All Purpose News and Politics Thread Part IV: The Center Cannot Hold

[JackDaw]

The Opium Wars are relevant because they ended with the British running Hong Kong until 1997. That experience with the freedom to choose their own leaders is one of the forces behind the current unrest. Macau didn't revert back to Chinese control until 1999. The consequences of that thing which happened over 100 years ago are still reverberating to this day.

Like lots of other important things that happened long ago...


But you’re not pretending are you, that those events of long ago compel the present day Chinese government to treat Hong Kong protesters harshly today?

I honestly can’t remember the last time that any one on this thread commented positively on the influence of Western civilisation. It’s like the sketch “What have the Romans ever done for us” in Monty Python’s Life of Brian!!

But maybe, just maybe, The Industrial Revolution benefitted a few billion people?

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Trump seems to be admitting he's gonna get Impeached and knows Democrats in House have the votes it appears. Now its gonna turn to Moscow Mitch and the Senate. If the Republicans back this , what stops a Democrat when they get office in doing the same act ? They better realize they could be in a position where the Democratic President can do the same act and force them to back him.

Gonna be fun to see Mitch's head explode as he has to debate , is it better in short term to back this guy or is he a long term thinker because it could backfire down the line.

[PwrdOn]

Like lots of other important things that happened long ago...


But you’re not pretending are you, that those events of long ago compel the present day Chinese government to treat Hong Kong protesters harshly today?

I honestly can’t remember the last time that any one on this thread commented positively on the influence of Western civilisation. It’s like the sketch “What have the Romans ever done for us” in Monty Python’s Life of Brian!!

But maybe, just maybe, The Industrial Revolution benefitted a few billion people?

I hate to break it to you, but the initial wave of industrialization, while greatly beneficial to the countries that took part, had disastrous consequences for everyone else and largely created what we know of as the "third world." Not only did the advances in military technology allow European powers to colonize most of the world, the flood of cheap, mass produced goods destroyed local economies everywhere since traditional crafts could never compete with modern industrial processes. Many formerly advanced economies reverted to little more than strip mines for resource hungry Western industries, who then sold back the finished products to locals at massively inflated prices, helping to fund the vaunted middle class lifestyle.

This only really started to change when, after several abortive attempts, many of these third world countries finally succeeded in building up their own industrial capabilities, beginning with crude, dirty, and labor intensive factories but slowly moving up the value chain. Of course, this is also exactly the watershed event that we in the West constantly bemoan, since losing our grip on production naturally shifted the balance of wealth and power away from our workers and toward people we once considered hopelessly backward.

[WestPhillyPunisher]

I'm surprised Hammil isnt there tbh. Dude HATES Trump.

No mention of Jim Carrey either since he scorches Trump and the GOP regularly with his cartoons. Perhaps he’ll join the crew too.

[SquirrelMan]

Three House committee chairmen have sent Vice President Mike Pence a letter demanding documents as part of their ongoing impeachment inquiry.

[Gray Lensman]

I hate to break it to you, but the initial wave of industrialization, while greatly beneficial to the countries that took part, had disastrous consequences for everyone else and largely created what we know of as the "third world." Not only did the advances in military technology allow European powers to colonize most of the world, the flood of cheap, mass produced goods destroyed local economies everywhere since traditional crafts could never compete with modern industrial processes. Many formerly advanced economies reverted to little more than strip mines for resource hungry Western industries, who then sold back the finished products to locals at massively inflated prices, helping to fund the vaunted middle class lifestyle.

This only really started to change when, after several abortive attempts, many of these third world countries finally succeeded in building up their own industrial capabilities, beginning with crude, dirty, and labor intensive factories but slowly moving up the value chain. Of course, this is also exactly the watershed event that we in the West constantly bemoan, since losing our grip on production naturally shifted the balance of wealth and power away from our workers and toward people we once considered hopelessly backward.

Also in regards to the Opium Wars, you can draw a very direct line from then to now with few steps in between. Outside powers take parts of China away, they are handed back so recently that they are in living memory of even young people, and the residents have had experience with self rule that they are unwilling to give up - because even the young remember having it. Add in China's increasingly authoritarian rule as of late and we can all see the results.

[PaulBullion]

They might sacrifice Pence to avoid a president Pelosi.

[Theleviathan]

What I've always found odd is how America gets lumped in as a colonizer even though most of our deepest problems also stem from being a colony. Yet, strangely, our criticism of America rarely offers the same benefit of the doubt as other places.

