC's secret shonen protagonist so I made him a fandom wiki

    also, check out "The Signal Tape" a Duke Thomas fan project.

    currently following:
    • DC: Red Hood: The Hill
    • Marvel: TBD
    • Manga (Shonen/Seinen): One Piece, My Hero, Dandadan, Jujutsu Kaisen, Kaiju No. 8, Reincarnation of The Veteran Soldier, Oblivion Rouge, ORDEAL, The Breaker: Eternal Force

    "power does not corrupt, power always reveals."

  2. #62
    Astonishing Member Tzigone's Avatar
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    I can empathize with Wallace but there comes a point where it's not a matter empathy, it's a matter of maturity.
    Okay, but let's not forget he is, by definition, immature. Not grown (mature). Not an adult. He was 12 at first? He shouldn't react like a mature adult.

    The thing about immaturity in a character is that is can be done really well, with gradual growing up over years of issues. Or it can just be annoying. And, of course, different audiences can view the same character different ways.

    conflict on all sides feels forced and convoluted
    Certainly common in fiction.

  3. #63
    duke's casettetape lemonpeace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tzigone View Post
    Okay, but let's not forget he is, by definition, immature. Not grown (mature). Not an adult. He was 12 at first? He shouldn't react like a mature adult.

    The thing about immaturity in a character is that is can be done really well, with gradual growing up over years of issues. Or it can just be annoying. And, of course, different audiences can view the same character different ways.

    Certainly common in fiction.
    I mean maturity in regards to the storytelling, the conflict feels like what a teenager thinks conflict is. Wallace's supposed to be 15/16 years old, that's definitely old enough to have some form of emotional intelligence and use critical thinking skills. Just because it's commonly misused trope doesn't make it any less weak or detrimental to the character.
    THE SIGNAL (Duke Thomas) is DC's secret shonen protagonist so I made him a fandom wiki

    also, check out "The Signal Tape" a Duke Thomas fan project.

    currently following:
    • DC: Red Hood: The Hill
    • Marvel: TBD
    • Manga (Shonen/Seinen): One Piece, My Hero, Dandadan, Jujutsu Kaisen, Kaiju No. 8, Reincarnation of The Veteran Soldier, Oblivion Rouge, ORDEAL, The Breaker: Eternal Force

    "power does not corrupt, power always reveals."

  4. #64
    Astonishing Member Tzigone's Avatar
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    What's Wallace's current backstory regarding his relationship with the Wests when he was younger? I know originally (back when he was Rudolph's son), he seemingly didn't really have a relationship with West side of the family (outside Daniel) until he started living with Iris. But I don't know if that changed when his backstory changed.


    Also, in regards to Flash #75
    spoilers:
    I ask because of The Flash #75. Little Wallace showed up with Wally and Iris the day Wally met Barry and got powers. I haven't read everything with Wallace, but if his backstory has changed to make him more connected with the Wests at a younger age, I'm dying to know the details. Though I'm not really sure what age contact stopped in the first version of his history we were given. Just don't recall the details.
    end of spoilers

    EDIT: I did finally read the storyline from where Wallace found out that Daniel was his father and to where he found out Barry was Flash and Barry was lying to Iris. I found Wallace to be entirely reasonable in his immediate anger so far (haven't made it to issue #20 yet). Barry is lying to Iris, and it doesn't really keep her safer, so his excuse doesn't hold up. Barry is out of character in keeping truth about Daniel from Wallace, perhaps (moreso in truth about parentage than the make nice with Daniel earlier), but that's a function of being hamstrung by Wallace's history actually changing because of he's a fictional character and it was a retcon. Plus, it's not like he hasn't lied before (do we need to talk about his originally keeping his identity secret or failing to tell Iris as he said he would when they married - sleep talking doesn't count, IMO). And frankly, there's a rather huge amount of projecting from Wallace, but that seems normal, if not desirable, given he's found out a huge part of his life has been lying and that the people he's cared for most have perpetuated it.

    I will say, during that time, I was unhappy with the Wallace-messes-up-and-Barry-is-critical instances. Reminiscent of Max/Bart (a dynamic I enjoyed), but circumstances and execution were very different, and it did neither character any favors.

