Uncanny X-Force and Uncanny Avengers

[cc008]

Uncanny X-Force is my favorite modern comic book series. Remender's Deadpool was so great. Hope one day he'll come back to Marvel and write Wade outright.

Also really enjoyed Uncanny Avengers for his Thor. Really well done with great art.

[johnnyjam2233]

You should go back and read Uncanny X-Force and Uncanny Avengers will no longer be a mixed bag. It is CLEARLY a sequel to Uncanny X-Force, and I would think make it hard anyone who didn't read it, to enjoy Uncanny Avengers. U Uncanny X-Force. First off, when Uncanny X-Force was announced, it had one foot in the grave for a few reasons. First off, Christopher Yost (writing) and Craig Kyle had just come off of a monster run on X-Force that was one long story that lead straight into the Second Coming X-Men event, that was actually great, and one of the best cross overs in years. Craig Kyle's art was INSANE. Every panel was drawn like comic book cover. It had that digital painting feeling to it. So when their run ended, and it was big favorite, Uncanny X-Force was announced and it had Deadpool in it, as well as Fantomex. Everyone was saying Deadpool was only it for the hype and to ride his popularity, and how's going to be written, the forth wall and blah blah blah, but Deadpool was definitely impressive because was not the star of the book. He was a supporting star. His skill was more on par with Joe Kelly's Deadpool and was skilled the way he should be written, not a jester like Danial Way's version, but his dialogue was dead on Deadpool, and actually funny as hell. They did use his dialogue as "FILLER" comic relief dialogue. Fantomex also surprised people, because he was written so well too. Both Fantomex and Deadpool, what made them so great, we DRAFTED into X-Force because they're both mercenaries, but the hero comes out of both of them over the arch of the run. We even find out after Deadpool and Wolverine arguing, and Wolverine telling him opinion doesn't mean **** because he's just a scumbag hired gun anyway, that he never cashed any of the checks he was paid for while being in X-Force. The run was ultra violent, as it should be considering X-Force was nothing but killers. The first issues impressed a lot of people right off the bat, because each character was written so well in their own voices, it was repeatedly mentioned over and over by readers that got hooked on the book and why they liked Remender so much. The art blew our minds to tho. Coming off of Kyle Craig's almost painting panels, to Jerome Opena' was not wonderful. Opena' at the moment is my favorite artist, and I can't wait for him to return to Marvel or DC. His fight choreography was better then most artists, and his slight tweaks to characters in great as well. He brings a lot more attention to detail then most artists and I caught myself just simply staring at his panels. The details in the background. He draws grit to look very pretty. Now while UA was, other then opening Red Skull Arch, was just one long story until the end of the run, Uncanny X-Force splintered off to few different arch's. The Fantomex, and the "WORLD" arch involving Deathlock, and one of the many many other alternate futures of Marvel, this one being about the A.I. connecting to humans and hybrids where all the Marvel heroes are Deathlock versions of themselves, and they battle a villain named Father. (that story actually gets a Rick Remender sequel as well that I loved in his run of Secret Avengers), but it's the Dark Angel Saga that is the stand out story here from Remender that is an X-Men classic. Archangel turning into Apocalypse. The mid story arch of X-Force being forced to travel to the Age Of Apocalypse time line, and as as many years have passed since AOA was written and ended, when X-Force goes there, just as many years have passed so we finally see what happened to the survivors of Age of Apocalypse. It's actually a perfect sequel to anyone who loved Age of Apocalypse. Just go read it. I'm ranting now. It's old enough that there's plenty of ways to find it out there somewhere online to read for free, so if you're skeptical, you don't even have to buy it. But I bet after you do, you'll want to own the trade then so you can read it again, and I bet you go and pick up and re-read Uncanny Avengers again and see the masterpiece for what it is.
C

[johnnyjam2233]

I just remember while reading this run, because Remender was almost dishing them out so quickly. Not necessarily bi-monthly, but there were easily 3 issues for every 2 months. When the Dark Angel saga began, and I saw the title for the arch being CALLED the Dark Angel Saga, I knew right away I was in for something special. The had that prelude story where Shadow King released Apocalypse from Arch Angel, the following issue was a one shot with Wolverine killing some Nazi for Magneto, the next issue jumped on us. We saw the title. Pretty slick. Arch Angel - Dark Angel Dark Phoenix Saga. I just knew. Then they go to the Age of Apocalypse. It's now became an A.O.A sequel and brought us up the years to what has happened since the ending of A.O.A. and they blow our minds with Wolverine now being Apocalypse. It was outstanding. But Remender did it right. While he spit out those stories, he had Jerome Opena' drawing the 2nd half to the story and the art blew our minds. By they way. If you loved that run as much as I did, did you read Remenders Secret Avengers run as well. The sequel to the Deathlock nation and the Father character? It's a classic as well to me.

