The Didio thing...

[Dred]

Hence why I said he seems to go into praise even-handed. It's when people step away that we realize he's still waving the flag for a dud. Even if everyone involved sees a book is going to be DOA, his job is to get behind it, more than anybody else's.

I've seen him support lots of projects going on that turned out to be strong. Nobody likes to talk about those because it doesn't fit the narrative that he's DC's boogie man, one that I'm guilty of passing pushing in no small part. I really don't like the dude, but enthusiasm for new projects isn't a sin of his. At least that I've gleaned.

You're just putting your fingers in your ears at everything I say and completely changing my intent. This has nothing to do with "boogie man" or anything, it's a consistent behavior. It's lack of enthusiasm for good things that compounds the enthusiasm for bad things. Please take my whole statement as a whole rather than picking out single pieces and treating them like they stand alone as a criticism.

Didio does not go out of his way to support every single book across the line. He probably doesn't have the time to. He was notoriously quiet during Rebirth's launch as Geoff Johns went on the publicity tour, for instance. It is not the case you are trying to make.

[Frontier]

Has Didio ever said anything anti-Legion or JSA?

I only ask because of how long they've been gone by this point.

[DrNewGod]

Has Didio ever said anything anti-Legion or JSA?

I only ask because of how long they've been gone by this point.

I don't know, but comments here suggests that he doesn't like conflicting brands, so I can see him being a non-fan of JSA.

[The Darknight Detective]

I mean DC did better at some point in that timeline.

You know, when Harras was in charge of Marvel.

Wait a second...

Marvel was still kicking butt during that era. Except for a few brief moments, DC has been a distant second for a half of century and counting.

[Robanker]

You're just putting your fingers in your ears at everything I say and completely changing my intent. This has nothing to do with "boogie man" or anything, it's a consistent behavior. It's lack of enthusiasm for good things that compounds the enthusiasm for bad things. Please take my whole statement as a whole rather than picking out single pieces and treating them like they stand alone as a criticism.

Didio does not go out of his way to support every single book across the line. He probably doesn't have the time to. He was notoriously quiet during Rebirth's launch as Geoff Johns went on the publicity tour, for instance. It is not the case you are trying to make.

No, I'm not doing that at all but feel free to think that way. Yes, he doesn't have time to push everything, but he probably knows some books will need more support than others given internal data he has access to and years of experience. Back in the infinite crisis era, he pushed the new Blue Beetle book which got a lot of good word of mouth but no sales. I've heard a lot of the New Age of Heroes books getting good reception but nobody was buying them and that was his baby. There are other examples, but I'm a bit tired of arguing this point and, frankly, you're conflating your personal feelings on what's good or bad with his actions.

I think the New 52 sucked as a whole, but it saw the largest sales increase in years and brought acclaimed runs on Batman (which I overall didn't love) and Aquaman (which I adore) as well as some sleeper hits like Grayson. There are others, but my point is while I see that as a failure of a relaunch, to investors he was a big part of a sales boom and helped lay the framework that enabled the Aquaman run which became a billion dollar movie.

It's a mixed bag with Didio, one I don't think is worth keeping him over, but I don't see him consistently backing the wrong horse as you're stating. There are tons of creators who have spoken about how he was a big influence on getting them to sign on to a project or helping them form their pitch (Bendis reviving Young Justice and creating the Wonder Comics imprint were such a case). I think Dan also shot down Brett Booth's pitches for Wally, much to the dismay of his fans. If he has any consistency, it's that he's focused on the IP more than character. That's a different argument, however.

That's the last I'm going to say on the matter. Have a good day, dude.

[Ascended]

Has Didio ever said anything anti-Legion or JSA?

I only ask because of how long they've been gone by this point.

Nothing that stands out.

I'd assume he's not a big Legion fan, but only because he seems to dislike Silver Age Superman. But I dont think I've ever seen or heard him say anything about them either way.

The JSA......I feel like he's talked about them.....maybe back during the late 00's before they disappeared in the reboot? Could be totally wrong though. But if he did say anything about them, it wasn't positive or negative enough to stick in my mind.

[Vampire Savior]

I don't think DiDio is a Legion fan because he doesn't like the idea of the DCU having a discernible future, probably because of the thinking that it lowers drama and tension for stories that take place in the current time.

I don't know about the JSA, but he may not like them because he may feel they're old fashioned, and he prefers the Silver Age versions of characters like Flash and Green Lantern. He may feel the Golden Age versions just confuse things. I remember when those anniversary covers for Green Lantern came out, Alan Scott was only on like one of them, despite it technically being HIS anniversary. That probably tells you something.

[Vampire Savior]

Its not just this one publisher or this one industry, it's the whole landscape of print (though again, some parts are recovering). Its us, it's them, its the situation itself. Can't blame one guy for that, nor expect one person to fix it.

