The Didio thing...

[Comic-Reader Lad]

#50. It was the WWIII issue.

52 was a phenomenally successful series for DC. Most of the series sold over 100,000 copies per issue -- and it came out on time every single week.

However, 52 was created because Dan DiDio wanted a 1 year jump after Infinite Crisis so that each ongoing series could be in a new status quo and all readers could be at the same starting place. Paul Levitz asked Dan if he was going to explain what happened in the missing year, so he concocted 52 to do just that.

But it's pretty clear that 52 wasn't really fulfilling its reason for being. So, the World War III was hastily put together with #50 and 4 additional tie in issues to take care of that. Didn't do so very satisfyingly by all accounts, but it was a last-minute patch job.

So, it seems that DiDio was under marching orders from Levitz, but Steve Wacker and his writers on 52 were just doing their own thing. That's why DiDio claims that Countdown was "52 done right" because it attempted to weave in and out of what was being published at the time and serve as the "spine" of the DCU.

Now, storywise, Countdown sucked and 52 was widely praised, but DiDio was thinking in terms of fulfilling an objective. Of course, eventually, Countdown didn't even do a very good job of being a spine beyond being a dumb story.

DiDio has lots of ideas, but they rarely pan out the way he thinks they will. He's also very quick to abandon things wholesale rather than make tweaks and course corrections. Hence New 52 becoming DCYou becoming Rebirth -- all of which were DiDio ideas.

[SiegePerilous02]

Did the anti-Grayson/pro-Jason Todd sentiment come from Frank Miller?

I got the impression that Miller favored Jason over Dick with his Dark Knight work.

Maybe he did in the later DK works, but I always wondered if he intended the dead Robin in TDKR to be Dick, and changed it to Jason to be more in line with then-current DC. Especially as it was a response to the campy Adam West series, which obviously had Dick as Robin.
Carrie's arrival occurs while he is thinking about Dick's absence, so she seems to be filling the void Dick specifically left, not Jason. And at the time, I wouldn't think Jason was distinguishable enough from Dick to make him favorable to Miller.

[DrNewGod]

So, more observations as I distill comments:

• It's not so much that Didio is universally hated, but that he has discernible preferences, and seems both stubborn and abrasive
• DC fandom is highly fragmented, largely along opinions about legacy/continuity views, and each camp tends toward a militant bent
• Some of Didio's ideas simply don't do well, and he doesn't seem to learn from it

Two other opinions I noticed seem linked and worth thinking about:

• Didio seems to view DC characters in terms of IP, rather than relatable personas or venerated modern myths
• Some speculate that Didio attained/keeps his position because "must have something" on the higher ups.

It seems equally likely that Didio gained and holds his post primarily because he communicates about DC with DC's masters in terms of IP, whether that's the way that he actually views them or not. To TPTB at WB, DC's character inventory are merchandising engines, and little more. Didio's ability to talk to the upstairs people in Marketing terms probably makes him sound a lot more credible than creators trying to talk about DC's characters as modern demi-gods in an epic, ever-unfolding mythological saga. WB is not in the mythology building business, or at least, not as their primary activity.

So, going back to my original question, I guess I can see why some DC fans really dislike Didio. I can even see why some dislike him even if they agree with his preferences.

[Vakanai]

Even if you yourself are not interested in that aspect, I think it is fair to note that it is something that attracts a lot of people to the DC Universe. Like you said, different people look for different things.

I never implied that legacy wasn't an attraction for some fans. It obviously is. But it isn't all that DC's about, and some of us just don't care for it. Doesn't mean it isn't an integral part of DC, but it can still be a integral part while being something we can choose to avoid if we want to, just by reading some titles and not others.

Personally, as someone who doesn't follow Flash and couldn't care less about the Barry v Wally debate, I say if the market supports it let them both have their own solo Flash title. That way some fans have their legacy title, and others can avoid it.

[EsotericFailures]

It’s not difficult to adapt Wally’s story. If Marvel was able to make a Legacy character movie with Ant Man, Warner should be able to do the same thing with a character like Wally/The Flash.