    I'm not much for wishy-washy, mopey Barry, though, even though he has good reasons to be mopey. Why does everything have to be such an angst pit these days? Can't ever have things smooth and characters in a good more than three issues in a row, it seems.
    Last edited by Tzigone; 07-26-2019 at 03:39 AM.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tzigone View Post
    What's Wallace's current backstory regarding his relationship with the Wests when he was younger? I know originally (back when he was Rudolph's son), he seemingly didn't really have a relationship with West side of the family (outside Daniel) until he started living with Iris. But I don't know if that changed when his backstory changed.


    Also, in regards to Flash #75
    spoilers:
    I ask because of The Flash #75. Little Wallace showed up with Wally and Iris the day Wally met Barry and got powers. I haven't read everything with Wallace, but if his backstory has changed to make him more connected with the Wests at a younger age, I'm dying to know the details. Though I'm not really sure what age contact stopped in the first version of his history we were given. Just don't recall the details.
    end of spoilers

    EDIT: I did finally read the storyline from where Wallace found out that Daniel was his father and to where he found out Barry was Flash and Barry was lying to Iris. I found Wallace to be entirely reasonable in his immediate anger so far (haven't made it to issue #20 yet). Barry is lying to Iris, and it doesn't really keep her safer, so his excuse doesn't hold up. Barry is out of character in keeping truth about Daniel from Wallace, perhaps (moreso in truth about parentage than the make nice with Daniel earlier), but that's a function of being hamstrung by Wallace's history actually changing because of he's a fictional character and it was a retcon. Plus, it's not like he hasn't lied before (do we need to talk about his originally keeping his identity secret or failing to tell Iris as he said he would when they married - sleep talking doesn't count, IMO). And frankly, there's a rather huge amount of projecting from Wallace, but that seems normal, if not desirable, given he's found out a huge part of his life has been lying and that the people he's cared for most have perpetuated it.

    I will say, during that time, I was unhappy with the Wallace-messes-up-and-Barry-is-critical instances. Reminiscent of Max/Bart (a dynamic I enjoyed), but circumstances and execution were very different, and it did neither character any favors.

    I'm not much for wishy-washy, mopey Barry, though, even though he has good reasons to be mopey. Why does everything have to be such an angst pit these days? Can't ever have things smooth and characters in a good more than three issues in a row, it seems.
    Can't comment on issue #75 at the moment, sorry. spoilers:
    All I know is that, to the best of my remembrance, Wally, back in new 52 when he was Rudy's son and not Daniel's, didn't really have any connection with the Wests prior to moving in with Iris outside his then-Uncle Daniel. The story never elaborated on the precise circumstances that led to Iris taking care of Wally, and neither Wally's mom or Rudy were ever acknowledged, sans when it was told to us that Rudy was the dad. It's why the retcon was able to work so "smoothly", because that part of Wallace's past had yet to be expounded on. If this has changed, it'd have to be super recent, 'cause the only big blatant Rebirth change, aside from their now being two Wallys, was that Daniel was Wallace's dad and had just been pretending to only be an uncle.
    end of spoilers


    On the other part of your post, I appreciate the even-handed takeaway. I'm glad that I'm not the only person who see's Wallace's anger towards Barry as having been justified giving the circumstances. Also, I can see and agree how the "You're doing it wrong/reckless, and here's how/why" type of mentoring Barry had been giving Wallace during that time-frame may not have really worked giving their specific circumstances at the time. It's likely more an obligatory style of mentoring that usually works and encourages growth but that comes off as potentially feeling patronizing and even condescending. Barry comes off as overbearing (and perhaps even hypocritical) and Wally as slow and dumb (and potentially juvenile-ly immature in a "putting hand on hot stove repeatedly" kind of way). In their circumstance, this style wouldn't really do either much if any good.

    As for the "miserable" thing, that's part of the Rule of Drama. It helps give Barry distinctions to his character and personality and makes the story about how the goings-on affect him personally as much as about the villains and challenges he must face. It gives Barry (and others/etc.) a notable character arc that makes the story more fulfilling as the character arc progresses and evolves.

