All Purpose News and Politics Thread Part IV: The Center Cannot Hold

[Tami]

Former Italian PM Renzi to sue former Trump aide over smear claims

Former Italian prime minister Matteo Renzi said on Friday he would sue George Papadopoulos, a one-time campaign aide for U.S. President Donald Trump, over allegations that Renzi had tried to undermine Trump's 2016 election campaign.

Papadopoulos told the Italian daily La Verita that he believed Renzi had acted on the orders of former U.S. president Barack Obama to "strike a low blow" against Trump in the run-up to the 2016 presidential election.

Renzi denied the allegation in a post on Facebook, saying Papadopoulos's accusation was "seriously damaging to my reputation." He added: "See you in court."

[jetengine]

I'm surprised Hammil isnt there tbh. Dude HATES Trump.

[Tami]

I'm surprised Hammil isnt there tbh. Dude HATES Trump.

The list is growing. I saw some people ask to be added to it.

[Tami]

Iran-linked group tried to hack U.S. 2020 presidential campaigns, Microsoft says

The hack targeted email addresses belonging to U.S. presidential campaigns, government officials and journalists, according to new data unveiled by Microsoft. Microsoft linked the hack to the Iranian government and said more than 2,700 attempts were made to identify email addresses that belonged to the company’s customers over a 30-day period between August and September. Four of those addresses were compromised, none of which belonged to presidential campaigns or government officials, according to the tech giant.

[Gray Lensman]

That is not “counter factual”...it’s just your opinion. And it’s not one I share. China is massively different to India! For example, it’s periods when it was occupied were down to Japan, not a Western power.

China exercises an exceptional degree of control over what foreign investment and technology it allows into the country, and has done for decades now...certainly from the early days of Mao Tse Tung onwards.

What happens in China is what it’s own government believes is in China’s best interests...I’d characterise their mindset as similar to an intelligent Donald Trump (if such a thing exists!)

The Opium Wars take exception to your interpretation on who has occupied China.

[Malvolio]

You are only going to ensure that it remains a dirty game doing this sort of thing(allowing for that there is something to the assessment we are discussing).

Perpetuating it just because doing so is an option is a pretty lousy justification.

Edit:

Never mind perpetuating it while calling politics out for being a dirty game.

You say that as though politics wasn't always dirty and that it's actually possible to clean it up. Go read up on the Presidential election of 1800. Politics has ALWAYS been dirty. It's a feature, not a bug. You might as well try to get the salt out of the water in the oceans.

[PaulBullion]

https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1180123522712133632

My god what an idiot.

This is the defense when asked a legitimate question about Trade talks with China being influenced by Trump requesting dirt.

It isn't even worth having these people on anything but Fox News. He calls an interview he accepted an "interrogation". He is the White House trade adviser, and we have trade talks coming up with China who just yesterday were requested on live TV to bring dirt to the negotiations. But, he didn't think he would be asked about it?

"I am never disappointed in my president."

Do these guys even hear themselves with their fascist little pig ears anymore?

[PaulBullion]

Celebrities form ‘Impeachment Task Force’ to fight Trump’s lies on Twitter



.

I think I blocked the majority of those people. Some grifters like Dworkin, some for supporting candidates like Marianne Williamson.

[PwrdOn]

That is not “counter factual”...it’s just your opinion. And it’s not one I share. China is massively different to India! For example, it’s periods when it was occupied were down to Japan, not a Western power.

China exercises an exceptional degree of control over what foreign investment and technology it allows into the country, and has done for decades now...certainly from the early days of Mao Tse Tung onwards.

What happens in China is what it’s own government believes is in China’s best interests...I’d characterise their mindset as similar to an intelligent Donald Trump (if such a thing exists!)

China was much poorer than India in the late 70s when they began to open up their economy. The fact that they achieved such remarkable growth despite heavy state control and a restrictive civil society, compared to slower progress made by the far more democratic and liberal-minded India, was not lost on the leaders of either country. Moreover, the aggressive posture that the Chinese take toward foreign policy has made them hated but feared by their neighbors and rivals, whereas India's relatively non-threatening stance rarely wins them a seat at the table. So it's rather understandable, if misguided, that Indians would favor a more authoritarian leadership since they have plenty of evidence that a softer approach simply wasn't working. And once again, it's easy for us to say that protecting the dignity of minority groups far outweighs any kind of economic concerns, but then again, who are we to really lecture them on this?

