Did anyone enjoy Spider-Man in spite of One More Day?

[Celgress]

---

divorce =
deal with devil =

Well, when you put it that way it seems bad which granted it is. Of course, there was no other way like oh I don't know say a trickster god who owed Peter a favor sure the guy might have been "dead" at the time but hey these are comic books, with enough imagination anything is possible.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

Now, I'm curious: how many of you were brought back into the fold with Spencer's run? Obviously, it's very different between Slott and BND, so I'm curious how you approached this one as well?

I definitely got involved reading Spider-Man's ongoing once Spencer came along. The only ongoing I followed after OMD was Bendis' USM and that turned out to be more important. I got to be there ground zero for Miles Morales' debut, and seeing the kid who brought home the Oscar for Marvel. In-between Spencer's run, I have gone back and re-read Slott's stuff in the trade and most of it doesn't hold up very well in my view : the favoring of plot over character, bad dialogue generally, and an overall lack of humanity. I had my doubts about Spencer because of Secret Empire. But I read Superior Foes of Spider-Man and that's flat out one of the best Marvel miniseries ever, and one of the best examples of humanizing villains without changing the fact that they are villains. I also liked RYV a lot, mostly Jody Houser's run which is really underrated. Funnily enough it was the Spider-Man game that got me into reading the comics again. Which is weird because the game borrowed a fair bit from Slott's run (mostly Big Time).

[Miles To Go]

Death & divorce had too many drawbacks. Killing off MJ is just too many tragedies for Peter, and a divorce would come with bad publicity, be hard to pull off narratively, and age a character who is supposed to be relatively young. Death & divorce would also be something that's expected to come up in the series now and then, so it's hard to sidestep.

Plus at least with a cosmic devil deal it allows Marvel to forever dangle carrots and keep readers invested in a possible redemption arc and reversal. It makes just as much sense to keep hope alive and make more money.

From Superior onward, it didn't bother me. I was angry at the time not so much because of the marriage being dissolved (I feel Marriage Era MJ was actually a boring character whose relevancy was far too dependent upon Peter, ditto her agency)

Marriage-Era MJ is a far superior character than you let on. There's a reason we've never been without that take on the character even when OMD was put into effect, and I don't think it robbed her of any agency...and what's wrong with her being relevant to just Peter? That's the primary function of a supporting cast player. MJ's had her chance to be defined outside of a life with Peter in Iron Man and nobody really took to it. Her life is enhanced more by being the best friend and rock for Marvel's leading hero and being by his side. Some characters just work better that way.

Personally, I think One More Day was an imperfect way to do something necessary: end the marriage without death or divorce.

Only it didn't mark the end of marriage stories. They continued, so it failed.

[Vworp Vworp]

Personally, I think One More Day was an imperfect way to do something necessary: end the marriage without death or divorce.

Except that was the problem. Well, one of them.

It didn't end the marriage. It magically erased it, essentially letting the bad guy win. And in letting the bad guy win, it never felt like anything had ended at all. I mean, that was Mephisto's plan, that a part of Peter would always remember and always be tortured and blah blah evil rant blah blah. So for as long as Pete still exists in the Mephistoverse, so the story is still being told.

OMD basically became a loose thread, a loose thread that more than ten years later still dominates discussion, that still effects the comic, that still splits fandom. Killing MJ would have sucked but I think people would have moved on quicker because it would have been part of Peter's ongoing story. Likewise splitting them up would have equally sucked, but again, it could have been a grown up story about two adults making a decision (assuming Quesada hadn't written it, naturally).

But would either of those options have had the same lingering impact that OMD continues to have, all this time later? I'd be inclined to say no, they wouldn't.

[Zeitgeist]

One More Day was a poorly written story, but I started reading Spider-Man again explicitly because of the whole Brand New Day initiative.

[Miles To Go]

Likewise splitting them up would have equally sucked, but again, it could have been a grown up story about two adults making a decision (assuming Quesada hadn't written it, naturally).

