All Purpose News and Politics Thread Part IV: The Center Cannot Hold

[Tami]

Ethics watchdog files request for documents on John Kelly and shelter operator that hired him

A nonprofit government ethics watchdog has requested that a federal agency turn over any documents related to former White House Chief of Staff John Kelly and Caliburn International, the operator of the nation's largest shelter for unaccompanied migrant children.

CBS News reported last week that Kelly has joined Caliburn's board of directors. News of Kelly's new job drew scathing criticism from prominent Democrats, who accused the company of profiting off White House policies that during Kelly's tenure led to a dramatic increase in the amount of time children were kept in government custody.

[SquirrelMan]

Or Biden will run the same campaign Hillary ran and lose the same way:
.

Biden is the most popular politician in the US, though. That makes a big difference.

Though we'll see what Putin makes up about him soon, I bet.

[Tami]

Biden is the most popular politician in the US, though. That makes a big difference.

Though we'll see what Putin makes up about him soon, I bet.

It also makes him the one with the Bullseye on his back. The ideal situation is for Biden to take all the heat from Trump, clearing the way for another candidate to jump ahead after the primary.

[PwrdOn]

I'd argue that's pretty much exactly what's fueling the anti-immigration racism in Europe these days. The demographics of who the minorities are are different than in the US, but all that "great replacement" and "we must preserve 'western culture'" stuff and "we don't have the resources to spare for these people" is very much a thing over there.

That was kind of my point, all these supposedly progressively minded Europeans suddenly turned to xenophobia and fascism the minute they were exposed to a mere trickle of migration from the outside, and start spewing the kind of vile propaganda about rampaging hordes of dark skinned brutes menacing poor innocent white girls that's more at home in the Reconstruction South than in the happy, cultured, social democratic welfare states that European countries are supposed to be.

[Tendrin]

A GOP state lawmaker who recently gave an impassioned speech about being raped as a 16 year old says she feels attacked after a Republican colleague passed out literature describing rape as a “misdeed of the parent” that doesn’t justify having an abortion.

The Spartanburg Republican who passed out the card this week, state Rep. Josiah Magnuson, acknowledged the poor word choice in an interview with The State Friday but said he wouldn’t back down from his position.

Oh WBE-Eeeeeeee..

https://www.charlotteobserver.com/ne...230258089.html

[JackDaw]

There are certainly many more racist incidents in America, because the population is much more diverse and so there are many more opportunities for conflicts to arise. The legal system in America is dysfunctional not because Americans are especially cruel or sadistic, but because white people have this existential fear that one day minorities will occupy positions of power and start enacting policies that serve our interests rather than reserving all the gains for whites exclusively. This is not something Europeans will ever have to worry about, all the white extinction hysteria aside.

And this is not to say that I think all Europeans are like these closet racists who just pretend to be tolerant but still have their SS uniforms stashed away just in the case the savages get too uppity. I'm just saying that the demographics of Europe mean that there are generally fewer situations where your typical white European will have to choose between upholding their principles of equality and openness, and serving their personal socioeconomic interests, a dilemma that most Americans encounter on a daily basis.

I think the main thrust of your argument (that people’s behaviour will alter radically, almost certainly for the worse if socio-economic interests come under pressure) is almost certainly correct.

But I am probably more pessimistic than you...in that I think in long term third world countries will demand a fairer share of wealth, and Europeans will..in next 20 years..have to make a choice between their liberal humane values and maintaining their material wealth.

[The Overlord]

Biden is the most popular politician in the US, though. That makes a big difference.

Though we'll see what Putin makes up about him soon, I bet.

Have you seen his record?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vox...y-clinton-2020

Think his popularity will last when others start to attack that record?

[Dalak]

Corporate Democrats like Clinton, Biden, Booker, etc are standing in the way progress, they should stand aside if they actually want to improve things.

I don't like Biden and hope he drops, but the obsession with Clinton that some people continue to maintain is boggling. What is she still doing now to stand in the way of progress?

[Mister Mets]

I'll admit it, I kinda feel Joe is running more out of a sense of regaining control of the establishment democratic party than anything else. Like he doesn't want the party to be taken over by the upstarts.

