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  1. #8551
    Old school comic book fan WestPhillyPunisher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theleviathan View Post
    I don't know if we can say yet. The complaint has credibility, enough to be very carefully examined....but it is second-hand. The fact that it isn't from a source with direct knowledge is problematic.
    And that could give Trump a much needed escape. God knows he's been slithering in and out of political death traps ever since that escalator ride in 2015. He's made Teflon look like Velcro ever since.

    Quote Originally Posted by Theleviathan View Post
    There are dots needing connecting, starting with the full transcript of the phone call. Put people under oath, executive privilege cannot be accepted as an excuse.
    Indeed. This whole thing needs to be dissected like a frog in a high school biology class.
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  2. #8552
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theleviathan View Post
    I don't know if we can say yet. The complaint has credibility, enough to be very carefully examined....but it is second-hand. The fact that it isn't from a source with direct knowledge is problematic.

    There are dots needing connecting, starting with the full transcript of the phone call. Put people under oath, executive privilege cannot be accepted as an excuse.
    The complaint itself is one thing. But, the attempts to cover up or suppress the whistle blower is another serious matter. The process for people wanting to let people know who can do something about questionable, or potentially illegal activity must not be suppressed. This person tried to use the normal, established legal channels and protocols to alert the proper people. And everything we are learning is that every attempt possible was made to not let the complaint get to the proper channels until Schiff brought it to the public's attention.

    This is serious. If it isn't perfectly clear that you cannot block or suppress the legal channels for someone to tell appropriate authority. Then we are left with someone having to resort to just saying nothing. Or taking steps to just illegally leak it if they think its that serious that people should know and do something.
    Last edited by kidfresh512; 09-26-2019 at 08:32 AM.

  3. #8553
    Invincible Jersey Ninja Tami's Avatar
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    Twitter Thread worth checking out

    House Intel coming to order to hear from acting-DNI Maguire.
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  4. #8554
    Astonishing Member Darkspellmaster's Avatar
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    This is serious. If it isn't perfectly clear that you cannot block or suppress the legal channels for someone to tell appropriate authority. Then we are left with someone having to resort to just saying nothing. Or taking steps to just illegally leak it if they think its that serious that people should know and do something.
    Bolded section worries me a lot because when you go into illegal territory you run the risk of people not believing it and then ending up being seen as discredited for it because you went through illegal channels to report it. Yeah, I would say this whole thing is serious, and could shape how people try to report such matters going forward.

  5. #8555
    Ultimate Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    https://twitter.com/SteveEngelberg/s...66914666631169

    A good thread on the phone call there.

    https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...campaign=share


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    For months, the biggest hurdle for Democrats pushing the House to open impeachment proceedings against Donald Trump was the party leadership’s concern that such a process would politically endanger the members at the far edge of their majority, especially the 31 representing districts that voted for the president in 2016.

    But there’s considerable evidence—both in contemporary polling and the experience of former President Bill Clinton’s impeachment—that impeaching Trump might not be nearly as risky as it’s been portrayed for them.
    Worth a read.

  6. #8556
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkspellmaster View Post
    Bolded section worries me a lot because when you go into illegal territory you run the risk of people not believing it and then ending up being seen as discredited for it because you went through illegal channels to report it. Yeah, I would say this whole thing is serious, and could shape how people try to report such matters going forward.
    That and not everyone will risk the legal ramifications. How many of us would say damn that's illegal, immoral, but I have kids and a career just gonna carry on quietly over here.....
    We all would like to think we would risk it and not knowingly allow illegal stuff to continue without reporting it. But, reality is there could be jail, huge legal fees, fines etc. It is a huge decision to just leak if you are blocked from the legal channels

  7. #8557
    Silver Sentinel BeastieRunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theleviathan View Post
    I don't know if we can say yet. The complaint has credibility, enough to be very carefully examined....but it is second-hand. The fact that it isn't from a source with direct knowledge is problematic.

    There are dots needing connecting, starting with the full transcript of the phone call. Put people under oath, executive privilege cannot be accepted as an excuse.
    The whistle-blower complaint correctly summarizes the phone transcript.

    Can't make the line any clearer than that.
    "Always listen to the crazy scientist with a weird van or armful of blueprints and diagrams." -- Vibranium

  8. #8558
    Astonishing Member Darkspellmaster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kidfresh512 View Post
    That and not everyone will risk the legal ramifications. How many of us would say damn that's illegal, immoral, but I have kids and a career just gonna carry on quietly over here.....
    We all would like to think we would risk it and not knowingly allow illegal stuff to continue without reporting it. But, reality is there could be jail, huge legal fees, fines etc. It is a huge decision to just leak if you are blocked from the legal channels
    Bingo, and then you also have the social aspect too, not only of you but family as well. Even small business that are doing corrupt things have large fall outs for leakers. Some people, even if it's the right thing can't get jobs in their field because of it, and with how the world economy and networking works now, yeah, no way everyone, even the most moralist of people, would try to do illegal leaks when weighing the ramifications of their life after.

    That's why legal channels are a must. Without them were screwed.

  9. #8559
    Extraordinary Member PaulBullion's Avatar
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    Hillary was right!

  10. #8560
    Invincible Jersey Ninja Tami's Avatar
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    As the wall cracks, a chip falls

    A first: Vermont GOP governor backs Trump impeachment probe

    ESSEX JUNCTION, Vt. — Vermont’s governor has become the first Republican chief executive to support impeachment proceedings against President Donald Trump but cautions that he wants to know more before any further actions are taken.

    Gov. Phil Scott said at a news conference Thursday that he wasn’t surprised by the allegations that Trump repeatedly urged Ukraine’s president to “look into” Democratic presidential candidate Joe Biden because he’s “watched him over the years.”

    Other moderate Republican governors have yet to weigh in on an impeachment inquiry.

    When pressed by reporters, Ohio Gov. Mike DeWine said Wednesday he was withholding judgment. Massachusetts Gov. Charlie Baker and Maryland Gov. Larry Hogan have yet to comment.
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  11. #8561
    Old school comic book fan WestPhillyPunisher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulBullion View Post
    Heh! I got a chuckle out of that.
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  12. #8562
    Silver Sentinel BeastieRunner's Avatar
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    Congress is looking at not going to recess UNTIL the impeachment inquiry and possible hearings are over.
    Last edited by BeastieRunner; 09-26-2019 at 10:25 AM.
    "Always listen to the crazy scientist with a weird van or armful of blueprints and diagrams." -- Vibranium

  13. #8563
    Postin' since Aug '05 Dalak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BeastieRunner View Post
    Congress is looking to not go to recess the impeachment inquiry and possible hearings are over.
    I'm feeling pretty tired and run down right now so that could be why I have no idea which of 2 things you are trying to say here.

  14. #8564
    Silver Sentinel BeastieRunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dalak View Post
    I'm feeling pretty tired and run down right now so that could be why I have no idea which of 2 things you are trying to say here.
    Forgot a word and it auto corrected on me.

    Congress is looking AT not going to recess UNTIL the impeachment inquiry and possible hearings are over.

    My bad!
    "Always listen to the crazy scientist with a weird van or armful of blueprints and diagrams." -- Vibranium

  15. #8565
    Postin' since Aug '05 Dalak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BeastieRunner View Post
    Forgot a word and it auto corrected on me.

    Congress is looking AT not going to recess UNTIL the impeachment inquiry and possible hearings are over.

    My bad!
    Ok, that makes much more sense. Thank you! I was afraid brain mush out ears.

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