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  1. #9646
    Extraordinary Member Robotman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tami View Post
    Sanders on difference with Warren: she's a capitalist 'I'm not'



    One more reason why I can feel comfortable voting for Warren and not Sanders. I like Capitalism, as long as it is regulated, measured, responsible - fiscally, environmentally, & socially responsible.
    he’s not a capitalist huh? So he must have hated the $2 million he made on book deals. Shit that must have made him physically ill. Poor Bernie. Seriously, this all or nothing is something you’d expect from Trump and co.

    In the words of the late great Obi-Wan Kenobi, “Only a Sith deals in absolutes!”
    Last edited by Robotman; 10-12-2019 at 09:08 PM.

  2. #9647
    Extraordinary Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robotman View Post
    he’s not a capitalist huh? So he must have hated the $2 million he made on book deals. Shit that must have made him physically ill. Poor Bernie. Seriously, this all or nothing is something you’d expect from Trump and co.

    In the words of the late great Obi-Wan Kenobi, “Only a Sith deals in absolutes!”
    Bernie ain't opposed to people making money, anyway. Most democratic socialists, especially of the kind Bernie represents, aren't.

    Much of this thread reminds me how ill-understood modern Democratic Socialism is by most.

  3. #9648
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    Bernie ain't opposed to people making money, anyway. Most democratic socialists, especially of the kind Bernie represents, aren't.

    Much of this thread reminds me how ill-understood modern Democratic Socialism is by most.
    It's weird, I think he wants to use the term socialist (even though he isn't one) as a way to garner left-wing support....but is completely oblivious or indifferent to the negative connotations that term brings. I've never understood that.

    I do think there are many of his supporters that incorrectly think he is a socialist in the most accurate sense of the word.

  4. #9649
    Extraordinary Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theleviathan View Post
    It's weird, I think he wants to use the term socialist (even though he isn't one) as a way to garner left-wing support....but is completely oblivious or indifferent to the negative connotations that term brings. I've never understood that.

    I do think there are many of his supporters that incorrectly think he is a socialist in the most accurate sense of the word.
    He's perfectly aware of it and Democratic Socialism is a real thing. The connotation of it in the USA is a completely bunk, blinkered long term piece of propaganda. The US already has a lot of policies that are democratic-socialist, even if we'd never call them that because of the negative view of what 'socialism' is.

    Fortunately, in their headlong rush to call the government doing anything 'socialist', the absurd right wing in this country has done a lot to make it an acceptable thing again. Which is good, as Democratic-Socialism is, in fact, largely better than a lot of what we have going on as is.

    That said, the right has essentially left Bernie alone and hasn't even begun the red-baiting campaign they'd use against him if he was the major nominee.

  5. #9650
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theleviathan View Post
    It's weird, I think he wants to use the term socialist (even though he isn't one) as a way to garner left-wing support....but is completely oblivious or indifferent to the negative connotations that term brings. I've never understood that.

    I do think there are many of his supporters that incorrectly think he is a socialist in the most accurate sense of the word.
    Because here's the dirty little secret, he knows that no matter who wins the nomination whether it's him or someone as center as Biden, they are going to be labled a Socialist. Obama was called a socialist. You're either going to embrace the word and gain some benefits of it, or you're going to spend all your time running from it and still getting labled it. I've said many times I support Warren. But she's 100% going to get called a socialist if she gets the nom and it's either going to be about her trying to walk everything back to get more center, or she's going to try to embrace the support she gets from more left wing policies.

    That's why I think a Biden or Buttegieg will have a much harder road. They'll be attacked from both ends.

  6. #9651
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    He's perfectly aware of it and Democratic Socialism is a real thing. The connotation of it in the USA is a completely bunk, blinkered long term piece of propaganda. The US already has a lot of policies that are democratic-socialist, even if we'd never call them that because of the negative view of what 'socialism' is.