Scott Lang begins Ant-Man without superpowers whilst a Wally Flash movie would presumably include his background as Kid Flash if it were comic book accurate, that makes it different to almost every other superhero movie if adapted accurately. It's not impossible to make a good Wally West Flash movie (the difference from other superhero movies is what would make it interesting from my pov) but I can see why Barry's simple origin story has appeal for DC execs looking to make movies and TV.

[Ascended]

So, more observations as I distill comments:[*]It's not so much that Didio is universally hated, but that he has discernible preferences, and seems both stubborn and abrasive [*]DC fandom is highly fragmented, largely along opinions about legacy/continuity views, and each camp tends toward a militant bent [*]Some of Didio's ideas simply don't do well, and he doesn't seem to learn from it

I'd say this sounds correct. Though I think its less that Didio has discernible preferences and more that he seems to act on them. I doubt anyone would hold his personal opinions against him (we all have our favorites) if he didn't appear to make business decisions based off them, rather than market research and clear business theory.

Two other opinions I noticed seem linked and worth thinking about:

• Didio seems to view DC characters in terms of IP, rather than relatable personas or venerated modern myths
• Some speculate that Didio attained/keeps his position because "must have something" on the higher ups.

I think that's also true, though I dont consider the first point to be a problem. He's not a creator or an editor, he's on the business end of the equation and I *want* him thinking of these characters as marketable IP's instead of "people." Thinking of these fictional constructs as individuals is for fans and creators; I want Didio finding new ways to bring these characters to new audiences and new ways to make money from them, not thinking about cool stories he could tell.

The second point I find to be highly unlikely. Didio is a businessman. So are his bosses. WB does not care about the creative side of this business and Didio needs to be able to speak to them in their language; accounting, marketing, revenue generation, supply-demand curves, etc. As long as the IP's are making the kind of money the company expects, WB doesn't care about the creative choices. Didio doesn't need dirt on anyone, he just has to turn a profit, and for the most part he's done that.

[Vampire Savior]

DiDio has lots of ideas, but they rarely pan out the way he thinks they will. He's also very quick to abandon things wholesale rather than make tweaks and course corrections. Hence New 52 becoming DCYou becoming Rebirth -- all of which were DiDio ideas.

I don't think this is accurate. I believe DCYou was Jim Lee's idea and Rebirth was most definitely Geoff Johns' idea. They did those initiatives for (what ended up being short term) sales boosts. Small tweaks weren't going to boost sales like a line wide relaunch would. Though, I guess DCYou wasn't totally a line wide relaunch. Just a mass change of direction. And you'll notice that DCYou was a flop out the gate because it wasn't a clear relaunch like New 52 and Rebirth.

[Frontier]

I don't think this is accurate. I believe DCYou was Jim Lee's idea and Rebirth was most definitely Geoff Johns' idea. They did those initiatives for (what ended up being short term) sales boosts. Small tweaks weren't going to boost sales like a line wide relaunch would. Though, I guess DCYou wasn't totally a line wide relaunch. Just a mass change of direction. And you'll notice that DCYou was a flop out the gate because it wasn't a clear relaunch like New 52 and Rebirth.

Yeah, I think Didio was much more creatively involved with stuff like the New Age of Heroes and Heroes in Crisis then he was Rebirth.

[DrNewGod]

I think that's also true, though I dont consider the first point to be a problem. He's not a creator or an editor, he's on the business end of the equation and I *want* him thinking of these characters as marketable IP's instead of "people." Thinking of these fictional constructs as individuals is for fans and creators; I want Didio finding new ways to bring these characters to new audiences and new ways to make money from them, not thinking about cool stories he could tell.

The second point I find to be highly unlikely. Didio is a businessman. So are his bosses. WB does not care about the creative side of this business and Didio needs to be able to speak to them in their language; accounting, marketing, revenue generation, supply-demand curves, etc. As long as the IP's are making the kind of money the company expects, WB doesn't care about the creative choices. Didio doesn't need dirt on anyone, he just has to turn a profit, and for the most part he's done that.

That's my point. I find the comments about blackmail unlikely and excessive, and Didio's (proported) view of the characters a sensible business perspective that his superiors can understand.

[Vampire Savior]

If DiDio's this great business mind, I have to ask...Why do his comics sell so poorly unless there is some special event or anniversary, and why is DC habitually behind Marvel Comics?

