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  1. #1
    Incredible Member Stigmazilla's Avatar
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    Default Ultron vs Thanos (MCU)

    Let's pretend Ultron won. He has his Vison body and has been ruling the Earth for three years when Thanos shows up going for the mind gem. Ultron has been preparing for an attack from space but doesn't know about Thanos himself. Can Ultron fend off the titan?

  2. #2
    Writer and editor KJS's Avatar
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    No - especially if Thanos has the other five Infinity Stones (though it's hard to say exactly where some of them would be, if Ultron had been ruling Earth for three years).

    The Outriders seemed to cause more problems than the Ultron drones (being able to scratch the Hulkbuster means being able to stomp the drones), but even if it was a closer call between the two sets of flunkies, Thanos w/ 5 Stones still >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ultron in Vision's body w/ 1 Stone.

    I can't think of anything Ultron could do in three years that would help him here. Granted, he might have come to learn about Wakanda in that time, but I can't see him conquering it.

    And that's without mentioning the Black Order.
    Last edited by KJS; 04-18-2019 at 02:57 AM.

  3. #3
    Super Moderator The Watcher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KJS View Post
    No - especially if Thanos has the other five Infinity Stones (though it's hard to say exactly where some of them would be, if Ultron had been ruling Earth for three years).
    If Ultron has been ruling Earth for three years and Dormamu hasn't absorbed the universe that means that despite all the destruction the three Sanctums are still intact to continue to act as wards against dimensional threats. So the Ancient One, or at least members of The Order of Kamar Taj, are still alive. Which leaves the Eye of Agamotto and the Time Stone within it in their hands.

    Whether Thanos has the Space Stone or not depends on if Odin, who Loki dumped in a retirement home in New York after Thor: The Dark World, is alive or dead. If Odin is still alive then Loki-As-Odin is still ruing Asgard and would probably be willing to hand over the Tesseract to appease Thanos. If Odin somehow died after Ultron's victory then his spell imprisoning Hela disperses and she's now ruling Asgard. Hela and Asgard's formidability could persuade Thanos to save collecting the Space Stone for last.

    The Guardians wouldn't have known about Thanos' plans if they had not literally run into Thor. Since Gamora, the only one who knows the Soul Stone's location, never goes to confront her father then Thanos only gets the Soul Stone if he can manage to find and catch her before she kills herself to keep her secrets.

    So at the beginning of the scenario Thanos at least has the Power Stone from Xandar and the Reality Stone from The Collector. He may or may not have the Space Stone. He likely doesn't have the Soul Stone. He definitely doesn't have the Mind Stone or the Time Stone.
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  4. #4
    Anyone. Anywhere.Anytime. Arsenal's Avatar
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    Only thing Thanos needs to beat Ultron are the power and reality stones. They effectively neutralize anything Ultron can throw at Thanos to prevent him from taking the stone.

  5. #5
    Writer and editor KJS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Watcher View Post
    So at the beginning of the scenario Thanos at least has the Power Stone from Xandar and the Reality Stone from The Collector. He may or may not have the Space Stone. He likely doesn't have the Soul Stone. He definitely doesn't have the Mind Stone or the Time Stone.
    I don't see why he wouldn't have the Time Stone.

    Sending Ebony Maw and Cull Obsidian was enough to get it, with Doctor Strange, Iron Man, Spider-Man and Wong trying to stop them. I can't see the Ancient One and her nameless allies being any more successful than those four.

    I'm also not actually sure the Ancient One would still be alive. She'd said that she was never able to see past the moment of her death, so she was always destined to die at that specific time. It was her unavoidable fate, regardless of circumstances.

  6. #6
    Super Moderator The Watcher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KJS View Post
    I don't see why he wouldn't have the Time Stone.

    Sending Ebony Maw and Cull Obsidian was enough to get it, with Doctor Strange, Iron Man, Spider-Man and Wong trying to stop them. I can't see the Ancient One and her nameless allies being any more successful than those four.

    I'm also not actually sure the Ancient One would still be alive. She'd said that she was never able to see past the moment of her death, so she was always destined to die at that specific time. It was her unavoidable fate, regardless of circumstances.
    The original post said that Ultron was preparing for an attack from space, so any forces of Thanos that try to land on Earth are going to be intercepted by Ultron's forces. So basically Ultron and his resources are unknowingly helping defend whoever has the Eye (probably Wong or Mordo if the Ancient One is dead) by interfering with those sent to grab it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Watcher View Post
    The original post said that Ultron was preparing for an attack from space, so any forces of Thanos that try to land on Earth are going to be intercepted by Ultron's forces. So basically Ultron and his resources are unknowingly helping defend whoever has the Eye (probably Wong or Mordo if the Ancient One is dead) by interfering with those sent to grab it.
    I know. And it largely depends on how Thanos goes about it as to how it plays out.

