All Purpose News and Politics Thread Part IV: The Center Cannot Hold

[Mister Mets]

Mets, have you become any closer to registering as an independent after reading about the lice comb?

As an Independent, I would lose the ability to meaningfully participate in primaries. Currently, I can vote against Trump before you guys can.

I'll also add that the most popular executives in the country are Republicans, so it seems silly to think the party is beyond fixing, or that it'll be better if the people opposed to Trump leave so that his bigger fans are the only ones voting in primaries.

https://morningconsult.com/governor-rankings/

It's not desperation, it's about who they know and he's the biggest high profile Dem in the nation + he's linked with Obama. And a lot of this is not deep dived into his real political positions and history, which has only now become an issue to be focused on in the media.

There's also no perfect choice.

Looking at the top candidates in polls...
Bernie Sanders is older than Biden, and has historically been an Independent. He's pushing for radical change, which is a problem for anyone who likes normal Democrats.
Elizabeth Warren's Pocahontas stuff was weird, and she consistently underperforms the party in her statewide races.
Pete Buttigieg is a small-city mayor.
Kamala Harris is a new Senator. She was a prominent prosecutor before that, but there are all sorts of questions about her instincts.
Beto O'Rourke was a congressional backbencher whose response to a close Senate loss was kinda silly (the whole vision quest thing.)
Cory Booker's hit from the left for his ties to bankers and hit from the center for the new age radical love stuff.
Amy Klobuchar is notoriously abusive to the people who work for her.

The polling criteria kept out Steve Bullock, a candidate who has done well as Governor of a state that went for Trump by big numbers. However, he also couldn't answer the simple question of what accomplishment he's most proud of.

[Theleviathan]

As an Independent, I would lose the ability to meaningfully participate in primaries. Currently, I can vote against Trump before you guys can.

I'll also add that the most popular executives in the country are Republicans, so it seems silly to think the party is beyond fixing, or that it'll be better if the people opposed to Trump leave so that his bigger fans are the only ones voting in primaries.

https://morningconsult.com/governor-rankings/



There's also no perfect choice.

Looking at the top candidates in polls...
Bernie Sanders is older than Biden, and has historically been an Independent. He's pushing for radical change, which is a problem for anyone who likes normal Democrats.
Elizabeth Warren's Pocahontas stuff was weird, and she consistently underperforms the party in her statewide races.
Pete Buttigieg is a small-city mayor.
Kamala Harris is a new Senator. She was a prominent prosecutor before that, but there are all sorts of questions about her instincts.
Beto O'Rourke was a congressional backbencher whose response to a close Senate loss was kinda silly (the whole vision quest thing.)
Cory Booker's hit from the left for his ties to bankers and hit from the center for the new age radical love stuff.
Amy Klobuchar is notoriously abusive to the people who work for her.

The polling criteria kept out Steve Bullock, a candidate who has done well as Governor of a state that went for Trump by big numbers. However, he also couldn't answer the simple question of what accomplishment he's most proud of.

Basing that off of popularity is.....bizarre.

As an actual independent, I can't be more disgusted with what Republicanism stands for. I value fiscal conservatism. I value having conservative voices in policy making because the left often forgets that the "how" is just as important as the "what" when solving problems.

But my god....Republicans right now? They have nothing vital, meaningful, or even decent to contribute at this point. They can't even manage to be fiscally conservative on top of their rampant douchebaggery.

[Mecegirl]

NPR's Embedded podcast is doing a season about Mitch McConnell. Its so fucking depressing!! I don't see how he lives the way he does.

https://www.npr.org/podcasts/510311/embedded

[KNIGHT OF THE LAKE]

NPR's Embedded podcast is doing a season about Mitch McConnell. Its so fucking depressing!! I don't see how he lives the way he does.

https://www.npr.org/podcasts/510311/embedded

Trump’s a circus but he’s basically Joffrey. Mitch is Tywin and he’s the real evil in control.

[KNIGHT OF THE LAKE]

Basing that off of popularity is.....bizarre.

As an actual independent, I can't be more disgusted with what Republicanism stands for. I value fiscal conservatism. I value having conservative voices in policy making because the left often forgets that the "how" is just as important as the "what" when solving problems.

But my god....Republicans right now? They have nothing vital, meaningful, or even decent to contribute at this point. They can't even manage to be fiscally conservative on top of their rampant douchebaggery.

He is right though that a lot of decent states have done well with Republican governors. But they are also insulated away from the the overall GOP and can be more tailor made for their state (see Charlie Baker in my home state). So there are decent people there, it’s just national leadership under Gingrich and later McConnell has been a complete war in realpolitik. So it’s not completely beyond hope, but it’s been a race towards deplorables when Congressiomal Republican leadership decided to be hacks

[Theleviathan]

He is right though that a lot of decent states have done well with Republican governors. But they are also insulated away from the the overall GOP and can be more tailor made for their state (see Charlie Baker in my home state). So there are decent people there, it’s just national leadership under Gingrich and later McConnell has been a complete war in realpolitik. So it’s not completely beyond hope, but it’s been a race towards deplorables when Congressiomal Republican leadership decided to be hacks

Correct, I wouldn't call Charlie Baker a typical Republican. In fact, he's the kind of Republican I'd like to see return to the national stage.

What you see in those popularity numbers are Republicans governors of states who are not terribly hard right or left, so they have to govern more as an independent than the kind of trolls you see in Congress.

[Gray Lensman]

Correct, I wouldn't call Charlie Baker a typical Republican. In fact, he's the kind of Republican I'd like to see return to the national stage.