[The Darknight Detective]

If DiDio's this great business mind, I have to ask...Why do his comics sell so poorly unless there is some special event or anniversary, and why is DC habitually behind Marvel Comics?

Can't that be said for everyone who has held that position since the late '60s?

[Vampire Savior]

Can't that be said for everyone who has held that position since the late '60s?

Well, apparently they weren't good enough at business to turn their situation around. Someone was good enough at business (Stan Lee) to knock them out of the number one spot, though.

[Comic-Reader Lad]

I don't think this is accurate. I believe DCYou was Jim Lee's idea and Rebirth was most definitely Geoff Johns' idea. They did those initiatives for (what ended up being short term) sales boosts. Small tweaks weren't going to boost sales like a line wide relaunch would. Though, I guess DCYou wasn't totally a line wide relaunch. Just a mass change of direction. And you'll notice that DCYou was a flop out the gate because it wasn't a clear relaunch like New 52 and Rebirth.

Actually, it was Dan DiDio who decided on the Rebirth direction, specifically using the "Rebirth" name, and asked Geoff Johns to write the special.

I read an interview awhile back where it was specifically stated that resetting things with Rebirth was completely DiDio's idea. Geoff Johns actually needed to be convinced to do the special that kicked things off.

https://screenrant.com/geoff-johns-d...rth-explained/

DC Comics pleased many fans and skeptics with their DC Rebirth Special. Many of the comic universe's most popular characters were sort of brought back to basics - while setting up new storylines for a slate-wide Rebirth launch. But as it turns out, the special's writer, DC Comics Chief Creative Officer Geoff Johns, wasn't initially sold with the name Rebirth.

While at San Diego Comic-Con, Johns revealed that it took a little bit of convincing to get him on board with the name. Although DC Comics Co-Publisher Dan Didio endorsed the Rebirth title, Johns initially believed it was too similar to his past uses of the word on DC titles.

"The DC Rebirth Special… you know, my first reaction was, 'I don’t want to call anything Rebirth. That’s the name that’s on Green Lantern: Rebirth and Flash: Rebirth, I don’t want anything else to use it.'" Johns explained. "And [Dan DiDio] said, 'Yeah but it’s such a great name and it means so much.' And I said, 'Well, let me tell you what it means.' And the more I talked about what 'rebirth' the word meant to me, the problem was... Well actually, it would really work."

Once Johns got on board with the idea, he still desired to make sure the Rebirth title was used in a similar way across DC Comics' growing slate - which largely inspired the creation of the DC Rebirth Special.

"I said, 'Dan if you want to do this, I feel some ownership over the word, and I know what it means to me. And I really want to communicate what it means to me to all the creators and artists that will be working on this stuff, so that we can have a cohesive universe.'" Johns revealed. "And to do that, I needed to write something to kick it off, and I thought a one-shot."

"I said 'I’m going to write the BEST one-shot I could possibly write.'" Johns elaborated. "An issue that wouldn’t just, for me, put the heart back in the DCU, but make people almost cry, or cry when Wally West gets pulled out of the Speed Force. Because to me, I was like, 'I need a personification of what I’m feeling is lost, and I need to feel like it’s almost ripped away, then I need to feel like it’s not because it’s too strong and powerful to ever go away.' Once the story came to me, the story didn’t change from the day I pitched to Dan."

So, the Rebirth STORY was, of course, Geoff Johns', but the idea of restarting things to reconnect with fans was DiDio's because he said in another interview that when he was at a Comic Con during the DCYou phase, when the panel got around to talking about future developments for DCYou, many fans would get up and leave and no one seemed all that interested in it. That's what made him realize that things needed to change, which is what made him do the Rebirth direction.

[DrNewGod]

If DiDio's this great business mind, I have to ask...Why do his comics sell so poorly unless there is some special event or anniversary, and why is DC habitually behind Marvel Comics?

I never said that. What I said is that upstairs might find him more credible because he speaks Marketing instead of Fandom.

[Dred]

Can't that be said for everyone who has held that position since the late '60s?

I mean DC did better at some point in that timeline.

You know, when Harras was in charge of Marvel.

Wait a second...