All Purpose News and Politics Thread Part IV: The Center Cannot Hold

[Tami]

Perhaps this instance was overkill, but, these days, better too much caution than not enough. You never know if some kid "just mouthing off" today might show up in class with a gun tomorrow.

If this was a one time incident, then simply being talked to by the principle or a school counselor might have been enough. The polic eshouldn't be called unless there is a clear danger, and bullies usualy have a pattern of behavior, not a spur of the moment one time action.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

The sad truth about the election in 2020 is that it's going to boil down to Trump vs. Not Trump, and people will not vote based upon improvements to our infrastructure, or improving the tax code that would help reduce the debt and help fund programs, or actually leaving the Middle East and not instigating conflicts in Syria or Iran, but instead whether you want to keep Trump around for Trump to do Trump things, or someone to bring back the American presidency to where it's background noise.

Keep bombing the middle east.
Keep fucking over the working class.
Keep putting immigrants in cages.
Keep trying regime change all over the world.

But don't bring it up as much.

[WestPhillyPunisher]

Bernie Sanders is still listed as an Independent.

I didn't know that. Maybe I'm wrong, but this sounds like a case of Sanders wanting to have his cake and eat it too. This is what makes liking the man for his politics a chore, especially when he pulls **** like this. But the Dems shoulder some of the blame as well, they shouldn't have let him in the race if he wasn't registered as a Democrat. Sadly, I can grasp why they did, they fear if Sanders runs solely as an Independent, he'd bleed votes away from the Dems who need all the support they can get. Still, after his recent health scare, just how active will Sanders be on the campaign trail from here on out? He was supposed to have been on that LGBTQ forum last night but begged off, how many more times will he have to do that, picking and choosing where he campaigns?

[Tami]

I didn't know that. Maybe I'm wrong, but this sounds like a case of Sanders wanting to have his cake and eat it too. This is what makes liking the man for his politics a chore, especially when he pulls **** like this. But the Dems shoulder some of the blame as well, they shouldn't have let him in the race if he wasn't registered as a Democrat. Sadly, I can grasp why they did, they fear if Sanders runs solely as an Independent, he'd bleed votes away from the Dems who need all the support they can get. Still, after his recent health scare, just how active will Sanders be on the campaign trail from here on out? He was supposed to have been on that LGBTQ forum last night but begged off, how many more times will he have to do that, picking and choosing where he campaigns?

I know his supporters would hate me making this comparison, but in this case Bernie is like Trump in that he could spend all his time at home and he'd still have a solid base of support.

If Bernie Sanders really wants to have a democrat defeat Trump, he should throw his support to Elizabeth Warren and back out for health reasons. The earlier he does this, the easier it will be for Sanders' hard core supporters to migrate to another candidate. Plus, they won't be blaming the Democrats for this. If Sanders stays in the race and loses the primary, there might be a backlash by his supporters, and many would even consider either not voting or voting for Trump.

[KNIGHT OF THE LAKE]

I didn't know that. Maybe I'm wrong, but this sounds like a case of Sanders wanting to have his cake and eat it too. This is what makes liking the man for his politics a chore, especially when he pulls **** like this. But the Dems shoulder some of the blame as well, they shouldn't have let him in the race if he wasn't registered as a Democrat. Sadly, I can grasp why they did, they fear if Sanders runs solely as an Independent, he'd bleed votes away from the Dems who need all the support they can get. Still, after his recent health scare, just how active will Sanders be on the campaign trail from here on out? He was supposed to have been on that LGBTQ forum last night but begged off, how many more times will he have to do that, picking and choosing where he campaigns?

If Sanders ran as an independent the question isn’t “will it give Trump an edge”, it is “will Trump win by such a large margin that we have an issue with claims of a mandate”.

The advantage to letting him run is that he does caucus and vote with the party and he attracts independents and far left voters who otherwise wouldn’t vote for generic democrat and you might retain some if they are engaged enough. Especially if it’s someone like Warren it Yang who could entice those voters of Sanders doesn’t win. Also in the off chance he does win, it’s still a Democratic President pushing the party agenda

To be fair though, Sanders was actually having the most active campaign, so him slowing down is more just him going back to the rest of the pack in activity at this point

[KNIGHT OF THE LAKE]

I know his supporters would hate me making this comparison, but in this case Bernie is like Trump in that he could spend all his time at home and he'd still have a solid base of support.

If Bernie Sanders really wants to have a democrat defeat Trump, he should throw his support to Elizabeth Warren and back out for health reasons. The earlier he does this, the easier it will be for Sanders' hard core supporters to migrate to another candidate. Plus, they won't be blaming the Democrats for this. If Sanders stays in the race and loses the primary, there might be a backlash by his supporters, and many would even consider either not voting or voting for Trump.

My theory is that he’s in it until the first three primary’s and whoever is solidly ahead between the two will drop out and support the others. Sanders was actively courting Warren to run against Hillary, I don’t think he’ll have an issue campaigning for Warren hard if it comes your

[Rosa Luxemburg]

I know his supporters would hate me making this comparison, but in this case Bernie is like Trump in that he could spend all his time at home and he'd still have a solid base of support.

