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  1. #6556
    Extraordinary Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tuck View Post
    Why does she warrant a stream of posts when she's mentioned in this thread?

    She's going nowhere.
    Was there a stream? I was just disagreeing with you that she's hardly a good candidate unless you're for apologizing for Assad and Mosi's fascism.

  2. #6557
    Astonishing Member Tuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    Was there a stream? I was just disagreeing with you that she's hardly a good candidate unless you're for apologizing for Assad and Mosi's fascism.
    Sure, why not? I'll be a cartoon character for today. Where we going with this?

  3. #6558
    Extraordinary Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tuck View Post
    Sure, why not? I'll be a cartoon character for today. Where we going with this?
    It's a message board. When people bring something up, other people comment about it. That's how this works.

  4. #6559

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    Quote Originally Posted by JDogindy View Post
    For a Republican, absolutely. But for a Democrat, unless one of them happens to be "out there" like Williamson or just a douche that right wing basement dwellers are jumping on like Yang (those are honestly the only two candidates I consider truly unsalvageable in this campaign, with Yang being the man I'm rooting especially to crash and burn), I fail to see the issue.
    Do you think a Biden/ O'Rourke ticket is plausible, or would Democrats prefer a ticket that showcases their diversity?

  5. #6560
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    The local Fox affiliate has a "Post-Local News..." politics show called Flannery Fired Up.

    Adam Kinzinger just mentioned that he would be for raising the age for all gun sales to twenty-one and putting a limit on what the "Maximum" magazine size could be.

  6. #6561
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    Quote Originally Posted by TriggerWarning View Post
    This sort of. I don't like Trump and want a better option in 2020. I'm just fearful this will be a repeat of 2016 where its horrible choice one, horrible choice two, or wasted third party vote where at least your conscience is clean (as I did in 2016).

    I refused to vote for Hilary (I voted Gary Johnson in 2016) for several reasons: 1) Bill Clinton is rapist and I'm ashamed to have voted for him twice, no way was I going to vote for him a 3rd time as his being a former president would mean untold power never before seen from a first spouse, 2) Hilary is a sociopath who attacked her husband's victims and only wanted power, 3) Hilary never did anything on her own merit except marrying up and then riding the coattails of her husband's name first to a senate seat in a state she had never lived in and then as consolation prize to secretary of state. None of this makes Trump a good choice: as I said I voted 3rd party rather than evil or evil.

    Warren's issues are different for me. 1: She's the absolute worst candidate to run against Trump given her lies about her heritage and how Trump has already killed her repeatedly with his Pocahontas attacks, 2) She and Bernie are the extreme left and will alienate the center and moderate votes. Warren is also obviously a liar based on on her past applications where she claimed minority status for her own advantage. She will not do well in the rust belt which is where Trump won in 2016.

    A Trump vs anyone not Warren I'm 99.9% likely to vote for the democrat. Warren though would either make me stay home or vote 3rd party again - I'd wait and see if there were any local elections of note before making the stay home choice. I'm not voting Trump, I just want a good reason to vote democrat other than that Trump sucks.
    If at this point, knowing everything we know now, you still think that a Clinton presidency would be anywhere near as bad as what we've seen from Trump, then you should probably just stop lying to yourself and embrace the far right like you've always wanted all along.

    And seriously, nobody supports Warren because of her charisma or her political acumen, indeed most people were pretty much ready to write off her candidacy after all that Pocahontas crap went down. However as the campaign has gone on, she's managed to show that she's smart, sensible, and serious while the rest of party is increasing devolving into a clown show, and regardless of whether she can win or not, it's important to have her voice to show that at least someone still cares about the country.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    Do you think a Biden/ O'Rourke ticket is plausible, or would Democrats prefer a ticket that showcases their diversity?
    What would be the point of that? If you're not pandering to anyone with the VP pick, then you probably want someone with substance, but Beto fits neither of these and frankly neither does Biden.
    Last edited by PwrdOn; 08-09-2019 at 07:50 PM.

  7. #6562
    Extraordinary Member Celgress's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    Was there a stream? I was just disagreeing with you that she's hardly a good candidate unless you're for apologizing for Assad and Mosi's fascism.
    Would you rather we invaded Syria? After Iraq, I say no thanks to any invasion and occupation of a Middle Eastern country. We lost too many good people (some of whom I knew) in Iraq for nothing.
    "So you've come to the end now alive but dead inside."

  8. #6563
    Astonishing Member Tuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    Do you think a Biden/ O'Rourke ticket is plausible, or would Democrats prefer a ticket that showcases their diversity?
    The party would be fine with that.

    It's the chattering classes that have an issue.

