Thanos (MCU) vs. Doomsday (DCEU)

[Twickster]

Doomsday isn't as fast as the likes of Superman and Wonder Woman, but he managed to tag them by exerting a degree of super speed himself. Doomsday's advantages aren't restricted to strength and regen.

Doomsday has no notable superspeed whatsoever, and the only reason he tagged Superman or WW is because of PIS. This is borne by the complete lack of "blur" style speed shown in his fight, wherein Doomsday is only ever seen moving in normal speed, and his consistent inability to tag Batman. Based on this, Diana should be able to one-shot Doomsday in the arena.

Also worth noting is that Doomsday is considerably taller than Thanos, and Thanos isn't known for his agility. He's gonna have to cut a considerably faster and stronger opponent with regen down long enough to get a shot at the head. And even assuming a clean decapitation would kill Doomsday, Doomsday's feats at least suggest the ability to regenerate from partial decapitations or having a blade simply embedded in his skull.

Thanos is able to fight Thor, Iron Man and Captain Thormerica at the same time and was winning. You can not say that he "is not known for agility". Doomsday is also a ravening beast with no skill or fighting ability whatsoever, something Thanos has in spades. Based on Doomsday's feats in his one appearance, I can't recall any strength feat that eclipses Hulk, or Thanos for that matter, who is arguably stronger than the Hulk.

[Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh]

He tanked it fine. It's 20 seconds between him slamming into the ground in a reentry fireball and the military noticing he's on his feet moving around.

When we see him visually, he's unharmed and pulling off his own skin to make room for new growth.

Are you thinking he was secretly mangled off screen? Or knocked unconscious in a meaningful way?

Mainly the bolded.

[The Arbiter]

Mainly the bolded.

You think 20 seconds of being obscured in a smoking crater is significant? The movie certainly didn't treat it that way.

[Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh]

You think 20 seconds of being obscured in a smoking crater is significant? The movie certainly didn't treat it that way.

You know what movie we're talking about, right ?

In any case, twenty seconds for a guy who otherwise monster'd through everything else thrown at him is significant, I'd argue.

[choptop]

Seeing as he was pretty much destroying Superman he has to be on he's level if not above strong wise.

[The Arbiter]

Doomsday has no notable superspeed whatsoever, and the only reason he tagged Superman or WW is because of PIS. This is borne by the complete lack of "blur" style speed shown in his fight, wherein Doomsday is only ever seen moving in normal speed, and his consistent inability to tag Batman. Based on this, Diana should be able to one-shot Doomsday in the arena.

Thanos is able to fight Thor, Iron Man and Captain Thormerica at the same time and was winning. You can not say that he "is not known for agility". Doomsday is also a ravening beast with no skill or fighting ability whatsoever, something Thanos has in spades. Based on Doomsday's feats in his one appearance, I can't recall any strength feat that eclipses Hulk, or Thanos for that matter, who is arguably stronger than the Hulk.

I agree with most of your sentiment here, and I know "feats" and all that, but it feels pretty unfair judging DD's strength in that manner.

It would be pretty bizarre for him to be anything but "Kryptonian +" y'know? And it's not without merit despite him not lifting much.

Like he recovered from the kryptonite gas way faster than Clark. Beat Clark in a direct heat vision duel. Badly rocked the guy.

[Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh]

I agree with most of your sentiment here, and I know "feats" and all that, but it feels pretty unfair judging DD's strength in that manner.

It would be pretty bizarre for him to be anything but "Kryptonian +" y'know? And it's not without merit despite him not lifting much.

Like he recovered from the kryptonite gas way faster than Clark. Beat Clark in a direct heat vision duel. Badly rocked the guy.

His regen/adaptability probably had something to do with the Kryptonite Gas recovery ? Sort of like saying Wolverine can take a hit by the Hulk better than, say, Colossus cuz he's back on his feet quicker.

[The Arbiter]

You know what movie we're talking about, right ?

In any case, twenty seconds for a guy who otherwise monster'd through everything else thrown at him is significant, I'd argue.

Sigh. Dont make me sad.

Stupid DCEU and it's stupid bad movies.

As for the 20 seconds... eh. My guess is without the smoke we would observe him moving earlier than we did based on presentation, but I can see your point regardless. It's not really worth arguing either way.

[The Arbiter]

His regen/adaptability probably had something to do with the Kryptonite Gas recovery ? Sort of like saying Wolverine can take a hit by the Hulk better than, say, Colossus cuz he's back on his feet quicker.

I don't hate that line of reasoning, sure.

The dude was killing Clark while the spear was shanking his organs though. It was better than just recovering. It straight up did less even under constant exposure.

I dunno. We're getting into "Maybe, maybe not" stuff that I hate to firmly stand on one side of.

[Twickster]

I agree with most of your sentiment here, and I know "feats" and all that, but it feels pretty unfair judging DD's strength in that manner.

It would be pretty bizarre for him to be anything but "Kryptonian +" y'know? And it's not without merit despite him not lifting much.

Like he recovered from the kryptonite gas way faster than Clark. Beat Clark in a direct heat vision duel. Badly rocked the guy.

I disagree, because "kryptonian" has differed quite significantly within the DCAU. This has gone from "Clark having no superspeed and Faora being the fastest Kryptonian" - in Man of Steel, where "fast" is just simple one-move flashsteps that can be tracked by the naked eye, to "Clark is suddenly just a step below Flash" in Justice League.This goes the same for his other stats, including strength and durability. Under the same vein, Clark (post JL) would wreck Zod and every other Kryptonian at the same time from Man of Steel.

