What If The New Teen Titans Generation Succeeded The JLA After CoIE?

[Digifiend]

This wouldn't be the case for every character who had a title at that time. Silver Age characters such as Hal Jordan, would still resume their titles as they lack a real legacy counterpart (unless you count John or Guy, but I always considered them to be roughly the same age as Hal).

You're right about GL - the legacy characters there are Kyle, Simon and Jessica - but Kyle wasn't introduced until the 90s and the other two aren't even a decade old.

[SiegePerilous02]

Agreed. Everybody knew who Clark and Bruce were by 1985, while many were familiar with Diana as Wonder Woman thanks to Lynda Carter. Now the other DC superheroes' secret identities were unknown to the vast majority of America (except for Dick Grayson, but the average person only knew of him as Robin), but definitely was not the case regarding the Trinity.

And at that stage of the game, the Titans were the hottest DC property as the Titans. Donna doesn't need to become Wonder Woman, because she was already part of a book that was more popular to the comics crowd as Wonder Girl! Plus, if the Wonder Woman reboot had been better planned to accommodate Donna, they would have had two viable characters/brands instead of one. Donna and the Titans still continued on for a while as popular even with that cluster. Why trade one for another when you can have both?

It's why Marv and George were given the go-ahead to do COIE, to make everything in line with NTT/Marvel. The Titans becoming the JL would have been somewhat of a step down at that time. It's unthinkable now, but I imagine Nightwing and Batman were equally viable to them at that point, if not more so the former before Frank Miller came along. Plus Wolfman and Perez weren't interested in inviting comparisons to the JL to begin with. Perez said so in his afterward to the Judas Contract, which is why they wrote Wally out and made Dick Nightwing, and made the majority of the lineup non-League affiliations (Vic, Kory, Raven, Terra, Jericho). And Gar wasn't as tied down to the Doom Patrol as the rest were to the League. So if they were gonna move the DCU forward with a new generation as the focus, having the Titans stop being the Titans doesn't seem in the cards with the creators that made the property hot to begin with.

[Kaijudo]

As others have alluded to, I think the nostalgia factor is just too great to have any change of that magnitude permanently stick. Not to discount it as a good idea (it is, because god forbid comics move forward vs. stay in place (coughWallyWestcough!)), but I could see it lasting a year, maybe two, before gravity would've shifted the next-gen characters back to "not a sidekick, but not taking the mantle" limbo and the main characters reasserted themselves. Too many people know Batman as Bruce, Superman as Clark, Wonder Woman as Diana, and Aquaman as a blonde dude (speaking in early post-Crisis, pre-Momoa terms here).

Honestly, it'd be a great idea for a weekly series, a la 52, where the heroes collectively disappear and Dick, Donna, etc, have to step up, but keep the main JL book Clark, Bruce, etc. and keep alluding to the year they were gone or something.

[Mutant God]

I have been toying with this alternate history scenario for quite a while now, in which after the culmination of their Crisis on Infinite Earths event, the legacy, or sidekick generation takes over the roles of the more established heroes of the DC Universe. Dick Grayson becomes Batman. Donna Troy becomes Wonder Woman. Wally West goes down the same road that he did in our timeline. Kal El dies instead of Kara Zor El in CoIE #7 and Supergirl becomes the matriarch of the Superman franchise as Superwoman. These former sidekicks would form the new Justice League of America, along with leftovers from Infinity Inc, The Outsiders, and the New Teen Titans.

This paradigm shift would be seen in the media as well. Dick Grayson would be the Batman introduced in Tim Burton's eponymous 1989 film of the same name, etcetera.

This wouldn't be the case for every character who had a title at that time. Silver Age characters such as Hal Jordan, would still resume their titles as they lack a real legacy counterpart (unless you count John or Guy, but I always considered them to be roughly the same age as Hal). A select few older characters who have had never truly felt great success in the past, such as Aquaman or Green Arrow, would continue their mantles for a select period of time. The legacy characters in this new continuity, who haven't been killed off or retired, would form a new, contemporary iteration of the Justice Society.

