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  1. #1
    The Fastest Post Alive! Buried Alien's Avatar
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    Default JUSTICE LEAGUE # 22: after 34 years, the background of COIE finally makes sense

    Anybody read JUSTICE LEAGUE # 22, released yesterday?

    Not exactly a lot of action and adventure, and the Justice League itself doesn't even appear, but we finally DO get some clarity (or more confusion, depending on how you see things) on the origins of the Monitor, Anti-Monitor, and the Multiverse. It also reconciles Marv Wolfman's origins of the Monitor and Anti-Monitor from COIE with Grant Morrison's take in FINAL CRISIS/MULTIVERSITY, Geoff Johns' take in DARKSEID WAR, and Scott Snyder's from DARK NIGHTS: METAL. If you're into the whole cosmology/chronology of the DC Multiverse, this was quite a read. If none of that floats your boat, however, it's better to steer clear.

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  2. #2
    Fantastic Member Vampire Savior's Avatar
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    Thanks for letting me know. I'll check it out.

    My personal favorite version is the Marv Wolfman take. It's the most interesting and has a lot of fascinating mystery to it. Like... why exactly does looking at the beginning of time cause an Anti-Matter universe to be created and why are the Monitor and Anti-Monitor even "born?" Yet, somehow, it seems perfectly acceptable that is what would happen if you looked at the beginning of time. I actually think it's brilliant and I don't use that word lightly.

    I don't like the other versions. The Geoff Johns one is the worst. It's terrible. It lacks all the fascinating nuance of Wolfman's take and just makes it bland.

    On a completely other note. I don't like this Justice League. Why are there so many issues where the League isn't in it? Like, Legion of Doom issues and stuff?

  3. #3
    The Fastest Post Alive! Buried Alien's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vampire Savior View Post
    Thanks for letting me know. I'll check it out.

    My personal favorite version is the Marv Wolfman take. It's the most interesting and has a lot of fascinating mystery to it. Like... why exactly does looking at the beginning of time cause an Anti-Matter universe to be created and why are the Monitor and Anti-Monitor even "born?" Yet, somehow, it seems perfectly acceptable that is what would happen if you looked at the beginning of time. I actually think it's brilliant and I don't use that word lightly.
    Somehow, JUSTICE LEAGUE # 22 is able to reconcile all the versions of the Monitor's and Anti-Monitor's origins up to now. I didn't think it was possible to unsnarl all that in any kind of coherent way, but Tynion somehow pulled it off.

    I don't like the other versions. The Geoff Johns one is the worst. It's terrible. It lacks all the fascinating nuance of Wolfman's take and just makes it bland.
    Johns' version is accounted for (mainly in the name "Mobius" for the Anti-Monitor), but not emphasized.

    On a completely other note. I don't like this Justice League. Why are there so many issues where the League isn't in it? Like, Legion of Doom issues and stuff?
    The Legion features in this issue too, though the League doesn't. I know what you mean: the Justice League almost seems like an occasional sideshow in their own title these days.

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  4. #4
    Incredible Member Robanker's Avatar
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    It made a surprising amount of sense and really made the Anti-Monitor "click" for me, something no writer's been able to do thus far.

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Robanker View Post
    It made a surprising amount of sense and really made the Anti-Monitor "click" for me, something no writer's been able to do thus far.
    Me, too.

    I love the sweep of Mobius The Anti-Monitor's story now.

    So, from the looks of it, after The Fall, The Anti-Monitor is reborn on Qward's moon and then comes in contact with Metron and regains The Anti-Life Equation and becomes the engine of destruction from the original Crisis.

    That's wrapping it all up pretty nicely.

  6. #6

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    Does anybody love the giant robot version of The Anti-Monitor from the Green Lantern TAS?

    Watching with my kids now. Awesome.

  7. #7
    The Fastest Post Alive! Buried Alien's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bored at 3:00AM View Post
    Me, too.

    I love the sweep of Mobius The Anti-Monitor's story now.

    So, from the looks of it, after The Fall, The Anti-Monitor is reborn on Qward's moon and then comes in contact with Metron and regains The Anti-Life Equation and becomes the engine of destruction from the original Crisis.