While I didn't agree with how Into The Spider-Verse managed it, this sort of thing led to a compelling arc for Peter B Parker in a film that helped net the franchise it's first oscar...so there's a clear success rate with playing up that angle. The climax also maintained the hopefulness that the two will reconcile in a sequel.

Peter and MJ can split, and they can reconcile. Spencer's run at the very least restored the hope that the franchise had been lacking for a decade, not just for Peter and MJ's love, but the idea Peter can land on his feet and feel more complete at the same time. The BND phase and Slott's run never accomplished that.

[boots]

Well, when you put it that way it seems bad which granted it is. Of course, there was no other way like oh I don't know say a trickster god who owed Peter a favor sure the guy might have been "dead" at the time but hey these are comic books, with enough imagination anything is possible.

well yeah. or a cosmic infinity cube stone gem guantlet thingy.

i mean, a lot of stigma around divorce in the west stems partly from religion...and even that has relaxed over the years. swerving around the issue of catholic annulment and diving straight to hell was...an interesting choice.

smh jms + quesada, you crazy kids

[Gaastra]

Well I read all Spider-Man books before omd and dropped all of them after. Was going to give it a shot again with spider-verse till I found out it was just going to be death after death and just read the info on the books. Only picked up 5 issues of slot's run and that's it. Is it good? Who knows but when you have dr freaking strange not able to remove a blasted bullet with or without magic then i'm out.

Personally, I think One More Day was an imperfect way to do something necessary: end the marriage without death or divorce.

There was nothing necessary about omd. It was a pointless reset that one guy who was boss wanted so he can go back to the 60s "loser can't get a date" Spider-Man when the blasted ultimate Spider-Man books was there for that.

[Inversed]

well yeah. or a cosmic infinity cube stone gem guantlet thingy.

i mean, a lot of stigma around divorce in the west stems partly from religion...and even that has relaxed over the years. swerving around the issue of catholic annulment and diving straight to hell was...an interesting choice.

smh jms + quesada, you crazy kids

According to them, even though the marriage never happened, EVERYTHING ELSE IN THE BOOK still happened, with the same amount of weight to it. So at that point, considering just how serious in a relationship they were in and for how long, that's literally just marriage without a piece of paper.

[Miles To Go]

According to them, even though the marriage never happened, EVERYTHING ELSE IN THE BOOK still happened

...Except Quesada confirmed across several CBR interviews the pregnancy never happened. Tom Brevoort is on record with disgareeing with that, but it's never been outright verified in the main books, which even went out of their way to avoid referring to the pregnancy during flashbacks in Clone Conspiracy

[WebSlingWonder]

...Except Quesada confirmed across several CBR interviews the pregnancy never happened. Tom Brevoort is on record with disgareeing with that, but it's never been outright verified in the main books, which even went out of their way to avoid referring to the pregnancy during flashbacks in Clone Conspiracy

Wait a minute: the pregnancy NEVER HAPPENED???
Wow. That's a load of bull on their part.

[NC_Yankee]

While I didn't agree with how Into The Spider-Verse managed it, this sort of thing led to a compelling arc for Peter B Parker in a film that helped net the franchise it's first oscar...so there's a clear success rate with playing up that angle. The climax also maintained the hopefulness that the two will reconcile in a sequel.

Peter and MJ can split, and they can reconcile. Spencer's run at the very least restored the hope that the franchise had been lacking for a decade, not just for Peter and MJ's love, but the idea Peter can land on his feet and feel more complete at the same time. The BND phase and Slott's run never accomplished that.

One of the things about Dan Slott that I disliked was I felt the only hope for Pete ever escaping the OMD/BND Hell was Slott leaving the book. I came to that conclusion after Silk. Now, no one expects Pete to be perfect ( he screwed up right from the start in Amazing Fantasy 15), but I had it with tbe losing. Think about it, even a total douche like Victor Von Doom could have a victory over Mephisto and save the one person he loved ( his mother), and Pete as written by Slott could not. The only characters who were screwed over worse were Felicia and Ted Sallis ( trapped for eternity in the Man-Thing body). Maybe freeing Sallis and making Carnage or Red Skull live as Man-Thing might be nice ( but that is a different story). When Slott left, and Spencer showed he is different, I came back.