Chances are just about any country you name has a healthy share of self created evil and a history of evil inflicted upon it. A genuine instance of the truth lying in the middle.

[Gray Lensman]

What I've always found odd is how America gets lumped in as a colonizer even though most of our deepest problems also stem from being a colony. Yet, strangely, our criticism of America rarely offers the same benefit of the doubt as other places.

Chances are just about any country you name has a healthy share of self created evil and a history of evil inflicted upon it. A genuine instance of the truth lying in the middle.

The US gets that from the late 18th and early 19th centuries. The Banana Wars, taking over Spain's colonies and running them ourselves for years, and the big pile of Latin American coups funded by the CIA. It's a bitter joke in Latin America that the reason the US has never had a coup is because we lack the American embassy to start it from.

[JackDaw]

I hate to break it to you, but the initial wave of industrialization, while greatly beneficial to the countries that took part, had disastrous consequences for everyone else and largely created what we know of as the "third world." Not only did the advances in military technology allow European powers to colonize most of the world, the flood of cheap, mass produced goods destroyed local economies everywhere since traditional crafts could never compete with modern industrial processes. Many formerly advanced economies reverted to little more than strip mines for resource hungry Western industries, who then sold back the finished products to locals at massively inflated prices, helping to fund the vaunted middle class lifestyle.

This only really started to change when, after several abortive attempts, many of these third world countries finally succeeded in building up their own industrial capabilities, beginning with crude, dirty, and labor intensive factories but slowly moving up the value chain. Of course, this is also exactly the watershed event that we in the West constantly bemoan, since losing our grip on production naturally shifted the balance of wealth and power away from our workers and toward people we once considered hopelessly backward.

Lol. How very predictable! It’s a perfect illustration of the “nothing good has ever been done by Western civilisation” mantra that I was commenting on.

Call me psychic but I think you typed those “words of wisdom” on a modern electronic device...which you prefer to quill and pen. That when you have an operation you prefer an anaesthetic to be used; you quite like your car; and take the occasional jet flight; etc, etc.

Do you really believe 4000 years ago men lived a sinless life in a pastoral paradise?

[Gray Lensman]

Lol. How very predictable! It’s a perfect illustration of the “nothing good has ever been done by Western civilisation” mantra that I was commenting on.

Call me psychic but I think you typed those “words of wisdom” on a modern electronic device...which you prefer to quill and pen. That when you have an operation you prefer an anaesthetic to be used; you quite like your car; and take the occasional jet flight; etc, etc.

Do you really believe 4000 years ago men lived a sinless life in a pastoral paradise?

You seem to be projecting again. Lots of good has come from western civilization, but we have also done some very crappy things as well. Acknowledging the bad parts doesn't mean we are disavowing the good parts.

[SquirrelMan]

Celebrities form ‘Impeachment Task Force’ to fight Trump’s lies on Twitter





Trump 'Impeachment Task Force' Hellbent on Holding President 'Accountable For His Betrayal of America'



Makes me wish there was more that I could do.

I think everyone who has a twitter account should report harassment and clearly fake accounts. Bookmark their profile pages and report them as often as you find the time. Information warfare is real.

[Tami]

I think everyone who has a twitter account should report harassment and clearly fake accounts. Bookmark their profile pages and report them as often as you find the time. Information warfare is real.

So far I haven't much or any experience with those.

[Theleviathan]

The US gets that from the late 18th and early 19th centuries. The Banana Wars, taking over Spain's colonies and running them ourselves for years, and the big pile of Latin American coups funded by the CIA. It's a bitter joke in Latin America that the reason the US has never had a coup is because we lack the American embassy to start it from.

Our hands are plenty dirty for sure. The conversation on India earlier struck me as the kind of blame deflecting America would never be granted even though some is warranted. (And other times full blame is warranted)

India is no different.

[jetengine]

Lol. How very predictable! It’s a perfect illustration of the “nothing good has ever been done by Western civilisation” mantra that I was commenting on.

Call me psychic but I think you typed those “words of wisdom” on a modern electronic device...which you prefer to quill and pen. That when you have an operation you prefer an anaesthetic to be used; you quite like your car; and take the occasional jet flight; etc, etc.

Do you really believe 4000 years ago men lived a sinless life in a pastoral paradise?

We dont do it because its vulgar and done by racists and islamaphobes looking to beat their chest about "The glory of western civilisation"

No one wants to be this guy in the tweet.

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