Different universes and physics - X-Men and Avengers Endgame heavy SPOILERS

[Mutant 77]

INFINITY WAR: basically, if Strange tells Tony they're in the right timeline before everything that needs to happen happens, it won't happen. Strange holding up the one finger is a signal to Tony that everything that needs to happen for them to win has happened, they are in the one timeline. If Strange had told Tony before this, those things wouldn't have happened. He saw 14 million futures. He knows exactly how this needs to play out.

As for the time travel in ENDGAME, Hulk and the Ancient One make clear that you can't change the past. By changing things, you're just creating another timeline. Your past is your past, you can't change it. So even if Cap were to change things in his new life with Peggy, it wouldn't affect the main MCU timeline. The Gamora from 2014 running around in 2023 doesn't affect the Gamora we followed in GOTG 1-2 and infinity War. She still lived and died. The new Gamora is one from a different timeline. So if Cap were to change anything, it wouldn't affect the main MCU timeline.

Easiest way to explain it is this:

Main timeline: The one the MCU follows and is in now and will continue to follow.

Timeline 2: Everything the same up until the Battle of New York. Loki escapes with the Tesseract, Captain America and Hulk steal the Mind and Time stones. Cap later returns these stones to the moment they were taken, restoring this timeline almost to normal (Loki is still on the loose with the Tesseract).

Timeline 3: Everything the same up until "Thor: The Dark World". Rocket removes the Reality stone from Jane. Cap later returns the stone at the moment it was taken. This alternate timeline is erased and restored to the main timeline? WE don't know how it works.

Timeline 4: Everything same up until the 1970's. Tony steals the Tesseract from SHIELD. Cap later returns the Tesseract. This alternate timeline is erased and restored to the main timeline? WE don't know how it works.

Timeline 5: Everything same up until GOTG. Rhodey and Nebula steal the Power stone while Nat and Clint retrieve the Soul stone. The Thanos, Nebula, Gamora and Thanos's army of this timeline travel to Main Timeline, where Thanos, Nebula and Thanos's army are killed. Cap later returns the stones but this timeline goes forward without Thanos, Nebula and Gamora.

Timeline 6: Captain America goes back to the 40's and lives a long and happy life with Peggy. Cap returns to the main timeline to say farewell to Bucky and Sam after Peggy presumably dies.

As is made clear in the film, you cannot change the past. The past remains the same no matter what. The time travel rules from other movies don't apply to the MCU. Instead, you create a different timeline. The timeline you originated from still exists. The changes the Avengers make in the past have no effect on the future they came from.



Radically DIFFERENT approach from the Fox X-Men Main Universe, where the timeline is revised twice and we got three timelines for the same universe:

Timeline 1: X-Men Origins: Wolverine; X-Men; X2; X-Men: The Last Stand; Logan.

Timeline 2: X-Men: First Class; revised movies; The Wolverine (2008); Days of Future Past 2023.

Timeline 3: X-Men: First Class; Days of Future Past 1973; X-Men: Apocalypse; Dark Phoenix; The New Mutants; DOFP New 2023.


The X-Men main universe (X-Men + Wolverine) has been altered via time travel twice, not just one ("Days of Future Past").
This means that the timeline depicted in "First Class" (1962), "The Wolverine" (2008) and the post-apocalyptic future of "Days of Future Past" (2023) was already a massive divergence from the original, untampered version of history (the X-Men trilogy; X-Men Origins & Logan).



According to my scenario:

Sebastian Shaw (Kevin Bacon) was a time traveler. He was born in the original timeline (X-Men Origins: Wolverine; X-Men; X2; The Last Stand; Logan).
At a certain point, when he was 50 or so - several years after the events of "Logan" (2029) - he traveled back to 1912 A.C. and impacted the timeline over the years in various ways... until creating the Hellfire Club.
He also changed Magneto's life in 1944.

The events of "First Class" were deeply caused by him, as well as having many birthdays shifting in time and characters being born later or before (Angel, Jean Grey).
I guess he influenced many powerful people over the decades, impacting their lives - Warren Worthington II (Angel's father) was among them.

FC Moira was the grandmother of LS Moira, as simple as that.

Emma Frost was already existing. Maybe, in the original timeline, Emma Silverfox was a clone of her who was adopted by Kayla's family (that's it).


So in the end, we got the second timeline:

1962- First Class
1963- JFK dies. Magneto is arrested.
1973- Mystique kills Bolivar Trask.
1983- Alternate version of "X-Men Origins". No Alkali-Transigen, no "Logan" future.
2000- Alternate version of "X-Men" and "X2".
2001- Alternate version of "The Last Stand".
2008- The Wolverine
2023- Post-apocalyptic future of "Days of Future Past".

[Madam-Shogun-Assassin]

My head legit hurts, I hate time traveling stories. But I also love them for the "what if" scenarios they create.

[theoneandonly]

it's time.

[Mutant 77]

My head legit hurts, I hate time traveling stories. But I also love them for the "what if" scenarios they create.

I'm obsessed by them LOL.

[Madam-Shogun-Assassin]

it's time.

I hope Dormamu come back with a vengeance, and not be nerfed by a time stone.

[Mutant 77]

I hope Dormamu come back with a vengeance, and not be nerfed by a time stone.

Dormamu deserves a TV series.

[Mutant 77]

From a recent interview with the RUSSOS:

Q: Did Captain America's action at the end affect the timeline? Does that mean there was a time where two CA existed in a same universe?

A: To me, CA's action in the end wasn't the fact he wanted to change anything, it's more like me has made a choice. He chose to go back to past and lived with the one he loved for the rest of his life. The time travel in this movie created an alternate reality. He lived a completely different life in that world. We don't know how exactly his life turned out, but I'd like to believe he still helped many others when they were needed in that world. Yes, there were two CA in that reality, it's just like what Hulk said, what happened in the past has already happened. If you go back to past, you simply created a new reality. The characters in this movie created new timeline when they went back to the past, but it had no effect to the prime universe. What happened in the past 22 movies was still canon.