[Yvonmukluk]

The books continued after One More Day, so a lot of people kept reading.

Personally, I think One More Day was an imperfect way to do something necessary: end the marriage without death or divorce.

Why was ending the marriage 'necessary'? I mean, how many of the stories written since OMD would have been seriously impacted by whether Peter was married or not? I mean, basically everything they did with BND - new supporting cast, new villains - that wouldn't have really been shaken up much if Peter was going home to MJ every night instead of ping-ponging between the love interests the writers created. That didn't really feel true to pre-marriage Peter anyway - he was more of a serial monogamist. I mean, none of the new love interests created for that had any real staying power - ironically the most use we're seeing out of Norah & Carlie right now is after Peter & MJ are back together. I think it's because everyone knew that basically none of those relationships would ever be able to go anywhere meaningful, because while OMD might have made people in-universe forget Peter & MJ were married, out of universe, if you asked people who Spider-Man's love interest is, they're most likely to go to Mary Jane. And if they broke them up, why get invested in any other relationship when you know it's not going to last?

I'll grant that Superior Spider-Man wouldn't work - I mean, MJ not noticing the difference in Peter's behaviour when they're living together would be utterly implausible, not to mention Otto attempting to carry on the relationship without her knowledge or consent raises a lot of deeply uncomfortable questions - but stories like 'Unscheduled Stop' or 'Spiral' wouldn't be materially impacted by Peter having a ring on his finger, in my opinion.

There's been good stories since OMD happened - but I don't think the marriage would have stopped most of those stories being told.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

It didn't end the marriage. It magically erased it, essentially letting the bad guy win. And in letting the bad guy win, it never felt like anything had ended at all. I mean, that was Mephisto's plan, that a part of Peter would always remember and always be tortured and blah blah evil rant blah blah. So for as long as Pete still exists in the Mephistoverse, so the story is still being told.

OMD basically became a loose thread, a loose thread that more than ten years later still dominates discussion, that still effects the comic, that still splits fandom. Killing MJ would have sucked but I think people would have moved on quicker because it would have been part of Peter's ongoing story. Likewise splitting them up would have equally sucked, but again, it could have been a grown up story about two adults making a decision (assuming Quesada hadn't written it, naturally).

But would either of those options have had the same lingering impact that OMD continues to have, all this time later? I'd be inclined to say no, they wouldn't.

From Quesada's perspective, he wanted to keep all options on the table for writers Post-OMD, and that included the Peter-MJ romance. A divorce or death would create problems for that.

It would also be hard from a character perspective. Like if Spider-Man splits from MJ because he can't endanger anyone with his life, how can you justify him seeking love again and presumably the same commitment from another woman? And if Mary Jane who went further than anyone couldn't accommodate Peter's life, who else could? I mean literally nobody believed OMIT where MJ tells Peter that he needs to find someone stronger than her. And then in Slott's run, Peter dating Carlie and deciding to lie to her about his life came off as incredibly douchy. That kind of thing isn't defensible after Peter had back-to-back relationships with women who knew his double life (Felicia, and then MJ). And of course the parade of love interests that followed OMD ended up making Peter a womaniser type and gave the sense that OMD was a way to get Peter out to the dating scene and so on, and that of course as Quesada ultimately admitted on twitter was "out of character" for Peter. I personally don't think OMD was necessary, I don't think it led to any great stories by itself, and I don't think rehashing the bronze age created anything as good as the stories in the first era.

[Mister Mets]

---

divorce =
deal with devil =

Pretty much. Plus, the whole point of Mephisto is to have the iconography of the devil without any of the baggage. It allows for the "He's not the devil, he's a magic space demon introduced in the Silver Surfer comics" excuse.