  9. #6564
    Extraordinary Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celgress View Post
    Would you rather we invaded Syria? After Iraq, I say no thanks to any invasion and occupation of a Middle Eastern country. We lost too many good people (some of whom I knew) in Iraq for nothing.
    Why does every Gabbard defender do this? I don't want to invade Syria. You know what else? I don't want to pretend Assad didn't gas his own people and cause a massaive displacement of Syrian refugees with brutality, nor that India isn't sliding into authoritarian fascism and brutality towards its Muslim minority.

    Tulsi is fine with these things not because she's non-interventionist but because she a Hindu nationalist who doesn't mind these things when they're done to Muslims.

  10. #6565
    Extraordinary Member Celgress's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tuck View Post
    The party would be fine with that.

    It's the chattering classes that have an issue.
    I'll likely vote for Biden if he receives the nomination with one caveat: his mental health. I'm worried Biden might be going senile.
    "So you've come to the end now alive but dead inside."

  11. #6566
    Extraordinary Member Celgress's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    Why does every Gabbard defender do this? I don't want to invade Syria. You know what else? I don't want to pretend Assad didn't gas his own people and cause a massaive displacement of Syrian refugees with brutality.

    Tulsi is fine with these things not because she's non-interventionist but because she doesn't mind these things when they're done to Muslims.
    I'm not a Tulsi fan I'm against Middle Eastern entanglements. I'd never vote for anyone who supports intervening in the Middle East that is a dealbreaker for me. The UN should handle such matters as nation-building, not any one country.

    Edit - It was intervening in Afghanistan to fight the USSR by proxy which caused most of the problems there (the region) today.
    "So you've come to the end now alive but dead inside."

  12. #6567
    Extraordinary Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celgress View Post
    I'm not a Tulsi fan I'm against Middle Eastern entanglements. I'd never vote for anyone who supports intervening in the Middle East that is a dealbreaker for me. The UN should handle such matters as nation-building, not any one country.

    Edit - It was intervening in Afghanistan to fight the USSR by proxy which caused most of the problems there today.
    Questions over the whens and hows and whys of any form interventionism is fine. If you're a complete non-interventionist, be prepared to watch mass murder unfold and be content with washing your hands of it from your supposed moral high ground. But it's instructive to me that every time I discuss Tulsi's apologism for Assad, I get told 'wel you must want to invade Syria', as if those are our only options.
    Last edited by Tendrin; 08-09-2019 at 07:58 PM.

  13. #6568
    Extraordinary Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TriggerWarning View Post
    This sort of. I don't like Trump and want a better option in 2020. I'm just fearful this will be a repeat of 2016 where its horrible choice one, horrible choice two, or wasted third party vote where at least your conscience is clean (as I did in 2016).

    I refused to vote for Hilary (I voted Gary Johnson in 2016) for several reasons: 1) Bill Clinton is rapist and I'm ashamed to have voted for him twice, no way was I going to vote for him a 3rd time as his being a former president would mean untold power never before seen from a first spouse, 2) Hilary is a sociopath who attacked her husband's victims and only wanted power, 3) Hilary never did anything on her own merit except marrying up and then riding the coattails of her husband's name first to a senate seat in a state she had never lived in and then as consolation prize to secretary of state. None of this makes Trump a good choice: as I said I voted 3rd party rather than evil or evil.

    Warren's issues are different for me. 1: She's the absolute worst candidate to run against Trump given her lies about her heritage and how Trump has already killed her repeatedly with his Pocahontas attacks, 2) She and Bernie are the extreme left and will alienate the center and moderate votes. Warren is also obviously a liar based on on her past applications where she claimed minority status for her own advantage. She will not do well in the rust belt which is where Trump won in 2016.

    A Trump vs anyone not Warren I'm 99.9% likely to vote for the democrat. Warren though would either make me stay home or vote 3rd party again - I'd wait and see if there were any local elections of note before making the stay home choice. I'm not voting Trump, I just want a good reason to vote democrat other than that Trump sucks.
    Funny when supposed anti-Trump people, regurgated a series of right wing talking points and then tell us why they won't vote for this or that Democrat..
    There came a time when the Old Gods died! The Brave died with the Cunning! The Noble perished locked in battle with unleashed Evil! It was the last day for them! An ancient era was passing in fiery holocaust!

  14. #6569
    Extraordinary Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    Funny when supposed anti-Trump people, regurgated a series of right wing talking points and then tell us why they won't vote for this or that Democrat..
    It's even funnier when they shout about Bill Clinton's history while an actual rapist sits in the white house.

  15. #6570
    Astonishing Member Tuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    Questions over the whens and hows and whys of any form interventionism is fine. If you're a complete non-interventionist, be prepared to watch mass murder unfold and be content with washing your hands of it from your supposed moral high ground.
    Non-interventionism isn't a moral position though. There's no moral high ground to be claiming to stand on.

    And this pretty much goes back to my original amusement at the anti-Gabbard progressive tilt. Since when is non-interventionism an unacceptable positioin progressive circles? There was a time, not too long ago, that progressives wouldn't shut the hell up about it.

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