For all practical purposes, there is no reason to retroactively assign Doomsday any feats Superman has in future movies after Doomsday's appearance, where Clark's stats skyrocket significantly. Doomsday's feats are his own (and if compared to a Kryptonian, only to the level Clark displayed as of BvS).

[The Arbiter]

I disagree, because "kryptonian" has differed quite significantly within the DCAU. This has gone from "Clark having no superspeed and Faora being the fastest Kryptonian" - in Man of Steel, where "fast" is just simple one-move flashsteps that can be tracked by the naked eye, to "Clark is suddenly just a step below Flash" in Justice League. For all practical purposes, there is no reason to assign Doomsday any retroactive feats Superman has in future movies after Doomsday's appearance, where Clark's stats skyrocket significantly.

I'm not arguing give DD speed feats or what not. Justice League was arguably a power up for Clark.

I'm just saying DD being less than Clark from BvS showings doesn't fit considering how he was treating the guy in direct contests of power.

Edit: to make my stance clear, I do in fact believe DD has a large strength advantage over MCU Hulk because of this.

[Twickster]

I'm not arguing give DD speed feats or what not. Justice League was arguably a power up for Clark.

I'm just saying DD being less than Clark from BvS showings doesn't fit considering how he was treating the guy in direct contests of power.

Edit: to make my stance clear, I do in fact believe DD has a large strength advantage over MCU Hulk because of this.

Sure, and based on those feats, Thanos still has a strength edge, based on how he was overpowering Hulk and Thor. Thanos also has a skill edge, and as we have dispensed with the "Doomsday somehow has superspeed argument", also has a speed edge owing to outfighting and outmaneuvering Thor, Iron Man and Captain Thormerica at the same time (the guy has feats of blocking a thrown Mjolnir with Iron Man's body, for example).

I have no problem believing that DD is stronger than MCU Hulk either - only because I'm not sold that MCU Hulk is all that strong in the first place. Thor, Thanos & Captain Marvel all have better strength feats. My point is that if DD is stronger than MCU Hulk, and Thanos is stronger than MCU Hulk, then by all accounts the strength argument cancels out, especially with an vibranium-hacking weapon on Thanos' side.

[Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh]

Sigh. Dont make me sad.

Stupid DCEU and it's stupid bad movies.

As for the 20 seconds... eh. My guess is without the smoke we would observe him moving earlier than we did based on presentation, but I can see your point regardless. It's not really worth arguing either way.

Potentially, but yea. End of the day I think we agree for the most part.

I don't hate that line of reasoning, sure.

The dude was killing Clark while the spear was shanking his organs though. It was better than just recovering. It straight up did less even under constant exposure.

I dunno. We're getting into "Maybe, maybe not" stuff that I hate to firmly stand on one side of.

I see that as sort of a side-effect, really. His regen/adaptability are pretty well established by the time he is shanked, and he's already been exposed to Kryptonite by this point (the Kryptonite gas); so there's at least a reason why getting shiv'd by something made of Kryptonite had diminished returns.

Of course it kills him in the end ... DC everybody.

Also, I went back and watched the fight (blech), and ... he never regrows the bit of him that gets chopped off. It turns into a spiked club thing for whatever reason. So assuming Thanos chops his head off, are we saying he comes back from that for some other reason I've missed ?

[The Arbiter]

Sure, and based on those feats, Thanos still has a strength edge, based on how he was overpowering Hulk and Thor. Thanos also has a skill edge, and as we have dispensed with the "Doomsday somehow has superspeed argument", also has a speed edge owing to outfighting and outmaneuvering Thor, Iron Man and Captain Thormerica at the same time (the guy has feats of blocking a thrown Mjolnir with Iron Man's body, for example).

I have no problem believing that DD is stronger than MCU Hulk either - only because I'm not sold that MCU Hulk is all that strong in the first place. Thor, Thanos & Captain Marvel all have better strength feats. My point is that if DD is stronger than MCU Hulk, and Thanos is stronger than MCU Hulk, then by all accounts the strength argument cancels out, especially with an vibranium-hacking weapon on Thanos' side.

As the thread starter, I feel stuck. I don't particularly /want/ to argue some of these points your making - I'd rather get other people's opinions. I legit wasn't sure who would win which is why I made the thread.

I mostly got involved just to clarify my feelings on certain feats and to keep their presentations accurate.

It's getting late where I'm at, so I'll sign off for now. I'll happily address your points if no one else takes a crack at them.

[The Arbiter]

Potentially, but yea. End of the day I think we agree for the most part.


I see that as sort of a side-effect, really. His regen/adaptability are pretty well established by the time he is shanked, and he's already been exposed to Kryptonite by this point (the Kryptonite gas); so there's at least a reason why getting shiv'd by something made of Kryptonite had diminished returns.

Of course it kills him in the end ... DC everybody.

Also, I went back and watched the fight (blech), and ... he never regrows the bit of him that gets chopped off. It turns into a spiked club thing for whatever reason. So assuming Thanos chops his head off, are we saying he comes back from that for some other reason I've missed ?

I'm pretty ok with beheading being either A: fatal or B: a 10 count resulting in a pretty stupid looking Deadpool-esque baby head thing lol

I think we are mostly cool on the kryptonite thing