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  1. #121
    Mighty Member chamber-music's Avatar
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    I've never really been a fan of the idea that Avengers should just be made up of the most powerful characters. I feel what made the book work was the mix of line up. Characters with different powers, different personalities and backgrounds.

  2. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by chamber-music View Post
    I've never really been a fan of the idea that Avengers should just be made up of the most powerful characters. I feel what made the book work was the mix of line up. Characters with different powers, different personalities and backgrounds.
    Definitely. While I'm a big fan of some of the more powerful Avengers (Thor, Sersi, Moondragon, Monica Rambeau), I also like a lot of the powerless ones (Captain America, USAgent, Hawkeye, Swordsman, Black Widow) and the mid-tier ones (Wasp, Hank Pym, Machine Man, Living Lightning, Stingray).

    A well-written story should be able to find something useful for all levels of ability to contribute, just as it was Hawkeye who punked the Grandmaster in one of their more memorable encounters (after he'd demonstrated that he could curb-stomp heavy hitters like Thor and Iron Man with little effort).

    Too much in one direction or another, though, and it does feel weird. I remember one lineup with a bunch of mostly powerless sorts like Hawkeye and Echo, teamed up with Dr. Strange, and it felt like he was completely wrong for that group (and the writing wasn't up to the task, constantly nerfing his abilities to make the rest seem more relevant, and, in the process, making Earth seem ripe for picking by Dormammu or Shuma-Gorath, since the 'Sorcerer Supreme' had apparently forgotten how to do magic, but that's more a bad writing problem than anything else, as The Defenders regularly had people like Dr. Strange and the Silver Surfer standing alongside folk like Hellcat, and didn't feel the need to dumb down the Surfer or sorcerer's abilities...).

  3. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sutekh View Post
    Definitely. While I'm a big fan of some of the more powerful Avengers (Thor, Sersi, Moondragon, Monica Rambeau), I also like a lot of the powerless ones (Captain America, USAgent, Hawkeye, Swordsman, Black Widow)
    US Agent has Class 10 superhuman strength.

  4. #124
    Mighty Member chamber-music's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sutekh View Post
    Definitely. While I'm a big fan of some of the more powerful Avengers (Thor, Sersi, Moondragon, Monica Rambeau), I also like a lot of the powerless ones (Captain America, USAgent, Hawkeye, Swordsman, Black Widow) and the mid-tier ones (Wasp, Hank Pym, Machine Man, Living Lightning, Stingray).

    A well-written story should be able to find something useful for all levels of ability to contribute, just as it was Hawkeye who punked the Grandmaster in one of their more memorable encounters (after he'd demonstrated that he could curb-stomp heavy hitters like Thor and Iron Man with little effort).
    Yep

    I'm far more interested in stories in which the heroes are the underdog and have to overcome some large threat to win. If you have a team of just the most powerful characters than that takes the stakes out of the story unless the foe is someone they simply can't overpower to win or the heroes are just dumbed down to the point they are ineffective against villains (which happens a lot to really powerful heroes).

    Good hero vs villain battles can also be about strategy. There are characters with skills and abilities that make them capable of taking down more powerful foes in the right circumstances.

    There are good comic stories about characters like Iron Man, Doctor Strange, Mr Fantastic, ect outsmarting a villain that are equally as enjoyable as a old fashioned hero vs villain fight for me.

  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by chamber-music View Post
    Yep

    I'm far more interested in stories in which the heroes are the underdog and have to overcome some large threat to win. If you have a team of just the most powerful characters than that takes the stakes out of the story unless the foe is someone they simply can't overpower to win or the heroes are just dumbed down to the point they are ineffective against villains (which happens a lot to really powerful heroes).

    Good hero vs villain battles can also be about strategy. There are characters with skills and abilities that make them capable of taking down more powerful foes in the right circumstances.

    There are good comic stories about characters like Iron Man, Doctor Strange, Mr Fantastic, ect outsmarting a villain that are equally as enjoyable as a old fashioned hero vs villain fight for me.
    Hawkeye as the last Avenger standing against The Collector was always a fave of mine

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nomads1 View Post
    Well, Steve Rogers wasn't the Captaian America of the All-Winners Squad, so I'll go with the Invaders.

    Peace
    Oh, you mean The Spirit of '76. I think that only happens after Cap is presumed dead in 1945, so did he not serve on the team until that happened?

  7. #127
    Unapologetic Feminist Shadowcat's Avatar
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    Captain America
    Wasp
    Monica Rambeau
    She-Hulk
    Thor
    Iron Man
    Hank Pym
    Vision
    Hawkeye
    Scarlet Witch
    Quicksilver
    Wonder Man
    Beast
    Black Panther
    Captain Marvel
    Hercules
    Black Widow
    ::Favorite Characters::

    \Psylocke/ \Meggan/ \Karma/
    *Misty Knight* *Daredevil* *Luke Cage* *Spider-Woman*
    >Wasp<>Doctor Strange<>Scarlet Witch<>Brother Voodoo<
    {Avengers}{Fantastic Four}{Alpha Flight}{X-Men}

  8. #128
    Astonishing Member Nomads1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRay View Post
    Oh, you mean The Spirit of '76. I think that only happens after Cap is presumed dead in 1945, so did he not serve on the team until that happened?
    Not according to What If #4. That story, which is considered the only, I think, canonical What If story, shows that the AWS were formed after the disbanding of the Invaders, after Hitler's death, around the time Steve and Bucky were considered KIA. The American team was already formed with the Spirit of '76 and Fred Davis already standing in for Cap and Bucky. William Nasland, the Spirt of '76 was soon killed and Jeff Mace, once the Patriot, became the Captain America of the All-Winners Squad for the rest of its existence. Thus, Steve Roger's was the only Captain America of the Invaders, and he was never a member of the AWS.

    Peace

  9. #129
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    Not according to Wikipedia, which places Captain America on the Squad, at least when it was published under the Timely Comics banner.

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