[johnnyjam2233]

I read the Otherworld arch a 2nd time and it was better after another reading. I really loved Final Execution, but the art was just fucking awful. I mean, who ever they had doing the art for that story......where did they get that guy, and how did he get a job. It would have been better if Rob Liefield did it. It was that bad. But if you read Uncanny Avengers, the ending of Final Execution makes more sense because of how Wolverine and Daken are used in THAT story line. Daken being risen from the dead to become one of the Four Horsemen. When the Avengers find out about Wolverine killing his own son and running a hit squad, it's was a set up by Kang so that the Avengers spit up, and ended up losing to the Apocalypse Twins. Remender had the idea in mind already when he was writing Final Execution. He knew where he was already going when he was writing his Uncanny Avengers Arch. Uncanny Avengers is just one long story. It's almost like a maxi-series if you really think about it. It's why it was so damn good. But the art. I hated it so much. It was so damn bad.

[johnnyjam2233]

Wait? What backlash are you talking about? When Remender wrote U. Aven. He began his run at the same time that Hickman was writing Avengers and New Avengers. As much as Hickmans run is outstanding, and a classic in my eyes as well, I remember everything I was reading, article and review wise that is, that Remenders was the preferred run by those that were reading it, because Hickman was still outselling Uncanny Avengers. I will say this tho, anything I did read about it saying how good it was, there was the constant reminder of how the story was a direct sequel to his Uncanny X-force run, and that even tho a person could read Uncanny Avengers and enjoy it, If they read the Uncanny X-Force first, it was make a good story into a GREAT story. Uncanny Avengers wasn't just a sequel to Dark Angel Saga, it was also direct from Final Execution. Wolverine running a hit squad and killing his own son Daken going public is how the Avengers team got split up. It's also how we saw characters DIE in the book like Captain America. Daken becoming a Horseman of Apocalypse. This wasn't an alternate time line either. Captain got killed, and very violently. They lost. It took decades to go back fix ****. regardless. I ranted just now. What backlash are you talking about?

[johnnyjam2233]

I was not a fan of AXIS. I was actually let down from Remender, but Uncanny X-Force, Uncanny Avengers, those 2 stories I've read over and over. I'm also a HUGE fan of Remenders other sequel from Uncanny X-Force he told in Secret Avengers. It ended the Deathlock Nation story, and human hybrid with A.I.. It was a sad ending. My favorite thing from AXIS tho, was how Remender voiced Doctor Doom. His one line after killing someone and another character making a comment and he told them something like. "Why should I care who I kill. Am I supposed to feel the same for every ant that I step on?" Uncanny Avengers blew my mind because I thought it was just well thought out. People always mention it being a sequel to Dark Angel Saga, but they forget how it's also a direct sequel to Final Execution. The ramifications to Wolverine killing his own son Daken. How the reason that the Uncanny Avengers lost to the Twins was because the team split up, and they split up because Wolverine killing his own son and using a hit squad to do it was the key factor. Then Daken being brought back from the dead and made one of the Four Horseman of Apocalypse. Characters were killed in Uncanny Avengers and it was in the mainstream 616. Captain America was brutally killed. That story took decades to fix. I knew nothing really about Kang, except from what I read on Wikipedia about him. How Remender wrote him, How he started his plan thousands of years before, existed for those thousands of years, and played puppeteer until he got what he wanted. Masterful. People don't realize the brilliance of that story until they actually sit back and consider all the actions Kang actually did in that story. Thousands of years. He was a perfect devil. planting seeds and ideas in characters heads so they did things that would effect things thousands of years later, and Kang would step in again, and plant another seed. Baiting Apocalypse to attack Thor. Faking himself as Loki so Thor used Jarnbjorn. Stealing it from a dead Baron Mordo. The same axe beig the weapon to open up a Celestial decades later so he could finally siphon the power for himself. Brilliant. Methodical. precise. Awesome.

