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  1. #6721
    Legend HowitzerJoe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celgress View Post
    This thread has stopped being enjoyable for me. I'll save my energy for arguing with people about comic characters such arguments tend to be less dogmatic and bitter, which surprises me all things considered. I know better than to come in here again, adios.
    I don't know as much about politics as I would like. They're largely boring, and inconsequential to me. I do like coming here sometimes to watch the constant train wreck though.

  2. #6722
    Extraordinary Member PaulBullion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celgress View Post
    This thread has stopped being enjoyable for me. I'll save my energy for arguing with people about comic characters such arguments tend to be less dogmatic and bitter, which surprises me all things considered. I know better than to come in here again, adios.
    Shorter Cel:

    "I've done all the concern-trolling I came here to do. Now back to watching fictional worlds burn instead of the real one."
    "How does the Green Goblin have anything to do with Herpes?" - The Dying Detective

    Hillary was right!

  3. #6723
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    Liberterianism - An ideology so "good" it only took root in comminist/socialist terrified america. That is selfishness in its entirety and somehow expects people to act on their best nstures.

  4. #6724
    Extraordinary Member PaulBullion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celgress View Post
    I agree with you completely on this point. IMO, the Republican Party is on its way to becoming fully fascist if it isn't there already.

    My only major issues with the Democrats are their courting of SJWs and their lax border control stances. One I don't want laws passed that regulate what you can and can't say because it might hurt someone's feelings. Two we need secure borders to know who and what is entering the country.
    Open borders are true freedom, Gress.

    Why do you hate freedom?
    "How does the Green Goblin have anything to do with Herpes?" - The Dying Detective

    Hillary was right!

  5. #6725
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulBullion View Post
    Open borders are true freedom, Gress.

    Why do you hate freedom?
    Because Liberterianism. Or "I want everyone to do their own thing....until it infringes on me, them stop doing your own thing"

  6. #6726
    Ultimate Member Gray Lensman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetengine View Post
    Because Liberterianism. Or "I want everyone to do their own thing....until it infringes on me, them stop doing your own thing"
    The official Libertarian Party stance actually is open borders. I don't entirely agree myself, but would take it over the concentration camp system Trump has in place.
    "Theory: The Phoenix doesn't corrupt the characters, it corrupts the authors." Gambit, King of Thieves

  7. #6727
    Extraordinary Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Libertarians don't actually give a crap about 'liberty'. Free market capitalism gives us $300 bottles of insulin and people dying for the lack of it, and no, 'the free market will provide' is not an answer, it's a declaration of religious faith.

    When you're willing to sacrifice actual lives on the altar of your 'personal liberty', because ideology tells you that government intervention is bad, you don't get to say you're for freedom since the freedom to breathe is the ultimate personal liberty.

  8. #6728
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    Libertarians don't actually give a crap about 'liberty'. Free market capitalism gives us $300 bottles of insulin and people dying for the lack of it, and no, 'the free market will provide' is not an answer, it's a declaration of religious faith.

    When you're willing to sacrifice actual lives on the altar of your 'personal liberty', because ideology tells you that government intervention is bad, you don't get to say you're for freedom since the freedom to breathe is the ultimate personal liberty.
    Trying to frame that as anything like a legitimately "Free" market is a bad joke though.

    While it is completely unacceptable, it's not a completely unacceptable situation brought to you by anything like free market capitalism. "Distinctly American...." capitalism? Sure.

    Never mind something like sex work. A "Free..." market, it ain't.

  9. #6729
    Extraordinary Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    Trying to frame that as anything like a legitimately "Free" market is a bad joke though.

    While it is completely unacceptable, it's not a completely unacceptable situation brought to you by anything like free market capitalism. "Distinctly American...." capitalism? Sure.
    It's sure as hell a part of free market capitalism, 30. we'll have to agree to disagree there.

  10. #6730
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    It's sure as hell a part of free market capitalism, 30. we'll have to agree to disagree there.
    Completely fine.

    I think the only thing we really disagree on is if it's actually free market capitalism.

  11. #6731
    Extraordinary Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    Completely fine.

    I think the only thing we really disagree on is if it's actually free market capitalism.

    My mom paid $110 for a single insulin pen.


    No one can tell me that it's not free market capitalism doing its level best to deliver profits by extracting wealth from a captive, inelastic market that needs the drug to survive and declare that 'that's not the free market part!, because an even *less* regulated system wouldn't be better.

  12. #6732
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    My mom paid $110 for a single insulin pen.


    No one can tell me that it's not free market capitalism doing its level best to deliver profits by extracting wealth from a captive, inelastic market that needs the drug to survive and declare that 'that's not the free market part!, because an even *less* regulated system wouldn't be better.
    If it is the "American..." version of it that is making sure there are laws on the books that make it against the law to import from Canada, that's not anything like "Free..." While I do agree that reducing regulations willy nilly isn't going to make things better for people, there's not really a scenario where consumers wouldn't be better off with at least having the legal option to import from Canada. That regulation is only there to look out for business.

  13. #6733
    Extraordinary Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    If it is the "American..." version of it that is making sure there are laws on the books that make it against the law to import from Canada, that's not anything like "Free..." While I do agree that reducing regulations willy nilly isn't going to make things better for people, there's not really a scenario where consumers wouldn't be better off with at least having the legal option to import from Canada. That regulation is only there to look out for business.
    I'm saying an 'American' version is irrelevant. Any truly unregulated market would deliver an even worse outcome.

  14. #6734
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Never mind something like current patent laws being slanted clearly in the seller's favor.

    That's not really anything like a truly "Free..." market. It's one where advantages will absolutely be put into place if the seller can throw enough money around to get them written into law.

  15. #6735
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    I'm saying an 'American' version is irrelevant. Any truly unregulated market would deliver an even worse outcome.
    Again, just have to politely disagree there.

    Nine out of ten things wrong in the US is because of a distinctly "American..." spin of what a free market is.

    Never mind that things don't have to go right to "True Mad Max Free Market..." just to provide the consumer with a little bit more of a fair shake.

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