    Fortunately, in their headlong rush to call the government doing anything 'socialist', the absurd right wing in this country has done a lot to make it an acceptable thing again. Which is good, as Democratic-Socialism is, in fact, largely better than a lot of what we have going on as is.

    That said, the right has essentially left Bernie alone and hasn't even begun the red-baiting campaign they'd use against him if he was the major nominee.
    I don't know that it's "Essentially Left Bernie Alone..." as much as it's "Has It's Figurative Hands Full With Other Stuff..."

  7. #9652
    Old school comic book fan WestPhillyPunisher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gray Lensman View Post
    I bet he'll come around to exempting people already on it, maybe even those who are close to qualifying so as to not anger those specific voters.
    Makes sense. Not even Trump wants to piss of the AARP set (a.k.a. the Gray Panthers) who are a key voting bloc.

    ====================

    Trump’s Closest Aides Want Him To Sever Ties With Giuliani

    Aides for the president said Trump has yet to fully grasp the extent of Giuliani’s side-dealings. Will that happen? I'd say yes. If Trump thinks Rantin' Rudy will drag him down or endanger his reelection chances, he'll shove "America's Mayor" under the nearest Greyhound. Speaking of which:

    Ex-U.S. Attorney Reveals Telltale Sign Trump Is About To Toss Giuliani Under The Bus

    **********

    Trump’s Betrayal Of The Kurds Will Echo For Generations

    Kurds have come to deeply value their collective memory. The next generation won’t forget U.S. support for Turkey’s bloody move into Syria. And that could prove problematical for America down the road. Meanwhile....

    **********

    Fighting In Northeastern Syria Has Already Displaced Over 130,000 People, UN Warns

    Relief agencies have estimated that up to 400,000 civilians in the conflict zone may require aid and protection. This is all on Trump. ALL OF IT.

    **********

    Jeffrey Epstein Likened Underage Sex Charges To ‘Stealing A Bagel’: Report

    A new report details the late money manager’s relationship with Bill Gates. A damn shame that shitstain took the coward's way out and offed himself rather than face justice.

    **********

    Trump Vows To Put A Man On The Moon. Someone Should Introduce Him To Buzz Aldrin.

    And he’s going to end “socialism,” he promises supporters at Louisiana rally. God. What a fucking moron.
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  8. #9653
    Extraordinary Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Enraging.

    BlackLivesMatter“If you don’t feel safe with the police department, then who do you feel safe with? Do you just ignore crime or ignore something that’s not right? A Fort Worth woman was shot and killed in her own home early Saturday by one of the police officers sent to do a wellness check on her residence. This is the seventh shooting of a civilian by the department since June 1, and the sixth to be fatal.
    “It makes you not want to call the police department,” James Smith told the Fort Worth Star-Telegram. Smith is struggling in the wake of the shooting: He’s the one who dialed a Fort Worth non-emergency number after noticing his neighbor’s door was ajar and lights were on in the home of Atatiana Jefferson, 28, her aunt, and an 8-year-old nephew.
    “I’m shaken. I’m mad. I’m upset. And I feel it’s partly my fault,” Smith explained. “If I had never dialed the police department, she’d still be alive.”
    But Smith didn’t pull the trigger. A white police officer, who police say joined the department in April 2018, is the one who killed Jefferson. A little under two minutes of bodycam footage has already been released, and indicates that the unnamed shooter fired his service weapon once, into the window of a dark room.
    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/201...ls-her-instead

  9. #9654
    Guardian Empress of Earth Tami's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    Seriously infuriating. What kind of training do these police officers receive? Shoot first ask questions later? Didn't any of them think to go to the front door, ring the door bell and wait for a response? Guns should only be drawn and used if there is a clear and immediate threat, like being confronted by someone who has a gun and is pointing it at them or someone else. None of those police officers should have had their weapon drawn.