  6. #66
    Spectacular Member Grandmaster_J's Avatar
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    It gets higher and higher every issue.. Damn you, Chang.

    kf.jpg

  7. #67
    Spectacular Member Modamy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grandmaster_J View Post
    It gets higher and higher every issue.. Damn you, Chang.

    kf.jpg
    It's like a goddamn running gag at this point.

  8. #68
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    Thoughts on this redesign by Marcus Williams?



    I think it looks cool. IMO, adding a full helmet and the Young Justice goggles would take it up a notch.

    If he sticks around, I'd like to see him stick with a predominantly gold/yellow costume. Not really a common costume color for heroes.
    Last edited by SecretWarrior; 11-21-2019 at 09:47 AM.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by SecretWarrior View Post
    Thoughts on this redesign by Marcus Williams?



    I think it looks cool. IMO, adding a full helmet and the Young Justice goggles would take it up a notch.

    If he sticks around, I'd like to see him stick with a predominantly gold/yellow costume. Not really a common costume color for heroes.
    Oh I definitely like this design. I prefer it to the current design to be honest, though my favorite to this day is still that grey and red he originally start with. That was my favorite design to date.

  10. #70
    Spectacular Member Grandmaster_J's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SecretWarrior View Post
    Thoughts on this redesign by Marcus Williams?



    I think it looks cool. IMO, adding a full helmet and the Young Justice goggles would take it up a notch.

    If he sticks around, I'd like to see him stick with a predominantly gold/yellow costume. Not really a common costume color for heroes.
    I wouldn't mind goggles but not so much a helmet, the lightning bolt in his hair should remain visible to me. The rest of the costume is good, much more mixing of the yellow n red. The upper chest looks nicely armored up.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by leo619 View Post
    Oh I definitely like this design. I prefer it to the current design to be honest, though my favorite to this day is still that grey and red he originally start with. That was my favorite design to date.
    Which design do you refer to? My fave will always be his original Black, Red, and Silver (is that Silver the Grey you referred to?) he had as Future's End Flash, because of how iconic and unique it was.

    That said, I like this. More than the standard nostalgic Kid Flash wear he has now, I appreciate the, in my opinion, better balanced Yellow to Red ratio this has. Heck, the Yellow actually does look more a Gold, and I would like to have that for the costume in general.
    Last edited by J. D. Guy; 12-14-2019 at 02:35 PM.

  12. #72
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SecretWarrior View Post
    Thoughts on this redesign by Marcus Williams?



    I think it looks cool. IMO, adding a full helmet and the Young Justice goggles would take it up a notch.

    If he sticks around, I'd like to see him stick with a predominantly gold/yellow costume. Not really a common costume color for heroes.
    The red around the crotch is weird. Unless it doesn't stand out if he's standing still.

    The shoulder pads are a bit too much. And I prefer yellow boots.

    I dunno. I think the colors are better balanced on the normal Kid Flash look. This feels a little all over the place.

  13. #73
    Uncanny Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemonpeace View Post
    I don't think it was a good move to bring back Bart honestly. it felt like one of those nostalgia trip moves because there is no role for him in the DC landscape as it stands now. I mean, sure he has a spot on Young Justice but Wallace has been filling the Kid Flash role for a minute now, Bart's not gonna be able to all of a sudden become the Kid Flash role that he was designed for. I guess they could co-exist, they're personalities are very different, but they'd need to figure out an angle for Impulse if Young Justice ever starts playing a role in the main DC landscape.
    Bart's problem will be when the other speedsters come back. Especially if Wally gets his kids back, considering his daughter Irey is also using the Impulse identity. I guess they'd have to share it. There's already THREE Flashes, so no big deal right?
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  14. #74
    Mighty Member Waterfall's Avatar
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    They can avoid this problem by not reintroducing the kids at all. So Bart stays as the only Impulse.

  15. #75
    Spectacular Member Modamy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SecretWarrior View Post
    Thoughts on this redesign by Marcus Williams?



    I think it looks cool. IMO, adding a full helmet and the Young Justice goggles would take it up a notch.

    If he sticks around, I'd like to see him stick with a predominantly gold/yellow costume. Not really a common costume color for heroes.
    I like the design. I don't think it really needs goggles or a helmet though. I'd just like a simple design that doesn't look like he's hiked his pants up above his belly button.

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