    That's wrapping it all up pretty nicely.
    It also finally gives the Anti-Monitor a discernible motive for destroying the Multiverse beyond, "I'm evil and I destroy the Multiverse," which has been the character's biggest weakness since his conception. Now, there's an actual Cain and Abel vibe between the Anti-Monitor and the Monitor.

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  8. #8
    Fantastic Member Vampire Savior's Avatar
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    It was a surprisingly interesting story.

    Also, I did not personally care for the robot Anti-Monitor from the Green Lantern cartoon. Making him a robot built by Krona (I think that's how it went if I recall correctly) dumbed the concept of the character down quite a bit, in my opinion. I would have preferred if he was just the regular Anti-Monitor with a story to suit him. I don't recall that cartoon using Qwardians.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vampire Savior View Post
    It was a surprisingly interesting story.

    Also, I did not personally care for the robot Anti-Monitor from the Green Lantern cartoon. Making him a robot built by Krona (I think that's how it went if I recall correctly) dumbed the concept of the character down quite a bit, in my opinion. I would have preferred if he was just the regular Anti-Monitor with a story to suit him. I don't recall that cartoon using Qwardians.
    The Qwardians would have been in the third season with John Stewart pursuing Hal Jordan after being framed by Sinestro.

    I think someone is going to manage to fit his robot body somewhere.

    I WANT A GIANT ROBOT FIGHT!

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buried Alien View Post
    It also finally gives the Anti-Monitor a discernible motive for destroying the Multiverse beyond, "I'm evil and I destroy the Multiverse," which has been the character's biggest weakness since his conception. Now, there's an actual Cain and Abel vibe between the Anti-Monitor and the Monitor.

    Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)
    The Cain & Abel vibes were spot on.

    Not sure The World Forger has any previous incarnation. I think he's brand new.

    I thought that Hawkman was the World Forger, but I think he's definitely not now. or was.

  11. #11
    Spectacular Member qwertyuiop1998's Avatar
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    Actually still have some details not coordination with other origins.But still makes everything more clarity,
    My personally headcanon(Combination those origins)
    Overvoid sent a probe,And the probe been rented by perpetua whom created DCU,Creating Monitor AM WG three brothers
    And later,those brothers found out they mother's plan,and monitor planning made signal the source,then perpetua been imprisoned,But AM antiuniverse become wasteland due to this action.So AM hating monitor,He seeking knowledge journey made he find the ALE,And merged with it,Then initiate the COIE
    Between the two brothers feud,WG been killed by his pet barbatos in some point
    Last edited by qwertyuiop1998; 04-19-2019 at 06:04 AM.
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  12. #12
    The Fastest Post Alive! Buried Alien's Avatar
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    I've been reading it again and again since yesterday and just engrossed and stunned. Who would have figured that 34 years worth of confusion over the Monitors and their relation to the origins of the DC Multiverse would be quietly resolved in a seemingly unremarkable, unheralded single issue of the JUSTICE LEAGUE series?

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  13. #13
    Mighty Member Jody Garland's Avatar
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    I enjoyed the issue as another of the fun cosmology issues Snyder has done. I don't think he's up to the level of Morrison in regards to a cosmology that has that je nes sai quoi that makes it feel cosmic and cosmological. Rather, it's like watching a blockbuster writer desperately try to ape Englehart and Starlin. I don't mean that as an insult either- it's fun.

    The new background for the Anti-Monitor, though, did catch my eye as elegantly explaining COIE in a way that didn't rob it of its almost archetypal nature. I also liked the clear delineation between the purposes of the Dark Multiverse, the positive Multiverse and the Anti-Matter Universe. Having it spelled out on panel was good.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buried Alien View Post
    I've been reading it again and again since yesterday and just engrossed and stunned. Who would have figured that 34 years worth of confusion over the Monitors and their relation to the origins of the DC Multiverse would be quietly resolved in a seemingly unremarkable, unheralded single issue of the JUSTICE LEAGUE series?

    Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)
    See I'm thinking the opposite, Snyder is pulling a Hickman with this joint and these callbacks he's doing with Crisis lore is going to reach its peak with some event
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  15. #15
    The Fastest Post Alive! Buried Alien's Avatar
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    We should note that this particular issue wasn't written by Scott Snyder, but by James Tynion IV.

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