Sword for Thanos

[Lord Falcon]

Changeling is a possibility.

Unless Thanos has his Infinity Gauntlet up and running, Changeling casts him into a gate through time and space that has no terminus. The person is therefore forever lost in a 'non-state' of sorts -- they're gone, not just somewhere else, but gone. They're not thinking any more, they're not being any more (hence, Thanos can't actually activate his gauntlet once 'struck' by Changeling).

I'll warrant that with the Space gem and Time gem active, Thanos can likely do something about this, but if they're not actually running, he's gone.

....granted, so is the gauntlet.

But the gate...is itself...the terminus...*head asplodes*

[Sharpandpointies]

Glad to be of service.

IF the gauntlet were running and Thanos were ACTIVELY resisting the rip, perhaps, but given the nature of beings that have been forced to spend eternity inside the thing against their will - it's creator, Elder Eleint, elder and younger gods, etc., I dunno. There's also some kind of thing where Dragnipur doesn't just steal the soul, but seems to actually steal the body or part of it or something (yes, yes, I know that the bodies are left lying there when Rake kills them, work with me here). When beings did escape (the hounds that Paran let out, Draconus after the weapon is shattered, maybe SOME of Rake depending on what you think of Assail) they had bodies with them - they don't jump back into original bodies. I'm thinking that would have been pretty nasty for Darconus, given him being killed a few hundred thousand years before the main series. :-)

Draconus is an Elder God/Azathanai...we don't know what kind of weirdness is going on there. There's even a big freaking scene when he finally appears in the world again, as a massive storm of darkness that freezes two armies to death, as I recall, before reconstituting itself into physical form, thus proving why you don't screw with Ascendants in the Malazan universe. ^_^ Heck, all the beings that have 'gotten out' were Ascendants of some kind or another.

But there is some weirdness regarding how Dragnipur works, what with the entire 'getting body back' stuff. Soooo...

Myself, I doubt it was Rake. Esselmont has never really written a lot about Rake -- seems more Erikson's thing -- and I figure Erikson would feel it would cheapen Rake's sacrifice. There are other things, as well. Personally, I go with the idea put forward that it's Spinnock. Mileage, etc. ^_^

[Sharpandpointies]

But the gate...is itself...the terminus...*head asplodes*

Changeling is weird. It's not its own terminus. Gates in this universe have another gate to which they are linked through both space and time (sometimes many, and the user can program the one to which they want to travel). You step into the gate, and you are between. Then, instantly from your point of view, you are out the other side.

Now, gates CAN have themselves as their own destination. This is explicit in the series; Morgaine uses one to escape pursuers before the series starts, programming it to 'aim' at itself and also programming it to 'open' when it is disturbed. She then rides through it. Her pursuers, superstitious people with no knowledge of gates who think this is sorcery, back the heck off and nobody ever comes into this area again (because the gate is active, and looks scary to the culture -- they call it 'witchfires', as I recall). When the series starts, the central narrator (Vanye), outlawed, is hunting in the area. He hits a deer with an arrow, and the wounded animal runs through the gate (normally animals wouldn't go NEAR such a thing). This triggers it, and Morgaine rides out, decades after she rode in.

For her, it seems as if no time has passed. She steps through the gate and it's decades later, and winter. There's no thinking between. There's no being.

Changeling is a gate in the shape of a sword, a gate that leads to nowhere.

It has no destination. Anyone touched or caught in the winds of the gate (Vanye has 'caught' a group of riders and their horses with a single 'swing' of the sword) is instantly dragged in and sent between...to nowhere (they basically stay between). From the universe's perspective, they cease to exist. From their own perspective, they do not exist (there is no existence between gates, so they're not 'frozen in time' or 'paralyzed but still aware' or anything of the sort). Essentially, they become potential without the capacity to ever realize that potential. One might call this obliteration, and one wouldn't be too far off.

Darned thing is as bad as Stormbringer in its own way; it's not sentient, but it's indiscriminate and area affecting, and in the chaos of combat this can be deadly. It doesn't help that just holding the thing when it's drawn is exhausting (gate-force is enervating). Morgaine is pretty darned specific about where she wants Vanye to take a stand in a fight (he protects her left), and Vanye is darned careful about that, and about telling their allies where to stand as well. Nevertheless, the sword has consumed several of their allies over the course of the series.

[big_adventure]

Draconus is an Elder God/Azathanai...we don't know what kind of weirdness is going on there. There's even a big freaking scene when he finally appears in the world again, as a massive storm of darkness that freezes two armies to death, as I recall, before reconstituting itself into physical form, thus proving why you don't screw with Ascendants in the Malazan universe. ^_^ Heck, all the beings that have 'gotten out' were Ascendants of some kind or another.

But there is some weirdness regarding how Dragnipur works, what with the entire 'getting body back' stuff. Soooo...

Myself, I doubt it was Rake. Esselmont has never really written a lot about Rake -- seems more Erikson's thing -- and I figure Erikson would feel it would cheapen Rake's sacrifice. There are other things, as well. Personally, I go with the idea put forward that it's Spinnock. Mileage, etc. ^_^

To be fair, all of the Elder Gods are Azathanai, except MAYBE Burn, and they never really go into her that I recall. They are all ascendants, though that could be as much by "if you are still alive half a million years after you were born/created/willed-yourself-into-existence and we have heard of you, you HAVE to be an ascendant.

And yes, everyone who got out of Dragnipur was ascended long before getting INTO Dragnipur, and none of them could get out by themselves. Draconus: Dragnipur broken. Apsalar: freed through a gate opened by another. Hounds: freed through a gate opened by the master of opening gates. Everybody else was a permanent resident. And it's important to note that ALL of the beings who eventually got out, needing help, were each totally and completely capable of hopping through space and multiple dimensions as easy as walking when they were not prisoners of the sword.