What you see in those popularity numbers are Republicans governors of states who are not terribly hard right or left, so they have to govern more as an independent than the kind of trolls you see in Congress.

My state used to have Sandoval, and he was pretty popular here. The guy who wanted to be his successor was a full on Trumper, and the result is Nevada has all 3 electable branches under Democratic control for the first time ever. As a side note to that, Nevada also has the first majority female state legislature in the country.

[WestPhillyPunisher]

Trump’s a circus but he’s basically Joffrey. Mitch is Tywin and he’s the real evil in control.

A spot on analogy. Trump is the puppet, and Turtle Boy, the true power behind the throne, is the puppet master, pulling the strings not just in the Oval Office, but in the Capitol with the Senate as well. People have said it’s not enough for Dems to reclaim the presidency, they have to win back the Senate or face four years of mindless obstruction from McConnell who’s already on record saying he’ll block and stall anything and everything if a Democrat becomes president.

[Mister Mets]

NPR's Embedded podcast is doing a season about Mitch McConnell. Its so fucking depressing!! I don't see how he lives the way he does.

https://www.npr.org/podcasts/510311/embedded

He thinks the country is better off when socialists don't get what they want, and when the courts are filled with originalist and textualist judges.

Basing that off of popularity is.....bizarre.

As an actual independent, I can't be more disgusted with what Republicanism stands for. I value fiscal conservatism. I value having conservative voices in policy making because the left often forgets that the "how" is just as important as the "what" when solving problems.

But my god....Republicans right now? They have nothing vital, meaningful, or even decent to contribute at this point. They can't even manage to be fiscally conservative on top of their rampant douchebaggery.

I'm not saying that popularity guarantees quality, although I do think these particular Governors are popular because they're making the right decisions.

[Tendrin]

He thinks the country is better off when socialists don't get what they want, and when the courts are filled with originalist and textualist judges.

You're giving him way too much credit.

He's the gravedigger of American democracy and you know it. He's a prime example of conservatives rejecting democracy when it does not deliver unto them the results that they want. When the history of this era is written, you can bet it won't be about how McConnel was earnest about how the 'country was better off', rest assured.


...and we're not better off.

[Dalak]

You're giving him way too much credit.

I'm fairly sure that Mets knows exactly what Mitch is really about, but is messing with us all here. There's no way he can actually believe that the twisted blatantly-partisan bigots being put in who are willing to ignore whatever precedents/norms/traditions they need to in order to get the GoP mission through are serious originalists/textualists.

[Theleviathan]

I'm not saying that popularity guarantees quality, although I do think these particular Governors are popular because they're making the right decisions.

Do you know anything about them? If Charlie Baker was a Senator he'd be derided as a charlatan to Republican principles and called a Democrat.

By national Republican standards, the men and women you cited are Democrats. At best they'd be called Rhinos. So, yeah, they make a lot of right decisions. Like being pro-choice, accepting refugees, and support for same sex marriage. If Charlie Baker is the one you want to hold up - I'd tell you it undermines your point.

Trump, McConnell and the other national Republicans are scum. If more of them were Charlie Baker we'd be far, far better off. But they are not. They are far, far from it.

[Theleviathan]

A spot on analogy. Trump is the puppet, and Turtle Boy, the true power behind the throne, is the puppet master, pulling the strings not just in the Oval Office, but in the Capitol with the Senate as well. People have said it’s not enough for Dems to reclaim the presidency, they have to win back the Senate or face four years of mindless obstruction from McConnell who’s already on record saying he’ll block and stall anything and everything if a Democrat becomes president.

You know what I find so strange about McConnell? He does all this awful stuff and he's still not even appreciated by the dregs of the Republican base. They hate him, chide him, mock him, and blame him and yet he is their most effective and most staunch facilitator. He's doing evil, awful things and the people that should be thanking him aren't even doing it!

[PaulBullion]

Today we'll find out if democracy still has a pulse in Turkey, as Istanbul goes back to the polls for a "do over" of the mayoral election Erdogan's candidate had narrowly lost.

Awesome news: The opposition candidate's lead is about 20 times as big this time around, and Edogan's candidate already conceded.

[PaulBullion]

Boris Johnson seemed like a sure-in to become PM of the UK ... and then this happened:

Police called to loud altercation at potential PM's home

The argument could be heard outside the property where the potential future prime minister is living with Symonds, a former Conservative party head of press.

A neighbour told the Guardian they heard a woman screaming followed by “slamming and banging”. At one point Symonds could be heard telling Johnson to “get off me” and “get out of my flat”.


When contacted by the Guardian on Friday, police initially said they had no record of a domestic incident at the address. But when given the case number and reference number, as well as identification markings of the vehicles that were called out, police issued a statement saying: “At 00:24hrs on Friday, 21 June, police responded to a call from a local resident in [south London]. The caller was concerned for the welfare of a female neighbour.

Cops, man.

And Lordy, there are tapes:

The neighbour said they recorded the altercation from inside their flat out of concern for Symonds. On the recording, heard by the Guardian, Johnson can be heard refusing to leave the flat and telling Symonds to “get off my fucking laptop” before there is a loud crashing noise.

Symonds is heard saying Johnson had ruined a sofa with red wine: “You just don’t care for anything because you’re spoilt. You have no care for money or anything.”

The neighbour said: “There was a smashing sound of what sounded like plates. There was a couple of very loud screams that I’m certain were Carrie and she was shouting to ‘get out’ a lot. She was saying ‘get out of my flat’ and he was saying no. And then there was silence after the screaming. My partner, who was in bed half asleep, had heard a loud bang and the house shook.”