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  1. #1
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    Default The Bijuu vs the Valar

    (naruto)The Bijuu vs the Valar(Lotr)

    Who wins?

  2. #2
    Fantastic Member Harbinger19's Avatar
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    On the one hand, Naruto’s blitzing Middle Earth into the ground.

    On the other hand, given the whole “Maiar drags huge island around,” “continent wrecking wars” and so on, the Valar are probably throwing around as much or more firepower, particularly when it comes to people’s raw physical strength.*

    So I’m gonna tentatively back team Middle Earth even if you count Juubi in on this action. That said, it’s an interesting match and I could see Tailed Beast Bomb spam causing some pain/10 counts.

    *Granted we usually don’t have timespans on this stuff. Who knows how long the War of Wrath lasted, let alone the primordial creation fights with Melkor. Naruto could replicate similar levels of destruction with a bit of time.
    "What I sought, I could not obtain."

    "This is a meaningless battle. We are two madmen engaging in senseless folley."

    "I will kill, I will let live..."

    --Genuine Fake Priest Kotomine Kirei

  3. #3
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    All I'm seeing are some new pets for Tulkas to adopt.

  4. #4
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Back in the day, the battles between Melkor and the Valar basically reshaped the world (also shook it). Melkor also ran around doing stuff like 'breaking down mountain ranges' and 'altering the coastline' and 'filling in oceans' because he was a petty little child who felt that anything they made, he had to deface ie, he did it for shits and giggles, not as a gigantic feat that was part of a master plan. It kind of shows the power the Aratar (the most powerful of the Valar) possess.

    I'll also note that, in canon, Maiar like Arien do stuff like 'hang out in the sun'. Arien isn't exactly on the same level of oomph as the Valar, much less the Aratar.

    How does this stack up to the Bijuu? No idea; I'm totally unfamiliar with the other side of this match. ^_^
    Last edited by Sharpandpointies; 04-25-2019 at 04:47 AM. Reason: Clarity.
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers."
    - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move."
    - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman."
    - Pendaran

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by wjowski View Post
    All I'm seeing are some new pets for Tulkas to adopt.
    they would be great pets.

  6. #6
    Fantastic Member Harbinger19's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharpandpointies View Post
    Back in the day, the battles between Melkor and the Valar basically reshaped the world (also shook it). Melkor also ran around doing stuff like 'breaking down mountain ranges' and 'altering the coastline' and 'filling in oceans' because he was a petty little child who felt that anything they made, he had to deface ie, he did it for shits and giggles, not as a gigantic feat that was part of a master plan. It kind of shows the power the Aratar (the most powerful of the Valar) possess.

    I'll also note that, in canon, Maiar like Arien do stuff like 'hang out in the sun'. Arien isn't exactly on the same level of oomph as the Valar, much less the Aratar.

    How does this stack up to the Bijuu? No idea; I'm totally unfamiliar with the other side of this match. ^_^

    The Bijuu with more feats (8 Tails, 9-Tails) tend to be nuking mountains and carving out valleys all while fighting at some degree of hypersonic speed.

    10 Tails is significantly above that. Not “bust up Beleriand” level but could cause that much wreckage with enough time.

    Actually, if we assume Ancalagon’s death fall on Thangorodrim was 3 Everest sized mountains, that should clinch the firepower/timespan in the Valar’s favor. So I’ll back Middle Earth now solidly.
    "What I sought, I could not obtain."

    "This is a meaningless battle. We are two madmen engaging in senseless folley."

    "I will kill, I will let live..."

    --Genuine Fake Priest Kotomine Kirei

  7. #7
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Just going to toss this in for clarity.

    That war that went on for years and years, the war that ended with the release of the flying dragons and Ancalagon that drove back the army of the West, that war that ended with Ancalagon's gigantic falling butt wiping out three mountains and Beleriand itself sinking due to the enormous amounts of boom unleashed?

    No Valar.