[Wolverine12]

Two of my favorite arcs in all of Marvel. I loved how UXF spilled over into UA. It really made UXF feel like it mattered and that the team let it get out of control to the point the whole world was affected, which is exactly what they were trying to prevent all along. I want to go back and give AXIS a second read, but at the time I remember I could just smell editorial mandates all over that book. Sure it had Remender's name on the cover but I didn't feel like he was the one actually writing.

[Omega Alpha]

Wait? What backlash are you talking about? When Remender wrote U. Aven. He began his run at the same time that Hickman was writing Avengers and New Avengers. As much as Hickmans run is outstanding, and a classic in my eyes as well, I remember everything I was reading, article and review wise that is, that Remenders was the preferred run by those that were reading it, because Hickman was still outselling Uncanny Avengers. I will say this tho, anything I did read about it saying how good it was, there was the constant reminder of how the story was a direct sequel to his Uncanny X-force run, and that even tho a person could read Uncanny Avengers and enjoy it, If they read the Uncanny X-Force first, it was make a good story into a GREAT story. Uncanny Avengers wasn't just a sequel to Dark Angel Saga, it was also direct from Final Execution. Wolverine running a hit squad and killing his own son Daken going public is how the Avengers team got split up. It's also how we saw characters DIE in the book like Captain America. Daken becoming a Horseman of Apocalypse. This wasn't an alternate time line either. Captain got killed, and very violently. They lost. It took decades to go back fix ****. regardless. I ranted just now. What backlash are you talking about?

There was massive backlash against Alex's infamous speech, even at Marvel, so much that Bendis wrote a response to it in ANXM. And Remender reacted stupidly and angrily to people complaining. That, the delays, and the fact that Hickman's story was clearly better led to people losing interest in UA.

[johnnyjam2233]

OKAY OKAY OKAY!!!! What issue was the whole Alex infamous speech that you're talking about so I can go back and re-read it myself because I don't remember this at all. What delays were there too. I remember Remender KICKING out issues of Uncanny X-force to almost a bi-monthly rhythm, and that was great because it seemed like anyone that was reading that title was saying how it was ONE OF if NOT their favorite title to read, and this was while Marvel was KILLING IT. When Uncanny Avengers was being published, I never noticed any delays. I thought it was right on time, so I'm pretty taken back at what you're saying. I'm a fan boy. I read a lot of ****, and go on lot of the comic sites as well. This is all news to me. Sure UA was being written at the same time as Hickmans run was being written, and they were BOTH great. It's one of the reasons I just stated that Marvel was killing it in terms of great books being published. I was even a fan of the Bendis run on X-Men. It wasn't great, but it was good. Not the point here tho. Marvel made a HUGE deal about Hickman writing Avengers and New Avengers, because his run on Fantastic Four is now argued as one of, or THE best F.F. run. I didn't read it, because I never read F.F.. To much history that I felt like jumping into so I never read Hickmans run, but I sure did read a lot of articles about the praise he got. I was an Avengers reader so I did read his Avengers and New Avengers run and I loved it, but it was completely different in from what Remender was doing with Uncanny Avengers. Because I loved Remenders Uncanny X-Force run, I was really enjoying what he was doing with U.A.. It was a direct sequel to his Dark Angel Saga as well as Final Execution archs. Hickmans Avengers run started out with a lot of one shot or two shot stories for the readers to get familiar with some characters and set the tone for later in his run. His run to me felt like what it would be if the Avengers were written by DC then Marvel. His was easier to follow because of his one shot and two shot stories because the readers got JUUUUUST enough back story about a character to be able to follow along with them. Remender was much more difficult to follow. Sure it was a stand alone story, but anyone who read U.A. but DIDN'T read Uncanny X-Force, might have found the story.....good, as apposed to anyone who DID read U. X-Force, because those that did, all felt like Uncanny Avengers was fucking great. I liked it more then the Hickman Avengers run, but Secret Wars was just a masterpiece in my opinion. I didn't know **** about Kang tho except for the Apocalypse origin trade that I owned where he is Rama Tut, and never really took interest in the character, but I had to wiki him before I started reading Uncanny Avengers, as well as I had to Wiki Wonderman, because I didn't know a thing about him either. I'm glad I did tho. Only had a few lingering comics that even had Wonderman in them, but I did have the Avengers and New Avengers annuals written by Bendis where Wonderman collects a group of anit-heroes together to take down the Avengers and calling themselves the Revengers. A simple story, but I loved it.