So again, IF Thanos knows what's coming, and has the stones active and fighting the eventual effect, he might be able to resist the dump. Once he's cut, however, he's as screwed as anyone else.

OTOH, I don't really know that Cap could wield Dragnipur. If he draws the thing, as strong mentally and physically as he is, he's pretty likely to get dropped to his knees by the crushing force that unleashes.

[Sharpandpointies]

To be fair, all of the Elder Gods are Azathanai, except MAYBE Burn, and they never really go into her that I recall. They are all ascendants, though that could be as much by "if you are still alive half a million years after you were born/created/willed-yourself-into-existence and we have heard of you, you HAVE to be an ascendant.

Hence, my notation of Elder God/Azathanai, with Ascendant being a catch-all term, yes.

Burn might end up being covered more in Esselmont's current stuff, I don't know. I've yet to read #3. Or maybe Erikson's final prequel book will bring her in.

And yes, everyone who got out of Dragnipur was ascended long before getting INTO Dragnipur, and none of them could get out by themselves. Draconus: Dragnipur broken. Apsalar: freed through a gate opened by another. Hounds: freed through a gate opened by the master of opening gates. Everybody else was a permanent resident. And it's important to note that ALL of the beings who eventually got out, needing help, were each totally and completely capable of hopping through space and multiple dimensions as easy as walking when they were not prisoners of the sword.

It's them being Ascendants that makes me a little iffy on whether or not the Sword creates bodies/the escape creates bodies, or they just did (again, Draconus actually escaping as a giant death-storm before actually reconstituting himself springs to mind ^_^ ).

So again, IF Thanos knows what's coming, and has the stones active and fighting the eventual effect, he might be able to resist the dump. Once he's cut, however, he's as screwed as anyone else.

Makes sense. It's similar to the Changeling example: if Thanos is ready with Space-Gem going, there's an argument toward him saying 'No' to the gate, but if he's not prepared for it, once he's gone, he's gone due to how it works.

OTOH, I don't really know that Cap could wield Dragnipur. If he draws the thing, as strong mentally and physically as he is, he's pretty likely to get dropped to his knees by the crushing force that unleashes.

That would be my biggest argument against it. The effing thing makes bedrock literally weep tears of pain and suffering (and I'm using the term 'literally' properly, here, not in the completely incorrect way it's mostly used these days). I really can't see Cap managing to pick the thing up and swing it around, and if he could, he'd be debilitated enough that Thanos wouldn't have a problem defending himself.

[The Watcher]

That would be my biggest argument against it. The effing thing makes bedrock literally weep tears of pain and suffering (and I'm using the term 'literally' properly, here, not in the completely incorrect way it's mostly used these days). I really can't see Cap managing to pick the thing up and swing it around, and if he could, he'd be debilitated enough that Thanos wouldn't have a problem defending himself.

On the other hand, the OP states that Cap would be able to fully use whatever sword he was given, and that negative side effects wouldn't be an issue. So due to those conditions Cap would be able pick up and swing the thing as if it were any other sword.

[big_adventure]

On the other hand, the OP states that Cap would be able to fully use whatever sword he was given, and that negative side effects wouldn't be an issue. So due to those conditions Cap would be able pick up and swing the thing as if it were any other sword.

In that case it's a 6 foot long greatsword that, if the user unleashes it's full force and hunger, whips chains of pure living elemental darkness around that incapacitate who they touch unless they are REALLY badass. Thanos is probably tough and strong enough to power through most of the effect of the unleashed warren, but all Cap needs to do is nick Thanos and the fight is over. Dragnipur is no joke. Two people have ever wielded the thing: the half-Elder Eleint (dragon) Elder God who created the thing (Draconus - the guy who's re-entering the world literally froze into ice-cubes two massive armies who were ready to fight), and likely the most powerful and strongest-willed single being in Malazan, the Ascended, half-Elder Eleint Anomander Rake, a probably-continent-buster dude who is quite easy to argue as being as powerfully-willed as Victor Von Doom.

[Sharpandpointies]

... a probably-continent-buster dude who is quite easy to argue as being as powerfully-willed as Victor Von Doom.

...Soletaken shapeshifter, insanely powerful mage who can call upon two Elder Warrens of sorcery, possibly one of the two most skilled fighters on a planet of skilled fighters where skill means 'yeah, you can do superhuman crap based solely on skill', and strategic/tactical genius whose plans literally span tens of thousands of years.

Also, generally a pretty cool fellow despite sounding like a power-fantasy. I mean, I tend to detest overpowered characters, but Rake was fantastic.

It's worth noting that the other Elder Gods pretty much figure Draconus is roughly on par with Rake for 'dangerous', 'impossible to deal with save on his own terms', and 'too damn smart to fool'. They were pretty happy when Rake's big plan ended up getting ride of Rake himself, but became far less happy when it was revealed that said plan also freed Draconus to take his place in their way. ^_^

[Lord Falcon]

Without negative side effects as the OP says, Steve could also wield the Ragna Blade. It's the power of the Lord of Nightmares in the Slayersverse summoned into the shape of a sword. The Lord of Nightmares is the god of the Slayersverse, whose true form is an infinite sea of chaos. She created all four worlds of the Slayersverse with something closer to a sneeze than any deliberate act. She then populated those worlds with godlike beings and demons who would do battle for the fate of those worlds. Simply channelling the power of one of these beings, which are less than ants next to the Lord of Nightmares, allows a sorcerer to destroy a mountain.

The Ragna Blade basically wipes whatever it touches from existence, including demons who laugh off the aforementioned Mountain Busters.