Too Many Earth Lanterns...

[Frontier]

The first and most obvious is the literal hand of god, Spectre, calling him the greatest of Green Lanterns in issue 3 of Rebirth. Johns is very many things, but he is definitely not subtle. He gets called the greatest and best and blah blah more times over the course of Johns' run. Heck he even gets called the greatest BLACK Lantern at one point during that weird prophecy stuff. There was a solid decade of non stop Hal glorification and retcons to make up for Parallax.

I remember it being in Rebirth, promotion and in-universe, as well as a 2-3 more times after that and at the end of his run, but it didn't come off as non-stop to me. But to each their own.

(And, Idunno, it just feels like the kind of stuff to be expected of a Superhero story with your main character whether they be OG, Classic, or otherwise).

The problem is when you say all these characters are fundamentally worse than Hal forever and always because Hal is the best. That's just the bad kind of foundation for anyone but Hal. Which, I suppose, is the point. The point is to make Hal the foundation and make everyone derivative of him. Which I'm sure Hal centric fans are on board with.

This is not to say I don't love Hal Jordan. I just love positive, forward thinking progress more. That's always been my stance.

I'm a fan of Hal Jordan but I've never really seen any of the other Lanterns as lesser, because I'm fans of them too.

And that's been my experience with Hal fans on this board as well but obviously no one sect of a fandom is unanimous, either positively or negatively.

[Dred]

You don't see them as lesser but the entire franchise revolving around the ideal that Jordan is the greatest ever necessarily implies it. The status quo works in your favor if you're all on board the Hal Train. Saying Hal fans are totally peachy keen and happy about said stats quo is...I dunno, disingenuous? Easy for the rich to tell the poor everything's fine and things for them will get better, you know? They don't really think about the cost of supporting those other characters. When the ring was on the other finger it was anything but amicability, after all.

Let me put it this way, do you think they'd ever, ever do a GL Rebirth style anything with anyone but Hal? That is kind of what I'm talking about. Hal gets special treatment. He is said to be better and more important than everyone else at all times in all ways and DC treats him like that in and outside of the comic.

Though I do find your defense rather ironic given this is literally a thread about how there's too many GLs around. I wonder which Bored at 3:00 AM would pick to put at the top of their keeper's list.

[Bored at 3:00AM]

Though I do find your defense rather ironic given this is literally a thread about how there's too many GLs around. I wonder which Bored at 3:00 AM would pick to put at the top of their keeper's list.

The thread was created in order to not derail the Young Animal thread because Far Sector's introduction of another Earth GL, not because I think there's necessarily a problem with lots of them (aside from not enough comics being published to give everyone enough time in the spotlight).

Hal Jordan is absolutely at the top of my list of favorite GLs, though. For my money, he's got the best origin, the best supporting cast, and the best rogues gallery, on top of being from a long line of cocksure archetypes in the mold of Chuck Yeager, Captain Kirk, Han Solo and Indiana Jones. I'm obviously not alone in my love of the character, which is the main reason Hal gets used so much by creators and has such a devoted readership.

That doesn't mean that I think the other Earth GLs should be ignored or downplayed in favor of Hal, though. I didn't like when Kyle was editorially mandated as the only GL, so I wouldn't want DC to repeat that mistake again with any character. I started getting into GL when John was headlining the book, with Hal in a supporting role, Guy Gardner being reintroduced again and Alan Scott was off with the JSA, so I much prefer a bunch of Earth GLs than just one.

[Dred]

I think you kind of ducked my point there. The intent of this thread is that there are too many Earth GLs, correct? I remember earlier you talking about what chronic disenfranchisement to these non-Hal characters get, and here I am looking at a thread posted by a Hal fan who thinks we should have less Earth GLs and more aliens just like the good ol 1960s where the supporting GLs were aliens. I'm not sure if you were consciously making that allusion but it was rather obvious to me. This is the disefranchisement. Hal takes and gets so much and here we are debating on if he deserves more from the already treated as lesser characters. And people got mad at me for suggesting he might deserve less after a nonstop decade of the most support any GL has ever seen.