[JackDaw]

China was much poorer than India in the late 70s when they began to open up their economy. The fact that they achieved such remarkable growth despite heavy state control and a restrictive civil society, compared to slower progress made by the far more democratic and liberal-minded India, was not lost on the leaders of either country. Moreover, the aggressive posture that the Chinese take toward foreign policy has made them hated but feared by their neighbors and rivals, whereas India's relatively non-threatening stance rarely wins them a seat at the table. So it's rather understandable, if misguided, that Indians would favor a more authoritarian leadership since they have plenty of evidence that a softer approach simply wasn't working. And once again, it's easy for us to say that protecting the dignity of minority groups far outweighs any kind of economic concerns, but then again, who are we to really lecture them on this?

I admire China. And apologise, of course, if my wording suggest differently.

I just happen to think most of the good and bad things that have happened there in the last 80 years or so are predominantly down to China’s own government rather than any malign Western influence.

The 30 million to 100 million people that met early deaths due to inhumane treatment in Mao Tse Tung’s later years..for example..were down to China’s own deliberate policy choices. Not down to the Opium Wars over 100 years before...or a nefarious CIA plot!

Really at times the tendency of some on these boards to argue that most evil is Western inspired comes over as faintly patronising to other countries. The non Western world is fully capable of their own evil!

[Tami]

Trump Said Ukraine Was A Corrupt Country Full Of “Terrible People" Who Were Out To Get Him, Former Diplomat Told Congress

Former Special Envoy to Ukraine Kurt Volker testified before members of Congress on Thursday. While the meeting was private and a full transcript has not been released, his prepared remarks were obtained by BuzzFeed News.

House Democrats on Thursday night also released text messages that Volker gave to Congress during his testimony that revealed him and other US and Ukrainian officials discussing the quid pro quo at the heart of the impeachment inquiry into President Donald Trump.

In his prepared testimony Thursday, Volker said he wanted to make five key points clear:

His “efforts were entirely focused on advancing U.S. foreign policy goals with respect to Ukraine.”

“Second, in May of this year, I became concerned that a negative narrative about Ukraine, fueled by assertions made by Ukraine’s departing Prosecutor General, was reaching the President of the United States, and impeding our ability to support the new Ukrainian government as robustly as I believed we should.”

“Third, at no time was I aware of or took part in an effort to urge Ukraine to investigate former Vice President Biden.” Volker said that in the text messages he shared with Congress, “Vice President Biden was never a topic of discussion.” However, the texts do explicitly mention Burisma, the Ukraine gas company where the presidential candidate’s son Hunter Biden served on the board.

“Fourth, while executing my duties, I kept my colleagues at the State Department and National Security Council informed, and also briefed Congress, about my actions.”

“Fifth and finally, I strongly supported the provision of U.S. security assistance, including lethal defensive weapons, to Ukraine throughout my tenure.”

[Jack Dracula]

China was much poorer than India in the late 70s when they began to open up their economy. The fact that they achieved such remarkable growth despite heavy state control and a restrictive civil society, compared to slower progress made by the far more democratic and liberal-minded India, was not lost on the leaders of either country. Moreover, the aggressive posture that the Chinese take toward foreign policy has made them hated but feared by their neighbors and rivals, whereas India's relatively non-threatening stance rarely wins them a seat at the table. So it's rather understandable, if misguided, that Indians would favor a more authoritarian leadership since they have plenty of evidence that a softer approach simply wasn't working. And once again, it's easy for us to say that protecting the dignity of minority groups far outweighs any kind of economic concerns, but then again, who are we to really lecture them on this?

I'd argue China has made such great progress in a short period of time because of these factors, not despite them.

[PaulBullion]

I'd argue China has made such great progress in a short period of time because of these factors, not despite them.

Hey, the US saw some AWESOME growth when slavery was still around.

[kidfresh512]

"I am never disappointed in my president."

Do these guys even hear themselves with their fascist little pig ears anymore?

Trump loves that kind of public brown nosing on TV. He will be thrilled

[Gray Lensman]

I admire China. And apologise, of course, if my wording suggest differently.

I just happen to think most of the good and bad things that have happened there in the last 80 years or so are predominantly down to China’s own government rather than any malign Western influence.

The 30 million to 100 million people that met early deaths due to inhumane treatment in Mao Tse Tung’s later years..for example..were down to China’s own deliberate policy choices. Not down to the Opium Wars over 100 years before...or a nefarious CIA plot!

Really at times the tendency of some on these boards to argue that most evil is Western inspired comes over as faintly patronising to other countries. The non Western world is fully capable of their own evil!

The Opium Wars are relevant because they ended with the British running Hong Kong until 1997. That experience with the freedom to choose their own leaders is one of the forces behind the current unrest. Macau didn't revert back to Chinese control until 1999. The consequences of that thing which happened over 100 years ago are still reverberating to this day.