Who's no longer villain material?

[Michael Watkins]

I routinely keep track of marvel villains who seek redemption; mostly because I'm a Thunderbolts fan. So do you know of any that are in a place where being depicted as one of the bad guys would be a step backwards?

Ex. Dr. Franklin has been actively trying to distance himself from his past as Thunderball. He's the second black scientist to be set on a different path by the Wakandans (see: Nightshade).

And I've heard that Titania and the hubby have found a new way to work out their aggressions.

Not sure about Sabretooth. I'll wait for war of realms to end.
Who have I missed?

[Chris0013]

I routinely keep track of marvel villains who seek redemption; mostly because I'm a Thunderbolts fan. So do you know of any that are in a place where being depicted as one of the bad guys would be a step backwards?

Ex. Dr. Franklin has been actively trying to distance himself from his past as Thunderball. He's the second black scientist to be set on a different path by the Wakandans (see: Nightshade).

And I've heard that Titania and the hubby have found a new way to work out their aggressions.

Not sure about Sabretooth. I'll wait for war of realms to end.
Who have I missed?

Roger Gocking/Porcupine is a somewhat visible one due to his supporting role in the Spider Woman series. Not only breaking good...but starting a relationship with Jess.

As for Dr Franklin...I do hope his redemption sticks. I think we all can see writers down the line just keeping him as Thunderball of The Wrecking Crew. IIRC....he had built a battlesuit back in an old Spider-Man story so keep him good but without powers but using his suit.

[SuperiorIronman]

Doctor Doom and Ultron come to mind for the sheer amount of missed opportunities where it was a step backwards.

[gurkle]

I feel like Magneto has been this for something like 30 years.

[Michael Watkins]

I feel like Magneto has been this for something like 30 years.

He will be as long as there is a significant anti-mutant faction in the MU. They feed him and vice versa; with the X-Men in the middle (except for the recent proactive killing).

[Omega Alpha]

There's absolutely no reason to make Emma Frost a villain other than "WHAAAAAAAAAAH, I WANT THINGS BACK LIKE THEY WERE WHEN I WAS GROWING UP! WHAAAAAAAH!". Which, sadly, is the default mode for a good part of Marvel writers and editors these days. There's nothing you can do with her as a villain you can't do with Selene or even Lady Mastermind.

Juggernaut really has no reason to be a villain either; his motivation was always limited to Xavier's issues, but at this point feels forced, specially since Xavier hasn't led the X-men in a long time.

Loki works better as an agent of chaos, that could help or harm the heroes depending on the story.

Galactus should have stayed as Lifebringer, a complete waste.

[Chris0013]

Stilt-Man used to give Spider-Man and Daredevil a hard time but now he is comic relief, he is now a joke

Daredevil even recently talked about how Stilt-Man was more than just a guy who got tall and was a threat.

I made a comment above about Thunderball's power armor...finally tracked down a pick if there was anyone who was interested. It is from the old ASM Round Robin storyline..

[Michael Watkins]

Stilt-Man used to give Spider-Man and Daredevil a hard time but now he is comic relief, he is now a joke

didn't Bendis retire him? he said that he was tired of being beaten up and called it quits; to Matt Murdock, personally. pretty sure that he was drawn to look like Bendis, as well.

[Raye]

It's tricky, because even if it seems regressive, it can happen to anyone. They reverted Emma Frost after like 20 years, which was ridiculous. I think it was regressive for them to undo Doom's turn, but they did it.

but Loki, Doc Ock is a bit borderline but he's trying, Crusher Creel and possibly his wife Titania (they apparently joined Alpha Flight), Black Cat seems to be in the early stages (again).... Squirrel Girl has several minor examples and I would have said Kraven form that, but he seems to have fallen off the wagon.

But especially Loki. i know he's been playing the part recently, which may confuse people who haven't been following all his appearances, (probably intentionally) but he hates it, and he's doing that because that's what people expect from him, and they won't accept anything else from him, and he's a god so fate is mucking things up. But he's trying to accomplish good while playing the part of the bad guy (fixed magic by stealing Dr Strange's title, how many more people would have died in Malekith's attack if Strange hadn't had full access to his magic? assembled the Avengers and then intentionally losing, and he tried to stop Malekith by infiltrating his ranks, but failed. yes his methods are questionable, but he's trying. he's also done some unambiguous good with things like the Infinity stones, he helped Thor out in Hel, saved Freyja and stuff). Being the villain is the last thing he wants right now, in Thor 12, he decided he would literally rather die than be that again. This has been a slow process developing over the course of like 10 years, and it's sometimes been 2 steps forward one step back kind of progress, and i think it's finally just about complete. to undo it now, after all the pieces are finally in place, would be a massive step back. But he's apparently working with Thor, who is sending him on some kind of mission, in his new solo, so it's apparently sticking post WotR at the very least.

[Rosebunse]

Yeah, Loki is a definite safe bet. Oh, there's always the chance that he'll go bad again, but that chance is getting smaller as time goes on. At the moment, plenty of fans seem to prefer him this way.

Magneto and Dr. Doom are definitely up there. Even when Doom is being a villain, he seems to be trying to do right things...I mean, they normally don't go well, but he has good intentions.

Doc Ock is one who I'm still waiting to revert back. Ask me in a few years.

Emma Frost has her bad moments, but like Doom, she has genuine intentions. Except for that time she was planning on raping Tyke.

[GrandEleven]

Give a villan enough time in the limelight, and someone will eventually write him as an Antihero.

Can't wait to see how they spin Thanos...

[Tycon]

-Emma Frost
-Magneto
-LOKI
-Doctor Doom
-Galactus (after Lifebringer, they should’ve established a new cosmic deity to fill his former role)
-SpOck
-Kenji (Zero)
-Dr Franklin/Thunderball
-Legion
-Omega Red
-Spiral
-BLOB
-Venom
-Madelyn’s Pryor

[Celgress]

Doctor Doom and Ultron come to mind for the sheer amount of missed opportunities where it was a step backwards.

Indeed, they have certainly trended towards the heroic in recent years. These are the two examples I thought of as well, plus Magneto.

[Michael Watkins]

Roger Gocking/Porcupine is a somewhat visible one due to his supporting role in the Spider Woman series. Not only breaking good...but starting a relationship with Jess.

As for Dr Franklin...I do hope his redemption sticks. I think we all can see writers down the line just keeping him as Thunderball of The Wrecking Crew. IIRC....he had built a battlesuit back in an old Spider-Man story so keep him good but without powers but using his suit.

Personally, I wasn't even considering Roger to be on the fence. Not sure if it's Jessica's love or something internal that changed him. But he's pretty much done with the 12 steps of a face turn.

If Tom Foster hadn't picked the identity back up, I could have seen Dr. Franklin as some kind of radioactive Goliath (since that was his field of study). Not sure what he'd do now. But I would prefer that he not stay with the Wrecking Crew. I also wish that Titania had kept her ionic(?) upgrade.

[protege]

Personally, I wasn't even considering Roger to be on the fence. Not sure if it's Jessica's love or something internal that changed him. But he's pretty much done with the 12 steps of a face turn.

If Tom Foster hadn't picked the identity back up, I could have seen Dr. Franklin as some kind of radioactive Goliath (since that was his field of study). Not sure what he'd do now. But I would prefer that he not stay with the Wrecking Crew. I also wish that Titania had kept her ionic(?) upgrade.

Yeah, I thought Franklin might make a good Goliath too.