[j9ac9k]

I think you kind of ducked my point there. The intent of this thread is that there are too many Earth GLs, correct? I remember earlier you talking about what chronic disenfranchisement to these non-Hal characters get, and here I am looking at a thread posted by a Hal fan who thinks we should have less Earth GLs and more aliens just like the good ol 1960s where the supporting GLs were aliens. I'm not sure if you were consciously making that allusion but it was rather obvious to me. This is the disefranchisement. Hal takes and gets so much and here we are debating on if he deserves more from the already treated as lesser characters. And people got mad at me for suggesting he might deserve less after a nonstop decade of the most support any GL has ever seen.

That's debatable because when Kyle had the ring, no other ring-bearer was allowed to exist at the time. Kyle had a solo and was in the Big 7 JLA lineup.

Also, I think it's one thing to feel disenfranchised by what DC does with the characters since they have control over the stories, but a fan's opinion about what they want to see (even many fans' opinions) is more about discord within the fanbase.

[Dred]

That's debatable because when Kyle had the ring, no other ring-bearer was allowed to exist at the time. Kyle had a solo and was in the Big 7 JLA lineup.

Kyle was the only GL (well John got his ring back during Kyle's run but no one remembers that, as did Kilowog but that was a bit late in the process) but he was struggling with the role and to live up to expectations. Hal came back and, as mentioned earlier in this thread, has had a consistent narrative spun about how he is the absolute best GL ever of all time and everyone else looks up to him because he's so much the best (and that whole parallax thing was not his fault!!!). I believe the biggest and best narrative acclaim Kyle ever got was in JLA where Daniel/Dream said he would one day surpass Hal. Turns out he never did because Hal came back to knock him down a peg permanently. Go figure.

[j9ac9k]

Kyle was the only GL (well John got his ring back during Kyle's run but no one remembers that, as did Kilowog but that was a bit late in the process) but he was struggling with the role and to live up to expectations. Hal came back and, as mentioned earlier in this thread, has had a consistent narrative spun about how he is the absolute best GL ever of all time and everyone else looks up to him because he's so much the best (and that whole parallax thing was not his fault!!!). I believe the biggest and best narrative acclaim Kyle ever got was in JLA where Daniel/Dream said he would one day surpass Hal. Turns out he never did because Hal came back to knock him down a peg permanently. Go figure.

Despite how you feel about it, I seem to remember a lot of distrust of Hal when he came back, especially with the other Corps members who still blamed him. Kyle had to struggle to learn, but Hal had to struggle to regain the trust that he had lost. It's easy to see the stories from an emotional standpoint, but Hal wasn't touted as "the greatest" when Johns spent all that time focusing on Sinestro and how he had been "the greatest" before his downfall. Yes, Hal was getting the most support and the other GL's weren't getting as much, but most of them are GLs again because of "Rebirth." Maybe if you liked Guy more as Warrior you'd have an issue with Hal coming back, but Kyle as Torchbearer was a solo gig for a long time.

And Kyle did surpass Hal - Ion twice, White Lantern, went beyond the Source Wall ... even Hal admitted Kyle was the best ring-bearer.

[Frontier]

Let me put it this way, do you think they'd ever, ever do a GL Rebirth style anything with anyone but Hal? That is kind of what I'm talking about. Hal gets special treatment. He is said to be better and more important than everyone else at all times in all ways and DC treats him like that in and outside of the comic.

If a character needed it and their was a writer who cared about them? Sure.

(I don't really see it outside comics much to be honest. I mean, have you seen how Hal gets portrayed in other media sometimes? It's not exactly flattering ).

[j9ac9k]

I think you kind of ducked my point there. The intent of this thread is that there are too many Earth GLs, correct? I remember earlier you talking about what chronic disenfranchisement to these non-Hal characters get, and here I am looking at a thread posted by a Hal fan who thinks we should have less Earth GLs and more aliens just like the good ol 1960s where the supporting GLs were aliens. I'm not sure if you were consciously making that allusion but it was rather obvious to me. This is the disefranchisement. Hal takes and gets so much and here we are debating on if he deserves more from the already treated as lesser characters. And people got mad at me for suggesting he might deserve less after a nonstop decade of the most support any GL has ever seen.

I do think that those of us Hal fans who lived through "Emerald Twilight" have a bit of a "Depression Era" mentality, where no matter how much money you save, no amount of money will make you feel secure.

