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  1. #1696
    Astonishing Member AJBopp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Midvillian1322 View Post
    Yea you say that but alot of people dont agree. Including the directors. So yea you can keep saying it but you dont know anything more then any of us. You just interpreted what the TAO was saying in a different way then alot of people. But yea this argument has been done 1000x on here so let's move on.
    1) The directors didn't write the story

    2) The directors shot an entirely new scene for the explicit purpose of emphasizing that there are no alternate timelines.

    But I agree, let's move on.
    Why yes, I AM a Mark Goodson/Bill Toddman production.

  2. #1697
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    Quote Originally Posted by AJBopp View Post
    "No alternate timelines" was the fundamental basis of the story. If future shows change that, it's a retcon.
    No, no it wasn't. Inability to alter the past to affect the present was the fundamental basis of the heist. That's why Hulk dismisses killing baby Thanos out of hand (among other reasons), and that's how the universe didn't explode when Thanos and his forces died, or when a Loki escaped with the space gem.

    There are clearly alternate timelines out there. The Avengers prevented some, but not all.

    The Ancient One brings up the threat of alternate timelines, of her history unfolding differently because of the lack of the timestone. Note that she treats Bruce's time as a seperate creature from her own, because she's already from an alternate timeline from him.

    Quote Originally Posted by Midvillian1322 View Post
    In 2012 where were the Pym Particles? Maybe on the other side of the country in San Fransico(That's where Hank and Scott lived right?). Hank had a stash sure but his company didnt have acess to it. So they woulda had to fly to San fransico and break into his house. and then jump again back to another time to get the cube.
    Scott knew where they were/would have been. Not saying it would have been too easy, but you'd think that it would have been safer than jumping decades into the past.

  3. #1698
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Cool Thatguy View Post
    Scott knew where they were/would have been. Not saying it would have been too easy, but you'd think that it would have been safer than jumping decades into the past.
    It wasn't enough to get particles, because they mainly needed the Tesseract, with which Loki had already scampered in the time and place they were standing. They needed a specific time and location where both additional particles, and the Tesseract were close by.

  4. #1699
    Extraordinary Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    In regards to Spidey joking, he does it some (and yeah, the movie references have been overblown by the fandom, since only uses his "remember that movie..." lines to set up plans he has and Fury commenting that he has reputation of being a Star Wars fan -- it's not that huge an aspect of the character), but this version does write more to the rookie aspect of the character, so gets more humor from that then from wisecracking. That's fine. I mean, look at the original comics; while Spidey might comment on the ironic situations and problems he finds, he's not the comedian that he would become in later installments and adaptations.
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  5. #1700
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    In regards to Spidey joking, he does it some (and yeah, the movie references have been overblown by the fandom, since only uses his "remember that movie..." lines to set up plans he has and Fury commenting that he has reputation of being a Star Wars fan -- it's not that huge an aspect of the character), but this version does write more to the rookie aspect of the character, so gets more humor from that then from wisecracking. That's fine. I mean, look at the original comics; while Spidey might comment on the ironic situations and problems he finds, he's not the comedian that he would become in later installments and adaptations.
    It feels more to me that they're just not really writing Holland's Peter as a quipster more then they're using it to emphasize his rookie status which is already covered in different ways. Even if Lee/Ditko Peter wasn't as much of a wisecracker as he is now, it is now generally regarded as a major element of the character.

    Although at this point if he were to start quipping people would probably assume he's emulating Stark.

  6. #1701
    Extraordinary Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    It feels more to me that they're just not really writing Holland's Peter as a quipster more then they're using it to emphasize his rookie status which is already covered in different ways.
    Okay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Even if Lee/Ditko Peter wasn't as much of a wisecracker as he is now, it is now generally regarded as a major element of the character.
    Fair enough, but does that make it bad in and of itself if it doesn't get a lot of focus? The Raimi movies are considered some of the best takes on the character and they downplayed the wisecracking a bit. I mean, all the movies have focused on certain aspects of the characters and left others out or by the wayside.

    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Although at this point if he were to start quipping people would probably assume he's emulating Stark.
    Well, it's the MCU; everyone has one-liners or does humor in one way or another.
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  7. #1702
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    Fair enough, but does that make it bad in and of itself if it doesn't get a lot of focus? The Raimi movies are considered some of the best takes on the character and they downplayed the wisecracking a bit. I mean, all the movies have focused on certain aspects of the characters and left others out or by the wayside.
    I thought the problem with the Raimi movies was that Spidey quipped but Tobey just didn't have the delivery to pull it off.
    Well, it's the MCU; everyone has one-liners or does humor in one way or another.
    Which makes it kind of more noticeable that Spidey really doesn't as much.

  8. #1703
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    With MCU Spidey they really play up the sweet-innocent-kid vibe, resulting in someone who is more Billy Batson than comicbook Spider-Man. With comicbook Spider-Man, you get the vibe that he's never completely left behind the guy who let a crook get away because he was pissed off. He compensates for that tendency, arguably even overcompensates, but that douchebag is still somewhere in there, and it comes out in the form of quips. There's nothing like that with MCU Spidey. He is innocence personified.

