X-Men Monday #14 (06/03/19)

[Omega Alpha]

Because it was written partially by a die-hard Logan fan that made it as slanted as humanly possible? That it broke apart the X-Men for no better reason than a forced awful MLK/Malcolm X analogy that quickly turned into Jesus/Hitler. That it tried to paint Scott's actions in saving lives as some kind of self-righteous masturbatory exercise?

Also, it gave us Wolverine and the X-men. That alone would be enough to dislike it.

[The tall man]

Because it was written partially by a die-hard Logan fan that made it as slanted as humanly possible? That it broke apart the X-Men for no better reason than a forced awful MLK/Malcolm X analogy that quickly turned into Jesus/Hitler. That it tried to paint Scott's actions in saving lives as some kind of self-righteous masturbatory exercise?

So then the issue is execution not plot. If it were more "fairly balanced" in your opinion then you wouldn't have a problem? The X-men needed to be broken apart at that point. Honestly how can anyone but Cyclops fans not have a problem with how the X-men were portrayed on Utopia? You have strong personalities, fiercely independent minded people and they're made into mindless lemmings? When I think of Logan, Ororo, Rogue or Betsy I don't see lapdogs or yes men. Nothing in their history suggests they're that kind of people. I see them pushing back, questioning, offering alternatives and not blindly following. They challenged Xavier but not Scott , who had an inner circle of Emma, Mags and Namor. Everything was in place for a split of the X-men, just the execution needed to be handled better.

[Omega Alpha]

So then the issue is execution not plot. If it were more "fairly balanced" in your opinion then you wouldn't have a problem? The X-men needed to be broken apart at that point. Honestly how can anyone but Cyclops fans not have a problem with how the X-men were portrayed on Utopia? You have strong personalities, fiercely independent minded people and they're made into mindless lemmings? When I think of Logan, Ororo, Rogue or Betsy I don't see lapdogs or yes men. Nothing in their history suggests they're that kind of people. I see them pushing back, questioning, offering alternatives and not blindly following. They challenged Xavier but not Scott , who had an inner circle of Emma, Mags and Namor. Everything was in place for a split of the X-men, just the execution needed to be handled better.

But...they weren't lap dogs or yes men; it was just that other characters had better focus on UXM itself- Psylocke was UXF, Rogue had her own solo, etc. Ororo had disappeared in the worst moment of the crisis to be T'challa's wife, she hardly had much business complaining.

Plus, if they wanted to split the X-men, it's a pretty stupid idea to do it when there are 200 mutants left. Should have waited until after the Decimation storyline had ended. And, of course, have a decent pretext and someone with actual reasons to complain leading.

[loke13]

I said I would have preferred Storm over Logan and a different catalyst for the split but I still think the Schism had to. And the narrative was leading that way, Scott was making unilateral decisions, no one else had a voice except maybe Emma and Magneto and the X-men were being written against type. Far more than just Beast should have been pushing back against Scott. Just as Scott turned against Xavier's leadership some X-men turned against his.

Schism was a bad event. Pure and simple. Not only was it executed poorly but it went one for FAR too long and then seemingly ended with very little fanfare. The whole Schism should have a resolved during AvX but unfortunately Marvel was obsessed with making Cyclops the bad guy for...reasons?

[Glio]

Please, the execution was terrible. Aaron used his fetishes of Quentin Quire, the infant HFC and Logan filling all Utopia of bombs to protect the innocence of children.

Schism could have been fine, but not with Aaron and Logan

[ExodusCloak]

Schism was terrible the kids protected themselves in Second Coming but weren't allowed to stop a gammy Sentinel.

Additionally Wolverine violated his no students participating in combat several times.

Aaron if ignored everything Yost and Kyle came up and how they moved the kids from.point A to B

[Glio]

Schism was terrible the kids protected themselves in Second Coming but weren't allowed to stop a gammy Sentinel.

Additionally Wolverine violated his no students participating in combat several times.

Aaron if ignored everything Yost and Kyle came up and how they moved the kids from.point A to B

If the conflict had been "Idealism vs. pragmatism" and Cyclops vs. Storm, it could have worked. But trying to make it dramatic by involving the children and Wolverine irremediably damaged the event.

You can not have a serious comic with WOLVERINE saying "Children should not fight" in the same universe in which the Champions save Australia during War of the Realms.

Not even X-Force could be used as a reason, it was Wolverine who continued with it and Cyclops who ordered it to close.

In the end, trying to elevate Wolverine to a position of leadership, all Schism did was to damage the character by making him a hypocrite, because as Wolverine was in seven different comics at once it seems it is impossible for writers to agree on have a consistent characterization

[Killerbee911]

Wait people are still arguing/talking about Schism like it wasn't the most out of character story since Civil War. In what world does a pissing match between Wolverine and Cyclops not lead to well.. Storm, Kitty, Emma and any adult with common sense telling Logan and Cyclops gfto its okay we can run the X-men you go and sit corner until you want to be an adults. X-men has had the stupidest leadership system for years and this story highlighted it. It is weird people want to use their Cyclops vs Wolverine epeen on this story "My character was slightly less out of character ****** up than your character" "No my character was slightly less out of character and less ****** up than yours". Thank goodness IvX rolled around so we have event that top Schism in wtf are you doing to the characters and generally have forgotten about schism.

[Glio]

You know, Storm, Kitty and Emma locking up Scott and Logan in a room and not letting them out until they make peace is a comic that I would read.

[Frobisher]

Mohawk Storm should have kicked the crap out of Scott and Logan without even using her powers and sent them to the naughty step.

[Snoop Dogg]

Spider-Man should've swung by and given Scotty and Loogie a good ol' slap on the tush.

[Triniking1234]

Squirrel Girl should've taken over the X-Men tbh.

[Graphicisnovel]

It seems like we've reached an agreement then. The council moves to strike Schism from the record

Logan was contrived. Watching Storm just stand there when those two clowns were going at it was painful, I feel like she was created to break up fights like that and take over lol

[theoneandonly]

Imagine if their evoking jean and dragging her name in the conflict led to the white queen manifesting herself in anger and burning the sentinel down while the both of them scramble to get out of their way their feud forgotten at such display of cosmic power.

[cranger]

I understand that JDW started working with the X-Men during Schism so maybe we should not read beyond that like "I have good memories because I participated in this".

Not to pick on him, but yeah, a lot of his answers seem framed within the context of what he has worked on.