If Bernie Sanders really wants to have a democrat defeat Trump, he should throw his support to Elizabeth Warren and back out for health reasons. The earlier he does this, the easier it will be for Sanders' hard core supporters to migrate to another candidate. Plus, they won't be blaming the Democrats for this. If Sanders stays in the race and loses the primary, there might be a backlash by his supporters, and many would even consider either not voting or voting for Trump.

Or, Warren can start running to Bernie's left and adopt his strategy of getting people involved in the political process beyond electoralism.

But it wouldn't really help her that much even if Sanders did drop out and endorse her. Voters aren't ideologically coherent.

The majority of Bernie's supporters have said that their second choice is Biden before Warren.

[PwrdOn]

The sad truth about the election in 2020 is that it's going to boil down to Trump vs. Not Trump, and people will not vote based upon improvements to our infrastructure, or improving the tax code that would help reduce the debt and help fund programs, or actually leaving the Middle East and not instigating conflicts in Syria or Iran, but instead whether you want to keep Trump around for Trump to do Trump things, or someone to bring back the American presidency to where it's background noise.

Pulling out of the Middle East isn't really such a great idea, as current events in Rojava are showing. The current quagmire in the Middle East is largely a problem that we created, or at least followed in the footsteps of the British and French in perpetuating, destabilizing the region, suppressing local movements, and propping up petty dictators that would serve our economic interests. But at this point, the problems have escalated to such a degree that we expend far more to stick around than we are able to extract, so there is a pretty broad consensus that we should at least be trying to get out eventually. However, it would also do quite a bit of harm to American power and prestige if we just left, since that would just leave the whole region in chaos, and we could hardly plausibly deny that all the tragedy that followed was not our fault.

At the end of the day, the interests of Middle Easterners are pretty much diametrically opposed to those of Americans, so no pro-American government will ever have anywhere near the kind of genuine public support it needs to maintain stability and control without relying heavily on American military and economic aid. By contrast, the Russia-Iran-Iraq-Assad-Hezbollah axis is a fairly unified and cohesive coalition and if this recent Turkish offensive manages to drive the bulk of the Kurds into their arms, then American influence in the region is more or less finished and we'd lose any pretense at being the good guys in all of this.

[worstblogever]

In some ways, I'm still undecided. I am more confident in who I don't want to vote for [and hope I'm not put in the position to have to choose between them and Trump] than I am about who I will vote for.

I lean towards Warren, but I want to look the other candidates over more carefully.

If Biden gets the nomination, I hope he chooses a VP that is much younger yet has solid political experience. Someone who can easily be seen as becoming President on their own some day.

As much as I like Stacy Abrams, I don't think she quite fits the bill as far as political experience. I'd rather he went with Cory Booker or Julián Castro or even Amy Klobuchar. Someone like them.

I'd have added Kamala Harris to that list, but I don't know if that burnt bridge between her and Biden can be mended.

Honestly, whomever wins the nomination... if it's not Castro...

PICK CASTRO AS VP.

[Tami]

Honestly, whomever wins the nomination... if it's not Castro...

PICK CASTRO AS VP.

My first two choices as V.P. are either Castro or Booker, depending on who wins the nomination.

[Tami]

[WestPhillyPunisher]

If Sanders ran as an independent the question isn’t “will it give Trump an edge”, it is “will Trump win by such a large margin that we have an issue with claims of a mandate”.

The advantage to letting him run is that he does caucus and vote with the party and he attracts independents and far left voters who otherwise wouldn’t vote for generic democrat and you might retain some if they are engaged enough. Especially if it’s someone like Warren it Yang who could entice those voters of Sanders doesn’t win. Also in the off chance he does win, it’s still a Democratic President pushing the party agenda

To be fair though, Sanders was actually having the most active campaign, so him slowing down is more just him going back to the rest of the pack in activity at this point

Yes, it looked like Sanders did have momentum until his health scare. That said, I hope he does take it easy, I lost my grandfather and uncle to catastrophic heart ailments, and I wouldn't wish that horror on my worst enemy, not even Trump.

[KNIGHT OF THE LAKE]

Yes, it looked like Sanders did have momentum until his health scare. That said, I hope he does take it easy, I lost my grandfather and uncle to catastrophic heart ailments, and I wouldn't wish that horror on my worst enemy, not even Trump.

He actually was steady and kinda stagnant while Warren was surging. As far as Trump, I’d prefer he lived to see what his legacy will be

[Jack Dracula]

Or, Warren can start running to Bernie's left and adopt his strategy of getting people involved in the political process beyond electoralism.

But it wouldn't really help her that much even if Sanders did drop out and endorse her. Voters aren't ideologically coherent.

The majority of Bernie's supporters have said that their second choice is Biden before Warren.

Do you have any source for that? Not being aggressive here, just skeptical.

[Theleviathan]

Warren's response in the video upthread is really good. She is a good conversationalist, akin to one of Obama's greatest strengths.