Q: EG's plot, is it a parallel universe or a closed time loop?

A: Nope, not a time loop. Both Ancinet One and Hulk were right. You can't change the future by simply going back to past. But it's possible to create a different alternate future. It's not butterfly effect. Every decision you made in the past could potentially create a new timeline. For example, the old Cap at the end movie, he lived his married life in a different universe from the main one. He had to make another jump back to the main universe at the end to give the shield to Sam.

[JKtheMac]

I dont want to rehash the arguments, but I totally disagree with your time travel logic by the simple fact that we see evidence that it doesn't hold up. We know that you actually can change what happened in the past, or at the very least what you do always would have happened.

Why? Because old Cap didn't time travel or jump from another dimension. Because every scene of the past we saw was off camera in the previous movies for a good reason. If it really didn't matter what they did in the past, the scriptwriters would have been far more liberal with the heroes actions. Instead they show them literally hiding from any possibility of being in the original movie scenes.

The simple fact to explain this. Banner was wrong. They played his explanation of time travel for laughs. It didn't make syntactical sense to demonstrate he was way off script. He isn't a time travel expert. He even says he isn't. He is totally unreliable as the person we should be listening to.

[Mutant 77]

I dont want to rehash the arguments, but I totally disagree with your time travel logic by the simple fact that we see evidence that it doesn't hold up. We know that you actually can change what happened in the past, or at the very least what you do always would have happened.

Why? Because old Cap didn't time travel or jump from another dimension. Because every scene of the past we saw was off camera in the previous movies for a good reason. If it really didn't matter what they did in the past, the scriptwriters would have been far more liberal with the heroes actions. Instead they show them literally hiding from any possibility of being in the original movie scenes.

The simple fact to explain this. Banner was wrong. They played his explanation of time travel for laughs. It didn't make syntactical sense to demonstrate he was way off script. He isn't a time travel expert. He even says he isn't. He is totally unreliable as the person we should be listening to.

I posted what the RUSSOS established.

[Divine Spark]

I dont want to rehash the arguments, but I totally disagree with your time travel logic by the simple fact that we see evidence that it doesn't hold up. We know that you actually can change what happened in the past, or at the very least what you do always would have happened.

Why? Because old Cap didn't time travel or jump from another dimension. Because every scene of the past we saw was off camera in the previous movies for a good reason. If it really didn't matter what they did in the past, the scriptwriters would have been far more liberal with the heroes actions. Instead they show them literally hiding from any possibility of being in the original movie scenes.

The simple fact to explain this. Banner was wrong. They played his explanation of time travel for laughs. It didn't make syntactical sense to demonstrate he was way off script. He isn't a time travel expert. He even says he isn't. He is totally unreliable as the person we should be listening to.

Where did you think Cap got that intact shield?

[JKtheMac]

From a recent interview with the RUSSOS:

Q: Did Captain America's action at the end affect the timeline? Does that mean there was a time where two CA existed in a same universe?

A: To me, CA's action in the end wasn't the fact he wanted to change anything, it's more like me has made a choice. He chose to go back to past and lived with the one he loved for the rest of his life. The time travel in this movie created an alternate reality. He lived a completely different life in that world. We don't know how exactly his life turned out, but I'd like to believe he still helped many others when they were needed in that world. Yes, there were two CA in that reality, it's just like what Hulk said, what happened in the past has already happened. If you go back to past, you simply created a new reality. The characters in this movie created new timeline when they went back to the past, but it had no effect to the prime universe. What happened in the past 22 movies was still canon.

Q: EG's plot, is it a parallel universe or a closed time loop?

A: Nope, not a time loop. Both Ancinet One and Hulk were right. You can't change the future by simply going back to past. But it's possible to create a different alternate future. It's not butterfly effect. Every decision you made in the past could potentially create a new timeline. For example, the old Cap at the end movie, he lived his married life in a different universe from the main one. He had to make another jump back to the main universe at the end to give the shield to Sam.

We seriously need to question the source of this before we can read it as genuine. It doesn't even seem to come from a movie website. Anyone here able to check the voracity of the source?

https://ent.qq.com/a/20190429/007983.htm

[JKtheMac]

I posted what the RUSSOS established.

You posted something. Something that so far no news source has picked up on.

[Divine Spark]

We seriously need to question the source of this before we can read it as genuine. It doesn't even seem to come from a movie website. Anyone here able to check the voracity of the source?

Remember how Thanos destroyed Cap’s shield?

[Mutant 77]

We seriously need to question the source of this before we can read it as genuine. It doesn't even seem to come from a movie website. Anyone here able to check the voracity of the source?

https://ent.qq.com/a/20190429/007983.htm

I'm not here to fool people. Why should I? LOL

https://xw.qq.com/ent/20190429007983...19042900798300

Link taken from Superhero Hype.

I do not earn any movie from Avengers movie, I'm just a fan.

[JKtheMac]

I'm not here to fool people. Why should I? LOL

https://xw.qq.com/ent/20190429007983...19042900798300

Link taken from Superhero Hype.

I do not earn any movie from Avengers movie, I'm just a fan.

No I am not saying you are. I have been following this story. It first cropped up on a youth website in Chinese. My first instinct is to verify whether it was an actual interview and not just a kid trying to win an argument with his Chinese reading friends.

Even then its supposedly just one specific director's take, which is contradicted by the edit of the movie.

The strangest part of the text is that it isn't on a movie website. Also the translation is very detailed but the interview isn't quite as much. As if there may be another source.