[johnnyjam2233]

WHAT THE ****!!!! So I just googled what you were talking about. I had NO idea about this, but I remember reading this issue and actually thinking it was pretty good what he had Havok actually say. Look, I'm from Chicago. I'm Italian, and where I'm from I had black neighborhoods surrounding two sides of my town, Mexicans on one side, and another Italian neighborhood on the last side. I have close friends from all the towns, but there was a lot of fighting going on between everybody too. Minorities look at Italian people like we're white boys. Non Italian white people look at Italians from Chicago like dumb fucking guidos that movies and television show us as. Mafia gangster wanna-b's or Luigi the pizza maker. The X-Men books have ALWAYS stood out as more of political book, and used the race card very very well. Personally for years while reading the book I would say to myself "Being called a mutant is kind of shitty thing to be called." When I think of the word mutant, I think of some inbred radio active creepy creepy living in the mountains or the dessert in some horror movie waiting to kill it's victims. I've heard every shitty word real people can be called from every race. The whole point of the X-Men books is that mutants just want to be treated like they're people, not stereotyped, so Havok was offended by the word mutant and simply wanted a new term to be used. Nothing wrong with that, because mutant IS an ugly word, and if people can't figure that out, then they're idiots. There's a lot of people who don't even want to be called "black" anymore. African American. It's a touchy thing now. I liked where Remender was going with this. Ultimate X-Men #6. After Wolverine was hired to kill Prof. X by Magneto, he changed sides. He was fighting Magneto and Magneto said to him "And what's that? Embracing a species which tortured you like a lab monkey?" and Wolverine replied back "NO! Teaching em' we're all human." People missed Remender's whole message. That's to bad.

[Blunt Guy]

WHAT THE ****!!!! So I just googled what you were talking about. I had NO idea about this, but I remember reading this issue and actually thinking it was pretty good what he had Havok actually say. Look, I'm from Chicago. I'm Italian, and where I'm from I had black neighborhoods surrounding two sides of my town, Mexicans on one side, and another Italian neighborhood on the last side. I have close friends from all the towns, but there was a lot of fighting going on between everybody too. Minorities look at Italian people like we're white boys. Non Italian white people look at Italians from Chicago like dumb fucking guidos that movies and television show us as. Mafia gangster wanna-b's or Luigi the pizza maker. The X-Men books have ALWAYS stood out as more of political book, and used the race card very very well. Personally for years while reading the book I would say to myself "Being called a mutant is kind of shitty thing to be called." When I think of the word mutant, I think of some inbred radio active creepy creepy living in the mountains or the dessert in some horror movie waiting to kill it's victims. I've heard every shitty word real people can be called from every race. The whole point of the X-Men books is that mutants just want to be treated like they're people, not stereotyped, so Havok was offended by the word mutant and simply wanted a new term to be used. Nothing wrong with that, because mutant IS an ugly word, and if people can't figure that out, then they're idiots. There's a lot of people who don't even want to be called "black" anymore. African American. It's a touchy thing now. I liked where Remender was going with this. Ultimate X-Men #6. After Wolverine was hired to kill Prof. X by Magneto, he changed sides. He was fighting Magneto and Magneto said to him "And what's that? Embracing a species which tortured you like a lab monkey?" and Wolverine replied back "NO! Teaching em' we're all human." People missed Remender's whole message. That's to bad.

That's the way I've always felt about Havok's speech, too. But apparently I need to be a minority to understand what is offensive about it. In my mind, he was saying that there was more to him than just being a mutant, but others thought he came across as being ashamed. I really believe that all the **** he got starting right there is what drove him to doing creator-owned stuff exclusively. I don't blame him either. It got pretty personal with some of his detractors.

[johnnyjam2233]

I totally agree, but we the fans got the **** end of the deal because I WANT to read him writing for Marvel, not his creator owned work. people are idiots tho.

[Omega Alpha]

If you make a speech so poorly thought or written out that another creator feels he has to write a reply in the comic, then you can't tell the fans that disliked it to drown in hobo piss.

[PhoenixThanos]

Uncanny Avengers Vol 1 was sensational, the team was great.
Unfortunately other titles effected this title and it finished leading into the below par Axis mini-series.
I wasn't a fan of Uncanny Avengers volumes 2 and 3.
If you are going to do a title like Uncanny Avengers you need the top tier characters.
Many X-Men fans were not fans of Uncanny Avengers as were Avengers fans but it was a very successful and popular title.