    The Valar never fought in the War of Wrath. It was all Maiar, Vanyar Eldar, and Noldor Eldar (from Valinor), likely in that order of puissance. Eönwë ran that show -- Herald of Manwë, Armsmaster of Valinor, and likely the dude to be voted 'Maiar Most Likely To Actually Stand A Small Chance Against One Of The Fighting Valar In A Tussle', but still...Maiar.

    Morgoth never got involved as well; he spent the entire time ordering his armies around from the safety of his basement.

    No, the 'great powers' involved in that war were the Maiar, the dragons, the Balrogs, likely the Vanyar Eldar (who, by Tolkien's accounts as I recall, were kind of a bunch of hardcore ass-kickers once they got off their partying duffs and decided to fight), and Eärendil (possibly with SDF-1 reflex cannon Silmaril, depending on whether we're talking Tolkien's interpretation or Pendaran's) backed up by a bunch of Probably-Maiar-in-Eagle-form (so, more Maiar). The Valinor Noldor would have been pretty tough as well, but still.

    And they STILL sank a continent (edit: in Pendaran's version? Eärendil. All Eärendil).

    No, when the Valar themselves actually went to war with Melkor - not his armies, but HIM - they flipping well shook the entire world while reshaping the area in which they fought. And decided 'We're not doing that again, because collateral.' Hence the Maiar being the heavy hitters in the War of Wrath, which STILL sunk a continent, and hence the Valar deciding after THAT war, 'Okay, enough of this crap, no more wars of Powers, period.' <-- actually only half the reason they didn't send a whole bunch of dudes to kick Sauron's shadowy butt, but that's neither here nor there.

    They're rather beyond mountain busting, as we might put it. I mean, it's a thing that back in the day when they were working on the world, they would raise up mountain ranges (ie, not just a mountain, but the entire RANGE of mountains) and Melkor would flatten them out again, just out of spite (Melkor was a sad little shit, really...setting raw power aside, Sauron is a far more 'impressive' villain than a guy who essentially is a childish psychopath).
    Last edited by Sharpandpointies; 04-25-2019 at 11:18 AM.
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers."
    - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move."
    - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman."
    - Pendaran

  8. #8
    Watashi ga Kita! The Dog's Avatar
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    So... another intentional stomp against Naruto by snoke?
    Critics who treat adult as a term of approval, instead of as a merely descriptive term, cannot be adult themselves. To be concerned about being grown up, to admire the grown up because it is grown up, to blush at the suspicion of being childish; these things are the marks of childhood and adolescence.
    - C.S. Lewis

  9. #9
    Astonishing Member Lord Falcon's Avatar
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    I don't think so. Lord of the Rings before the First Age has tons of variance in power needing special understanding of context compared to typical combat feats of other works. From the sound of it thr Bijuu might be better matched against the Maiar, the next step down the power ring in the LOTRverse.

  10. #10
    Cruel and Unusual Twickster's Avatar
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    So... how will LOTR address the massive, massive speed gap?

  11. #11
    Astonishing Member Lord Falcon's Avatar
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    Sounds like they could just tank whatever the Bijuu dish out. They operate as a level where they could just absorb it, assuming their speed is actually slower.

    Given the incredibly vague descriptions involved with LOTR history stuff, speed is often left by the wayside.

  12. #12
    Cruel and Unusual Twickster's Avatar
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    They can just tank an indefinite amount of mountainbusters to the face delivered by beings which move at multiples of mach?

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Twickster View Post
    They can just tank an indefinite amount of mountainbusters to the face delivered by beings which move at multiples of mach?
    The Maiar sank a continent and had dudes in their armies that crush multiple mountains just by dying.

    The Valar are well above that. They can throw the whole world on it's head and chill in the sun. It's Class 100 minimum nonsense.

    So yeah, they can tank it indefinitely at Valar level methinks.
    "So full of hate were our eyes
    That none of us could see
    Our war would yield countless dead
    But never victory
    So let us cast arms aside
    And like discard our wrath
    Thou, in faith, will keep us safe
    Whilst we find the path"

    -The Covenant Writ of Union

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