He first considered running for President in 1984. He may have some policy disagreements with Warren and Sanders, but he also has thought he'd make a good President for a long long time.

[The Overlord]

I don't like Biden and hope he drops, but the obsession with Clinton that some people continue to maintain is boggling. What is she still doing now to stand in the way of progress?

I have no personal grudge against her, but the ideology she and her husband spearheaded, third way, centerist neoliberalism is not true progressivism and is a barrier to true progressive change. The Clintons are the symbol of that ideology because they were the ones who transformed the Democratic party with it, back in the 90s.

I do not care way one or another about her, but I think her ideology needs to defeated to promote true change.

[SquirrelMan]

Have you seen his record?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vox...y-clinton-2020

Think his popularity will last when others start to attack that record?

Hillary Clinton got 3 million more votes than Trump. I think your entire premise is flawed.

[The Overlord]

Hillary Clinton got 3 million more votes than Trump. I think your entire premise is flawed.

And who is President? Clearly, Clinton getting 3 million more votes doesn't matter in the current system, so unless you want to change the system, there is no point in bringing that, you have to win by the rules of the game unless you are willing to try and change those rules and Biden isn't, he is too invested in the status quo to promote real change. You cannot complain about the Electoral College after losing as Clinton did, either take it on as an issue now or do nothing about it and leave it in place, but if those are the rules you agreed to play under, you can't complain when they don't work out for you.

I also noticed you have not bothered to defend his record.

[SquirrelMan]

And who is President? Clearly, Clinton getting 3 million more votes doesn't matter in the current system, so unless you want to change the system, there is no point in bringing that, you have to win by the rules of the game unless you are willing to try and change those rules and Biden isn't, he is too invested in the status quo to promote real change. You cannot complain about the Electoral College after losing as Clinton did, either take it on as an issue now or do nothing about it and leave it in place, but if those are the rules you agreed to play under, you can't complain when they don't work out for you.

I also noticed you have not bothered to defend his record.

1. her policies were not that centrist, she had probably the most progressive platform of any candidate for the two big parties in any election.

2. Getting more votes than any other candidate other than Obama the first time means her platform was popular.

Your entire premise is flawed on multiple levels. It's like a multiple level premise flaw. I wonder if there is a cool side mission it unlocks.

[The Overlord]

1. her policies were not that centrist, she had probably the most progressive platform of any candidate for the two big parties in any election.

2. Getting more votes than any other candidate other than Obama the first time means her platform was popular.

Your entire premise is flawed on multiple levels. It's like a multiple level premise flaw. I wonder if there is a cool side mission it unlocks.

1. Based on what, that one Boston Globe article?

Is her record of being a war hawk, promoting deregulation and mass incarnation irrelevant, because of her supposed ''progressive platform''? Why wouldn't people believe she would just say stuff to get elected and then run the Presidency like another neoliberal war hawk? I think your record should matter more than any campaign promise.

2. If Clinton was the safe choice, she would be President. Tell me, how are her ideas better than say Bernie Sanders ideas are? If her ideas are so great, surely you can defend them?

3. You still can't defend Biden's record.

[Dalak]

I have no personal grudge against her, but the ideology she and her husband spearheaded, third way, centerist neoliberalism is not true progressivism and is a barrier to true progressive change. The Clintons are the symbol of that ideology because they were the ones who transformed the Democratic party with it, back in the 90s.

I do not care way one or another about her, but I think her ideology needs to defeated to promote true change.

So, I don't see an answer to my question: What is Clinton still doing to stand in the way of progress? I ask because almost the only ones I see holding them up as a symbol in politics today are the ones trying to prosecute/investigate her. The rest who bring up the name Clinton are trying to talk up their chosen candidate in regards to people who are only tangentially involved nowadays.

Unlike Biden who's actively trying to excuse people for their shitty judgement and petulant behavior, I haven't noticed anything from them so I'm curious to see if you do.

BTW: Every time you represent Clinton's loss as some sort of judgement on/by the Dems without acknowledging all the other fingers on that scale it makes your arguments seem more and more desperate.