[Frontier]

I do think that those of us Hal fans who lived through "Emerald Twilight" have a bit of a "Depression Era" mentality, where no matter how much money you save, no amount of money will make you feel secure.

Then there was the era where GL:TAS got cancelled, the movie bombed, and Venditti first took over...not the brightest spot for Hal or the GL Franchise as a whole.

[j9ac9k]

Then there was the era where GL:TAS got cancelled, the movie bombed, and Venditti first took over...not the brightest spot for Hal or the GL Franchise as a whole.

Ugh - don't remind me. That was the first time I dropped "Green Lantern" since the Kyle days and the only time I avoided reading stories with Hal in them.

[Dred]

If a character needed it and their was a writer who cared about them? Sure.

(I don't really see it outside comics much to be honest. I mean, have you seen how Hal gets portrayed in other media sometimes? It's not exactly flattering ).

You're wrong. Characters like Wally prove the contrary. DC has their favorites and the fact that we're in a thread whose point us Hal deserves more than his own comic, TV show and movie compared to every other GL who had none of that is exactly my point. They say, well the movie is bad so he should get another one, or the show got cancelled after "just" one season so he should get another one, or Venditti's run was bad so it doesn't count. Oh, and my favorite, the others get the privilege of existing in Hal's comic so there's nothing to complain about.

I agree with the thread premise, but start with the guy who has a lion's share of the screen time and prioritization historically, recently, and in external media.

[Bored at 3:00AM]

I think you kind of ducked my point there. The intent of this thread is that there are too many Earth GLs, correct? I remember earlier you talking about what chronic disenfranchisement to these non-Hal characters get, and here I am looking at a thread posted by a Hal fan who thinks we should have less Earth GLs and more aliens just like the good ol 1960s where the supporting GLs were aliens. I'm not sure if you were consciously making that allusion but it was rather obvious to me. This is the disefranchisement. Hal takes and gets so much and here we are debating on if he deserves more from the already treated as lesser characters. And people got mad at me for suggesting he might deserve less after a nonstop decade of the most support any GL has ever seen.

Nope, you've completely misunderstood the point of my thread.

Here's the first post from this very thread, the relevant stuff will be bolded for you:

Rather than hijack the Young Animal thread further, I think it'd be better to give this topic its own thread since it seems to be something that a lot of people have plenty to say about.

Personally, I don't have a particularly big problem with introducing new Lanterns from Earth as long as these new characters are worth reading about. I'd like them to spread out where they are from a little more. Having all but one of them be from America is kinda narrow-minded, and telling about how little imagination most creators and readers have in terms of being able to connect to characters that aren't exactly like them.

Would Spock be a more interesting character if he was born and raised in Seattle instead of planet Vulcan? Would Luke Skywalker be easier to relate to if he was a farmboy from Arizona instead of Tatooine? Would the Guardians of the Galaxy be better if they were a bunch of &^% ups from America rather than outer space?

If you've got a great idea for yet another Lantern from Earth...fine, but why not take that character idea and make them an alien GL from a new world or a previously established one? Yeah, they'd probably get killed off by some other creator to prop up whatever latest Big Bad they've come up with, but isn't that preferable to them never getting used at all because there simply isn't a big enough readership to satisfy TEN different Green Lantern books?

If you want to discuss this, I am more than happy to, but you need to start reading what I am actually saying rather than debate some imaginary strawman you've constructed named Bored at 3:00AM. Thanks

[Bored at 3:00AM]

I believe the biggest and best narrative acclaim Kyle ever got was in JLA where Daniel/Dream said he would one day surpass Hal. Turns out he never did because Hal came back to knock him down a peg permanently. Go figure.

But Kyle did surpass Hal. He was the one who discovered the truth behind the Yellow Impurity. He was the one that brought Hal back. He was the one who combined the Emotional Spectrum and became the White Lantern.

So....how has Hal knocked Kyle down a peg?

[Bored at 3:00AM]

DC has their favorites and the fact that we're in a thread whose point us Hal deserves more than his own comic, TV show and movie compared to every other GL who had none of that is exactly my point.

What are you talking about? I started this thread and I can assure you that the point of this thread is none of this.

I am afraid you are arguing with yourself.