    If he wants the Mind Stone last (I'm unsure about this, so I'm just assuming it's the same scenario as the movie), he'd have to get the Time Stone first - and I don't see Ebony Maw and Cull Obsidian having any problem getting past Ultron's forces to get it, if they're tasked with doing so, let alone Thanos himself.

    Also, the manner in which Thanos and his cronies tend to arrive make it very difficult for Ultron to intercept.

    If he opens a portal (Tesseract's status depending), he could just rock up outside the Sanctum Sanctorum.

    If he comes in his ship, Ultron's forces aren't stopping that thing, and then the ship would just beam them down to the Sanctum's door.

    Really can't see how Ultron prepares to intercept either of those arrival methods. And then it's just a case of Obsidian tearing through the drones like butter, Maw TKing them away with ease, Midnight and Glaive running interference and, if he so pleases, Thanos doing whatever the hell he wants.

  8. #8
    Anyone. Anywhere.Anytime. Arsenal's Avatar
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    If Thanos felt like it, he could just turn Ultron and all his nearby drones into butterflies using the reality stone.

  9. #9

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    Ultron turned a city into a weaponized planet killer with like... 3 days of prep. Less than a week at best.

    Three years is a loooong time for a hyper intelligent AI. I dont think he wins, because IG is OP, but he would be some much more threatening than "Vision + some drones" in my opinion.
    "So full of hate were our eyes
    That none of us could see
    Our war would yield countless dead
    But never victory
    So let us cast arms aside
    And like discard our wrath
    Thou, in faith, will keep us safe
    Whilst we find the path"

    -The Covenant Writ of Union

  10. #10
    Anyone. Anywhere.Anytime. Arsenal's Avatar
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    Unless Ultron expands his reach into space in that time, I’m not sure what he could do to prep because he’ll have nothing to base his prep on outside of the attack on NY.

  11. #11
    A Zest 4 KungFu Treachery Darth Drizzle's Avatar
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    I dont know.

    Ultron with 3 years of prep is being underestimated here. He would have complete control over every weapon system on Earth, and he knows the Mind Stones true powers. If he knows a fight is coming he can take over the minds of all the Super Powered people left on Earth and make them Generals of his ever expanding drone army(because he now controls all factories on Earth). Ant Man/Wasp technology would be taken(via technopathy or Mind controlling Hank) and Yellojacket goo guns are back in play amongst other things.

    He can even go the Wanda/Quicksilver route and make new Super Powered people since human experiments and death rates don't bother him. And since he is far smarter than any of the people who made weapons or did the experiments (Mind Gem enhaned intelligence) it would be improved upon by magnitudes and success rates would be near perfect.

    Also every weapon or vehicle schematic by HYDRA/Stark/Wakanda would be his and also improved upon. So just like HYDRA used the Mind Stone to empower weapons Ultron could use it to empower his drones and other Earth based weapons making them much more dangerous than the Outriders/Chutari soldiers. So Infinty powered Helicarrires and Jump Jets, HYDRA Tanks, Wakanda Flyers, Ant Man/Wasp/Yellow Jacket and Iron Man suits are all possible.

    He knows about Vibranium so Wakanda would be found and exploited for resources as they have good tech but nothing to suggest Ultron can't take it over( or use the Mind Stone to persuade key people to sabatoge the country systems). Once Vibranium is his to use freely then any weapon/vehicle/Drone he creates would be a Infinity powered Vibranium wrapped monstrosity that would tear through everyone except Thanos with ease.

    Loki was able to talk to Thanos across the Galaxy using Telepathy via the Mind Gem and he had no Telepathy at all(his illusions are magic based). Ultron using his mind was simultaneously controlling dozens of drones doing multiple tasks, fighting Vision technologically throughout the entire Internet(which he took over completely), and physically fighting people like Thor. If he used the Mind Gem against Thanos with his Full attention I think he would win that fight as him eventually shaking off Mantis is a good feats but not casually talk across the Galaxy power focused by Ultrons fusion and Years worth of use of the Mind Stone.

    Basically if Ultron had access to Pym Tech, Vibranium, and all the schematics/blue prints from Sheild/HYDRA/Stark/Wakanda plus 3 years to experiment with all of it, then he can take care of Thanos and his forces as much less versatile forces have done it to variying degrees.

  12. #12

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    While I agree that Ultron with 3 years would be super scary, I dont agree that him controlling his drones was any sort of telepathy. That's just remote control like any other remote controlling tech. He can multitask well because he's a super computer.

    Mind controlling in general needed a physical touch with the mind stone.
    "So full of hate were our eyes
    That none of us could see
    Our war would yield countless dead
    But never victory
    So let us cast arms aside
    And like discard our wrath
    Thou, in faith, will keep us safe
    Whilst we find the path"

    -The Covenant Writ of Union

  13. #13
    Incredible Member Stigmazilla's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Drizzle View Post
    I dont know.