Would you have liked this to have happened in retrospect? Do you think this would have succeeded?

Agreed. Plus I'd like to see it be a little more complete with the following:


Aquaman(Garth)
Batman(Dick)
Batwoman(Barbara)
Flash(Wally)
Green Arrow(Roy)
Hawkman(Charlie)
Superwoman(Kara)
Wonder Woman(Donna)

Plus I'd add in:
Dr. Light(Kimiyo)
Firestorm
Green Lantern(Hal)
Vixen
Zatanna

Recently I was thinking about an Elseworld where many of the adult heroes died in a war with Darkseid (who himself died leaving his powers go to an another villain), and after a few years teen heroes/sidekicks take over the mantles of the heroes who died, even ones who didn't have a sidekick, and I put them into teams:

Justice League:
Batman – Dick Grayson
Superman – Connor Kent
Wonder Woman – Donna Troy
Flash – Wally West
Green Lantern (Rayner) – Jessica Cruz*
Aquaman – Garth
Steel – Cyborg
Animal Man – Beast Boy
Shazam – Mary Marvel

Outsiders:
Mr. Terrific – Tim Drake
Black Lightning – Jessica Pierce
Martian Manhunter - M'gann M'orzz
Blue Beetle – Jaime Reyes*
Atom – Ryan Choi *
Green Lantern (Stewart) - Mal Duncan
Vixen - Bumblebee

Birds of Prey:
Batwoman – Barbara Gordon
Black Canary – Anissa Pierce
Huntress – Cassandra Cain
Dr. Fate – Raven
Katana – Stephanie Brown

The Outlaws:
Azreal – Jason Todd
Fury - Cassie Sandsmark
Arrow – Roy Harper
Power Girl - Starfire
Wildcat - Pantha


*Heroes who came after the war

[caj]

This makes me think of how cool it would've been if Dick Grayson, Barbara Gordon, and Koriand'r had all been on the same team together. I'd be interested in the character dynamics of those three and the tension between them all.

[Shamrock Holmes]

I think that would have worked, though I think I would have at least kept J'onn for consistency, and to validate my opinion that the failure of JL Detriot wasn't J'onn's fault, but rather the manpower he had to available.

Agewise, Hal and Guy are about the same age now (mid forties pre-FP), though Hal is about 5 years older chronologically, John is about 12 years younger chronically and Kyle is about 5 years younger than that (early thirties, around the same age that the NTT crew should be.

Jade is probably the best option for a 'legacy' GL circa CoIE/Legends! at least until Kyle arrives on the scene.

Including some "fresh talent" also made sense.

So the JLI would be: Martian Manhunter, Nightwing, Tempest, Flash, Arsenal, Wonder Woman II, GL Stewart or Jade, Blue Beetle, Captains Atom and Marvel, Doctor Fate (optional) and Doctor Light. The interesting question would be whether the 'younger' Titans (Changeling, Cyborg, Raven and Starfire) would have stayed as Titans if the older members were JL (AFAIK all four were adults). Karen Star would probably go the same reservist route as her cousin opted for initially (the younger Titans might also take this route).

[DrNewGod]

I believe Alex Ross had a Titans Elseworld storyline suggestion that sounds similar but was never done.

This is why I wish, if DC simply had to streamline continuity, they'd done a clean relaunch (ala Nu52, minus the GL/Bat exceptions), kept E1, but treated it as E2 had been treated pre-Crisis .

[BroHomo]

I like it!!

[Timber Wolf-By-Night]

The problem with using Alex Ross's idea for the Titans/younger generation taking over from the Justice League is ignoring what Ross's intent for the idea was, which was not for the younger generation to actually take over as the world's greatest super-heroes. Rather, it was for them to discover that the world essentially no longer needed heroes because their predecessors had solved all the problems that needed heroes to solve them. Thus, they were not needed to be heroes. It's Ross yet again indulging his inner "Silver-age traditionalist" by having the heroes he grew up on "solve everything" before they retire or die, and having the next generation, instead of proving themselves heroes worthy of their predecessors, learn only that they are not needed.