    Any other home they would have circled the house, did a visual inspection, then knocked on the front door to speak with whomever was inside.
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  10. #9655
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    Quote Originally Posted by KNIGHT OF THE LAKE View Post
    Because here's the dirty little secret, he knows that no matter who wins the nomination whether it's him or someone as center as Biden, they are going to be labled a Socialist. Obama was called a socialist. You're either going to embrace the word and gain some benefits of it, or you're going to spend all your time running from it and still getting labled it. I've said many times I support Warren. But she's 100% going to get called a socialist if she gets the nom and it's either going to be about her trying to walk everything back to get more center, or she's going to try to embrace the support she gets from more left wing policies.

    That's why I think a Biden or Buttegieg will have a much harder road. They'll be attacked from both ends.
    You're right, that's true, but I think that's why Warren is leaning so hard into calling herself a capitalist. It won't change what the right will do, but it might change the way voters feel about her.

    Bernie on the other hand is actively attacking capitalism even though what he believes really isn't opposed to capitalism. It's...bizarre.

  11. #9656
    Guardian Empress of Earth Tami's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theleviathan View Post
    You're right, that's true, but I think that's why Warren is leaning so hard into calling herself a capitalist. It won't change what the right will do, but it might change the way voters feel about her.

    Bernie on the other hand is actively attacking capitalism even though what he believes really isn't opposed to capitalism. It's...bizarre.
    I think Bernie realizes that Elizabeth is surging in the polls and he is falling, so now he realizes he has to make a distinction between himself and her. He's catering to his core base, much liek Trump caters to his core base.

    Sanders problem is going to be that he isn't going to get support from the people he needs support from the most. The largest voting groups.
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  12. #9657
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    I don't know that it's "Essentially Left Bernie Alone..." as much as it's "Has It's Figurative Hands Full With Other Stuff..."
    I agree. I think the right might be more concerned about how to spin the Ukraine situation at the moment, but I don't think that they've forgot about Sanders. They'll be back to smearing him soon enuff.

  13. #9658
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tami View Post
    I think Bernie realizes that Elizabeth is surging in the polls and he is falling, so now he realizes he has to make a distinction between himself and her. He's catering to his core base, much liek Trump caters to his core base.

    Sanders problem is going to be that he isn't going to get support from the people he needs support from the most. The largest voting groups.
    Makes sense. Bernie has never cared much, even during his time in the Senate, about broadening out his appeal.

  14. #9659
    What fresh hell is this? ChadH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robotman View Post
    he’s not a capitalist huh? So he must have hated the $2 million he made on book deals. Shit that must have made him physically ill. Poor Bernie. Seriously, this all or nothing is something you’d expect from Trump and co.

    In the words of the late great Obi-Wan Kenobi, “Only a Sith deals in absolutes!”
    I'm no great fan of Sanders but I feel this comment needs to be addressed.
    In a comparison of wealth among U.S legislators that $2 Million in Bernie's pocket doesn't even put him in the top 50.
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  15. #9660

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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    There's something we probably ought to talk over.
    While the state legislator in question is also constitutionally ineligible to be President, I suspect most people would feel they don't have the resume for the office.

    There are two problems with electing someone to the White House who just started serving in minor office. The first is that there's going to be a lot that they don't know about national issues, and they might also not know what they don't know. The second is that they may end up changing their views in very significant ways through the process of serving their constituents, and realizing that certain things they advocated for might not be great policies.

    Quote Originally Posted by JDogindy View Post
    Yeah, you gotta be 35 years old minimum (although people prefer their candidates older for, you know, experience?), a US citizen (meaning American Samoans can't run as they are US nationals), and have no felonies. There tend to be other prerequisites, but those are the main ones.
    I remember an argument that the age minimum basically served as a way to restrict the power of the military and elite families, since the understanding would be that the only person who can get the name recognition to be a plausible presidential candidate under the age of 35 would have to be either a war hero or a scion from a very connected family for whom an elected position could be seen as an inheritance.

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