If anybody's going to fix the situation it's most likely going to need to be the people on top, like in DiDio's position. And yet, the situation persists. It's not the fans' responsibility to find a way to sell DC Comics. So yes, I blame him in particular for the current poor state of the comics industry, along with high ups at Marvel. Mostly all they've done is kept things the way they are without taking large enough steps to repair the industry. I suppose they haven't done much to fix things out of fear of alienating their hobby shop customers. They've even made things worse by playing into certain trends that overall damage the industry, like constant relaunches and reboots. That wasn't even going on back in the 90s, and the interval of time between reboots and relaunches gets shorter and shorter. Then there's the endless variant cover scams.

[skyvolt2000]

If DiDio's this great business mind, I have to ask...Why do his comics sell so poorly unless there is some special event or anniversary, and why is DC habitually behind Marvel Comics?

Well look at who tend to be the top book for DC-it's a BATMAN title.

If not him it's Superman, Barry & WW. It's a select group with Aquaman, Catwoman & Harley popping in.

Marvel it's a crap shoot at times. It can be Peter Parker, Steve Rodgers, X-Men pick a color, Carol, Thor, Jane Foster, Tony Stark or Black Panther. It just depends on what Batman related book and event is out at DC.

Marvel stance on variety has allowed them to beat up on DC at times. Even with Batman leading the way.

Yes Dc can say "we got Batman, Superman, Hal, Barry, Ollie, WW, Harley, Babs, Catwoman & crappy versions of Titans" all day long and "we are tops in pull lists." And be happy.
Problem is the variety from Marvel and others is killing everyone beneath those guys.

In others there is a book for SOMEONE at Marvel more than DC. Of course that tends to be a trade more than a floppy.

I mean DC did better at some point in that timeline.
You know, when Harras was in charge of Marvel.
Wait a second...

That would be Jenette Kahn & Paul Levitz

Under her watch we saw-
Teen Titans restart under Wolfman, Wein & Perez
John Stewart pulled out of limbo and took over as GL for a time
Crisis on Earths
Teen Titans grew up

Paul's watch
saw Hal got nuts
Superman killed
Milestone arrived
Catwoman solo run
Kyle, John & Guy held solo books
Batman broke his back
Aquaman had a long run
Young Justice arrived.
DC was in "better" hands from 1976-2009.

Bob's time at Marvel could not be blamed for them almost going out of business. OTHER factors beyond him caused that. Now you can blame him for that Clone mess.
However it was under his watch a certain run started. That set the seeds for some movie called Black Panther.

[skyvolt2000]

If anybody's going to fix the situation it's most likely going to need to be the people on top, like in DiDio's position. And yet, the situation persists. It's not the fans' responsibility to find a way to sell DC Comics. So yes, I blame him in particular for the current poor state of the comics industry, along with high ups at Marvel. Mostly all they've done is kept things the way they are without taking large enough steps to repair the industry. I suppose they haven't done much to fix things out of fear of alienating their hobby shop customers. They've even made things worse by playing into certain trends that overall damage the industry, like constant relaunches and reboots. That wasn't even going on back in the 90s, and the interval of time between reboots and relaunches gets shorter and shorter. Then there's the endless variant cover scams.

It's hard to do anything when you have to deal with FANS & Stores who will fight you every step of the way. See the Marvel backlash of 2016. How many fits over who was on the cover did we see?

What good is Archie Afterlife when you got too many stores REFUSING to sell it despite folks constantly asking for it?

Look at how much money Black Panther, GOTG & Carol Danvers made as movies. They are public enemy number one to certain sections of fandom.
Also who the public likes it not who the comic sector likes. See John Stewart.

Look at the New Age Heroes-where was the support by all those YELLING for new stuff?
Where was it for the likes of Scarlet Witch, Falcon, Luke Cage, Mr Miracle and the rest who many claimed were being denied because of Miles and Duke?

Because it's funny how many of these hated books have NO trouble selling as trades outside of comic book stores.
I have met WAY more Aquaman & Wicked & Divine fans who don't go to comic book stores than I have Hal Jordan fans.

I can go to comic con after comic con and see KIDS digging in bins for Wally West, Kyle, Falcon, Static and Fantastic Four.

Other companies are trying but we got too many fans who act like DC & Marvel are the only ones who make books. While the public has no trouble liking everything.

or guys like Dan-he has to decide who is he willing to serve. The entitlement fan/owner who is killing the industry or try to get new blood by changing the game.

If he hate Wally & Dick so much-can we get 1-2 OGN starring them once a year? Can we get a Cyborg one shot once a year? Do every book need 12 issues? Can we go digital first and trade later?