All the major super-villains and their plans to become rich, powerful, or both....All the would-be world conquerors....All the alien threats from other worlds....All permanently solved, captured, defeated, whatever, and of course, no new problems would come up in their place. Because, hey, how good could the Justice League be as heroes if there was anything left for the sidekicks to actually do when they grow up, amirite?

[Aahz]

CoIE seems a little bit early imo. The oldest of the Titans would have just become 20 that point.

Btw. the classic Justice League was even not really arround at this poin. VoIE was in the Justice league Detroid Era, and after that came JLI. It wasn't undtill roughly 10 Yaers after CoIE, that more classic line up of the Justice League took over again.

[Shamrock Holmes]

CoIE seems a little bit early imo. The oldest of the Titans would have just become 20 that point.

Btw. the classic Justice League was even not really arround at this poin. VoIE was in the Justice league Detroid Era, and after that came JLI. It wasn't undtill roughly 10 Yaers after CoIE, that more classic line up of the Justice League took over again.

That's a fair point. However, there were at least three major organisations of the League after that in the old continuity - JLA (1996)*, Justice League of America Vol 2 (2006), and post-Cry For Justice (2009)** - and that's not counting the post-Flashpoint Justice League which specifically had younger versions of established heroes and a character exclusively known for being a Titan prior to that point.

* shortly after Dick's tenure as Batman.
** during one of Dick's tenures as Batman.

[Aahz]

That's a fair point. However, there were at least three major organisations of the League after that in the old continuity - JLA (1996)*, Justice League of America Vol 2 (2006), and post-Cry For Justice (2009)** - and that's not counting the post-Flashpoint Justice League which specifically had younger versions of established heroes and a character exclusively known for being a Titan prior to that point.

But those are set much later in the continuity.

CoIE takes afaik place (in universe) roughly one year after the New Teen Titans were founded, and even in real time Dick had just became Nightwing about a year before the start of CoIE (and about two years before it's conclusion). It just seems a little to early for him to be Batman.

JLA (1996)* is set something like 3 years after CoIE, that would have been imo more fitting time to take over.

[Lee Stone]

I wouldn't want them to take over as the JLA.
But I'd want them to be the JLA's equal, like how Marvel had both the Avengers and the Defenders.

The whole generation that I was introduced to when I first started reading...
Huntress (Wayne)
Power Girl (original)
Firestorm (original)
Cyborg
Starfire
Raven
Changeling (updated Beast Boy)
Jericho
Vixen
Blue Devil
Booster Gold
Blue Beetle (Ted)
Fire
Ice (Tora)
Mister Miracle (who became more DCU-centric with the JLA/JSA/New Gods cross-over)
Guy Gardner
Gypsy
Infinity, Inc.
Geo-Force
Halo
Looker
Katana
Dr. Light (Kimiyo)

Aside from a few, they really don't mean anything at DC anymore.

[Shamrock Holmes]

I wouldn't want them to take over as the JLA.

But I'd want them to be the JLA's equal, like how Marvel had both the Avengers and the Defenders.

The whole generation that I was introduced to when I first started reading...

... Aside from a few, they really don't mean anything at DC anymore.

I'd say more like Avengers and X-Men.

Rankings-wise I'd put Defenders as more Doom Patrol or Outsiders. Reasonably well known, but not exactly A or even B-List as solos apart from Doctor Strange and Hulk....

[Shamrock Holmes]

JLA (1996)* is set something like 3 years after CoIE, that would have been imo more fitting time to take over.

DC's offical timelines are usually fairly consistent about Dick becoming Nightwing less than a year before Crisis, Knightfall taking place about 3-4 years after that, and the "Big Guns" JLA forming the year after.

The main point of inconsistency appears to be the length of time he spent as Robin before becoming Nightwing. The offical timelines favor 3-4 years, however at least one writer threw in a reference that suggested 10-11 (Wolfmann IIRC) and one of my favourite timeline sites argues well in favor of a 8-year middle ground (based on him being in 7th grade during early Robin stories and celebrating his 20th birthday about the time he changed to Nightwing).