    Ultron with 3 years of prep is being underestimated here. He would have complete control over every weapon system on Earth, and he knows the Mind Stones true powers. If he knows a fight is coming he can take over the minds of all the Super Powered people left on Earth and make them Generals of his ever expanding drone army(because he now controls all factories on Earth). Ant Man/Wasp technology would be taken(via technopathy or Mind controlling Hank) and Yellojacket goo guns are back in play amongst other things.

    He can even go the Wanda/Quicksilver route and make new Super Powered people since human experiments and death rates don't bother him. And since he is far smarter than any of the people who made weapons or did the experiments (Mind Gem enhaned intelligence) it would be improved upon by magnitudes and success rates would be near perfect.

    Also every weapon or vehicle schematic by HYDRA/Stark/Wakanda would be his and also improved upon. So just like HYDRA used the Mind Stone to empower weapons Ultron could use it to empower his drones and other Earth based weapons making them much more dangerous than the Outriders/Chutari soldiers. So Infinty powered Helicarrires and Jump Jets, HYDRA Tanks, Wakanda Flyers, Ant Man/Wasp/Yellow Jacket and Iron Man suits are all possible.

    He knows about Vibranium so Wakanda would be found and exploited for resources as they have good tech but nothing to suggest Ultron can't take it over( or use the Mind Stone to persuade key people to sabatoge the country systems). Once Vibranium is his to use freely then any weapon/vehicle/Drone he creates would be a Infinity powered Vibranium wrapped monstrosity that would tear through everyone except Thanos with ease.

    Loki was able to talk to Thanos across the Galaxy using Telepathy via the Mind Gem and he had no Telepathy at all(his illusions are magic based). Ultron using his mind was simultaneously controlling dozens of drones doing multiple tasks, fighting Vision technologically throughout the entire Internet(which he took over completely), and physically fighting people like Thor. If he used the Mind Gem against Thanos with his Full attention I think he would win that fight as him eventually shaking off Mantis is a good feats but not casually talk across the Galaxy power focused by Ultrons fusion and Years worth of use of the Mind Stone.

    Basically if Ultron had access to Pym Tech, Vibranium, and all the schematics/blue prints from Sheild/HYDRA/Stark/Wakanda plus 3 years to experiment with all of it, then he can take care of Thanos and his forces as much less versatile forces have done it to variying degrees.
    This is more of what I was thinking of.

  14. #14
    A Zest 4 KungFu Treachery Darth Drizzle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Arbiter View Post
    While I agree that Ultron with 3 years would be super scary, I dont agree that him controlling his drones was any sort of telepathy. That's just remote control like any other remote controlling tech. He can multitask well because he's a super computer.

    Mind controlling in general needed a physical touch with the mind stone.
    The drones were technopathy controlled but the point is his "mind" or sentience is what made it happen and that is what the Stone would be working off of. Since this is Vision bodied Ultron he is connected to it and with 3 years of practice he can definitely use it better than Loki did and the Mind control needing touch was when it was encased in the Staff, not at full power. The Mind Stone itself was effecting multiple minds as in the Scene on the Ship where it cause the Avengers to nearly fight themselves before Banner grabbed it unconsciously.

    So Ultron imo with 3 years practice would be able to wield it like a telepath as being connected to it he would understand exactly what its full capabilities are and exploit them. Especially as the Mind Stone contains a Huge amount of knowledge/data in it, and Ultrons Super Computer brain can handle all the information it downloads into him he would be the smartest being in the Universe as well.

  15. #15
    Writer and editor KJS's Avatar
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    Thing is, granting Ultron these 3 years of prep and allowing him to do new things will significantly change the way in which Thanos goes about his assault - we can't just assume he'd go about things the same way. And it's fair to say that what Thanos is capable of with his resources and influence across the cosmos is far superior to what Ultron is capable of on Earth.

    Who's to say he doesn't bring Sanctuary II to Earth and use it to launch high-powered assaults on Ultron's main bases? Who's to say he doesn't throw Earth's moon at Ultron's forces if he gets the Tesseract? Or use the Reality Stone to just turn Ultron-Prime into a pebble? He could even recall Loki, use Ronan and his forces, and send the Black Order and Outriders all at once alongside them.

    Thanos has an uncanny knack of knowing where anything he needs is at any given time (he knew the Time Stone was in New York and he even knew where Vision was when he'd turned his transponder off). I see no issues with him getting the Tesseract again, as he knew Loki had it on board the Statesman, even when he was concealing it. And I really see no issues with him getting the Time Stone again first when he arrives on Earth - especially if, knowing Ultron's forces were defending Earth, he sent more than just Ebony Maw and Cull Obsidian to get it.

    It's really just "pick a scenario" and if Thanos takes it easy, Ultron could win. But it's probably fair to say that if Ultron is going all out, Thanos will too, otherwise it's an unbalanced scenario. And Thanos going all out would open a KEG of whoop-ass on Ultron's metal rear-end.

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