  9. #1704
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    One more question (and forgive me for not scouring 114 pages for it): Where did Old Steve get a bright, shiny shield to give the Falcon?

    Last I remember, the one he had looked like the second-most popular pizza on the buffet when Thanos was done with it. That's before we even talk about Cap not taking it into the past with him.

  10. #1705
    Invincible Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelC View Post
    With MCU Spidey they really play up the sweet-innocent-kid vibe, resulting in someone who is more Billy Batson than comicbook Spider-Man. With comicbook Spider-Man, you get the vibe that he's never completely left behind the guy who let a crook get away because he was pissed off. He compensates for that tendency, arguably even overcompensates, but that douchebag is still somewhere in there, and it comes out in the form of quips. There's nothing like that with MCU Spidey. He is innocence personified.
    Yeah, not giving the MCU Spider-Man an origin story does sort of change the character. Uncle Bens death is the defining moment for the comic character, and it's pretty glossed over in the MCU. Not that I entirely blame them as I think we've had the Spider-Man orign done to death... but you pay the price with the character losing some of his edge. They get enough right that it doesn't bother me... but I can't help but wonder what the MCU version would be like if they didn't gloss over that particular chapter of the characters life.

  11. #1706
    Invincible Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    It feels more to me that they're just not really writing Holland's Peter as a quipster more then they're using it to emphasize his rookie status which is already covered in different ways. Even if Lee/Ditko Peter wasn't as much of a wisecracker as he is now, it is now generally regarded as a major element of the character.

    Although at this point if he were to start quipping people would probably assume he's emulating Stark.
    I think the reasons the character quips has evolved over the years. Initially it was probably to convey how relatively young, inexperienced, and immature he was. Early Spider-Man was arguably sort of a jerk. As you might expect from a fairly young kid dealing with guilt issues and such. As he got older and more experienced, I think he started to intentionally talk a lot as a way to keep his off balance to a degree... get under their skin and maybe throw them off. It went from somewhat of a personality flaw to sort of a psychological weapon he just sort of naturally employed.

    But in the MCU, like you said, it's mostly showing he's a rookie kid who is probably just dealing with his nerved the best way he knows how.

  12. #1707
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    How much game has 100+ year old Cap got?

    He looks all aged and frail by the lake. Nonetheless, he sneaks into property with nobody realizing he's there.

    Stark's place. The hyper-paranoid, infinitely resourced Stark. Who built a house for his wife and child. That he loves more than life.

    Just gotta think getting a lakeside view there without permission is no small feat.

    So was Steve sandbagging?

  13. #1708
    King of Wakanda Midvillian1322's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrNewGod View Post
    How much game has 100+ year old Cap got?

    He looks all aged and frail by the lake. Nonetheless, he sneaks into property with nobody realizing he's there.

    Stark's place. The hyper-paranoid, infinitely resourced Stark. Who built a house for his wife and child. That he loves more than life.

    Just gotta think getting a lakeside view there without permission is no small feat.

    So was Steve sandbagging?
    Steve escaped Shield HQ taking out a quinjet on the pay out. He also with the help of Bucky took out Tony greatest creation his suit. Steve has always been crafty. Without further explanation we cant even agree on how he might have got there. Walked in or Jumped back from another timeline.
    Last edited by Midvillian1322; 08-17-2019 at 09:06 PM.

  14. #1709
    Extraordinary Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I thought the problem with the Raimi movies was that Spidey quipped but Tobey just didn't have the delivery to pull it off.
    Well, he does a bit. Some of the jokes are just weak, others are okay. IMHO, while Spidey doesn't joke as much (and to be fair, in the comics, he does shut up when things get serious, which does happen a lot in the movies), the movies are still humorous, so it still works.

    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Which makes it kind of more noticeable that Spidey really doesn't as much.
    His humor is more situational. It creates a similar tone to the source material in a different way.

    Quote Originally Posted by DrNewGod View Post
    One more question (and forgive me for not scouring 114 pages for it): Where did Old Steve get a bright, shiny shield to give the Falcon?

    Last I remember, the one he had looked like the second-most popular pizza on the buffet when Thanos was done with it. That's before we even talk about Cap not taking it into the past with him.
    Presumably from the splinter timeline he created when he lived his life with Peggy (or one of the other timelines he returned the Stones to).
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  15. #1710
    King of Wakanda Midvillian1322's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    Well, he does a bit. Some of the jokes are just weak, others are okay. IMHO, while Spidey doesn't joke as much (and to be fair, in the comics, he does shut up when things get serious, which does happen a lot in the movies), the movies are still humorous, so it still works.



    His humor is more situational. It creates a similar tone to the source material in a different way.



    Presumably from the splinter timeline he created when he lived his life with Peggy (or one of the other timelines he returned the Stones to).
    This...... it's all situational. Same thing with Thor. Thor isnt out there making non stop wise cracks and jokes. It's all situational. Garfield had the quipping down perfect but I'll take Holand in every other category

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