[Timber Wolf-By-Night]

Around the launch of the New 52, Didio anticipated questions about why there was no JSA book (or even any JSA, period) by saying they were retiring the concept of the Justice Society. The New 52 also launched with Justice League #1, by itself that week, amidst hype that these versions of the characters were this continuity's first super-heroes ever and when the rest of the line started, that super-heroes had only been around for five years and had started with the first appearance of New 52 Superman. So that meant that this New 52 universe had no Golden Age, and thus no Golden Age characters. Also, at some point Didio shared a photograph of some leftover storyboards from Infinite Crisis featuring status quos he wanted changed by IC as well as names of characters he wanted to die as casualties of said Crisis. Said list included a lot more names than we saw actually die, including Wildcat, Atom-Smasher, and IIRC, 'any remaining Infinity, Inc.' This is a guy who has seemed to want to wipe out any characters associated with Justice League International, the Titans/Teen Titans, and Young Justice that he either didn't care for or who were regarded as lower than B-list at best; wanting to wipe out any JSA/II/Earth-Two-related characters en masse just because...reasons he's never really adequately explained or justified just seems right up his alley.

Has anybody mentioned how, in the early days of his time as executive editor or whatever his role was, the random mass slaughter of C-level characters, characters from recently cancelled comics, and characters who hadn't appeared in years started up and then steadily increased in frequency until we got to things like Infinite Crisis, where characters would show up and die in the same panel? These weren't even happening in events exclusively; characters like Chronos/Gabriel Walker or the Firebrand whose title was cancelled after only nine issues would randomly show up in titles like Johns' JSA, only to die a page or two later. Or we'd presented with a list of characters who'd been killed off somewhere off-panel. Before the New 52 there was an aggressive attempt at 'thinning the herd', and that was before characters who were arguably bigger names started being targeted, no matter how much or how many fans loved them, for not being "unique enough" or being dismissed as "redundant." Shayera Thal, J'onn J'onzz, the few remaining Darkstars, Ralph Dibny, and Ted Kord were just a few victims of this.

I don't think Didio has actually said anything negative about the JSA and related characters, but that hasn't prevented them from being repeatedly treated negatively, either.

[Vampire Savior]

It's hard to do anything when you have to deal with FANS & Stores who will fight you every step of the way. See the Marvel backlash of 2016. How many fits over who was on the cover did we see?

What good is Archie Afterlife when you got too many stores REFUSING to sell it despite folks constantly asking for it?

Look at how much money Black Panther, GOTG & Carol Danvers made as movies. They are public enemy number one to certain sections of fandom.
Also who the public likes it not who the comic sector likes. See John Stewart.

I contend that a truly good business man would find a way to both effectively get the "public's" interest, and to sell to it, and not just people who frequent comic stores. I refuse to believe that is impossible, because I know it isn't. Someone is just going to have to take some intelligent risks to get that to happen. Even a bad business man should realize that comic shops are a dead end and sure path to death.

If DC was able to sell to the people who like characters like Captain Marvel, then the noisy comic book shop goers wouldn't matter at all (they already kinda' don't), or they would be drowned out by the people who like the character.

It's my personal opinion that DC's products generally wouldn't interest many people even if they had way more visibility. I don't believe DC's problem is just marketing, I generally think the products are also creatively ineffective.

[EsotericFailures]

All of the DCEU movies bar Justice League have been profitable, even BvS and Suicide Squad despite their terrible reviews. If anything I think Didio's problem is trying to create marketable products with little interest in the impact they have on the comics. Making Barbara Gordon Batgirl and erasing Oracle is the best example of this; it ruined a great character by undoing almost all her development just so she could get solo comics that would later be the basis for potential movies and TV.

Hard to know how much of this return to DC traditions is driven by Didio's support for previous versions and how much is driven by sales. Green Lantern Rebirth made DC a lot of money so bringing back Barry and Babsgirl must have seen like a good business move (a prediction that turned out correct, unfortunately).

[Dred]

We have no way of knowing if relaunches for Wally or Cass/Steph would've been more or less profitable. Hell it took Barry 3 relaunches and the biggest push in the industry besides Batman to get there. Babs still hasn't really matched Cass's numbers outside of very brief relaunch sales bumps. You can throw a #1 at anyone in a major title and get a sales bump, though.

[EsotericFailures]

I remember the sales for the Gail Simone Batgirl being far higher than the Steph run, despite the latter being way better. A lot of that was the New 52 reboot and all the Snyder tie ins.

I do agree with you. The big reason why legacy characters never do surpass their predecessors now is that whenever their sales go down they get axed fairly quickly. Whereas if the classic versions get bad sales they either get a relaunch or a period of hiatus. The Green Lantern franchise wasn't doing too well before the Morrison relaunch, yet only Hal got a book whilst Jessica and Simon are now relegated to supporting characters in other books.