The most dangerous Green Lantern

[Anthony Shaw]

Easy to do; he's not even born yet in the main time DCU, right? For close to a thousand years, even! But after "Universo" Vidar leaves the Corps he goes on to conquer the planet Earth on multiple occasions in the pre-Zero Hour timeline, and in the New 52 timeline he (assuming it's the same guy) causes so much trouble that the Legion decides to just hard reset the entire future by averting the Second Death of Superman, a trick akin to deciding to go back in time and save Jesus from the Romans just to find out what happens, even knowing that it'll erase your whole history! We don't get to see everything Universo did to the future, but we know it was nasty, and given how bad we know things can get in that timeline, it must have been even worse than "Superman and the Legion" from Johns, or the "Five Years Later" timeline as well.

Just him trying to view the dawn of time as a GL (Pre-Crisis) was scary enough for me.

[lemonpeace]

The proof is in the pudding.

Sinestro had the Parallax power for a long time, and was nowhere near the menace that Hal posed to the universe.

At the end of the day, Hal is a better hero, and was a better villain than Sinestro.

Which also explains Sinestro's twisted obsession/jealousy with Hal Jordan.

Wasn't their Parallax possessions entirely different beasts tho? Like yeah, they were both "possessed" by parallax but Hal was being influenced by the entity and then he absorbed all the willpower in the Central Power Battery, while Sinestro let Parallax inhabit his body and was only main-lining Parallax's fear energy. A greater threat, sure, but
it's not really a one to one comparison no? Maybe that's a bit of a nitpick

Separately...

I'd also like point out, while Hal's rampage leading to his full heel turn to Parallax was very impressive, he didn't face any of the Corps' top tier ringslingers (sans Kilowog); people like Kyle (who hadn't joined yet), John (who previously beat Hal and was a Guardian at the time until the Central Battery was tapped), Guy (who I believe was expelled at the time), Sodam Yat (who I don't believe had joined yet), and Mogo (also hadn't joined yet) weren't at play.

Hal's other ridiculous feats, I feel, present a better case.

[Adekis]

Just him trying to view the dawn of time as a GL (Pre-Crisis) was scary enough for me.

I gotta admit, I just never understood why viewing the Dawn of Time was such a big deal in the DCU, outside of the writers exercising some kind of weird pop Christian mythology or something. I mean, it worked in the context of the story, it definitely made Vidar into a cool villain to have there, with the bonus of being something visibly evil he did while he was a Green Lantern, but at the same time, I just never understood why seeing the Dawn of Time would be an immoral thing to do in the first place.

[Anthony Shaw]

Wasn't their Parallax possessions entirely different beasts tho? Like yeah, they were both "possessed" by parallax but Hal was being influenced by the entity and then he absorbed all the willpower in the Central Power Battery, while Sinestro let Parallax inhabit his body and was only main-lining Parallax's fear energy. A greater threat, sure, but
it's not really a one to one comparison no? Maybe that's a bit of a nitpick

Separately...

I'd also like point out, while Hal's rampage leading to his full heel turn to Parallax was very impressive, he didn't face any of the Corps' top tier ringslingers (sans Kilowog); people like Kyle (who hadn't joined yet), John (who previously beat Hal and was a Guardian at the time until the Central Battery was tapped), Guy (who I believe was expelled at the time), Sodam Yat (who I don't believe had joined yet), and Mogo (also hadn't joined yet) weren't at play.

Hal's other ridiculous feats, I feel, present a better case.

You make interesting points. I did point out that free of any influence, Hal killed Krona, a Guardian.

Hal has a will and drive that is unique. Before draining the Central Power Battery, he "killed" Sinestro. In quick session, he took down Kilowog, Sinestro, and Boodikka (I think she was supposed to be a heavyweight at the time).

Hal was still capable of doing good deeds while possessed (healing John Stewart & reigniting Earth's sun).

I tend to think that whatever direction Hal decides, good or evil, he will go all out, and not much can stop him.

Sinestro willingly absorbed Parallax, and was surprisingly mellow. With the power boost, you'd think he would have done more. He was probably too preoccupied with the blue lady.

I think Parallax is only as effective as the person it bonds with. Parallax kicked up more dust with Hal than anyone else.

Guy did confront Hal in full Parallax mode (along with other top tier heroes), and got served.

It would have been interesting to see how John would have fared against Hal at that time. John had plenty motivation as the lost of the Central Power Battery cost him Katma.

[Anthony Shaw]

I gotta admit, I just never understood why viewing the Dawn of Time was such a big deal in the DCU, outside of the writers exercising some kind of weird pop Christian mythology or something. I mean, it worked in the context of the story, it definitely made Vidar into a cool villain to have there, with the bonus of being something visibly evil he did while he was a Green Lantern, but at the same time, I just never understood why seeing the Dawn of Time would be an immoral thing to do in the first place.

It is definitely Tower of Babel-ish.

[Adekis]

It is definitely Tower of Babel-ish.

"Oh no, humans are too good at progress, better punish them for it." It's a weird myth to reference in a world where we've become incredibly aware that the price of progress is not divine punishment, but that our own folly might be too great for our civilization to survive.

But anyway, that got dark, huh?

[lemonpeace]

You make interesting points. I did point out that free of any influence, Hal killed Krona, a Guardian.

Hal has a will and drive that is unique. Before draining the Central Power Battery, he "killed" Sinestro. In quick session, he took down Kilowog, Sinestro, and Boodikka (I think she was supposed to be a heavyweight at the time).

Hal was still capable of doing good deeds while possessed (healing John Stewart & reigniting Earth's sun).

I tend to think that whatever direction Hal decides, good or evil, he will go all out, and not much can stop him.

Sinestro willingly absorbed Parallax, and was surprisingly mellow. With the power boost, you'd think he would have done more. He was probably too preoccupied with the blue lady.

I think Parallax is only as effective as the person it bonds with. Parallax kicked up more dust with Hal than anyone else.

Guy did confront Hal in full Parallax mode (along with other top tier heroes), and got served.

It would have been interesting to see how John would have fared against Hal at that time. John had plenty motivation as the lost of the Central Power Battery cost him Katma.

Good points. My only nitpick (I hate to be that guy because as the one with the John icon it looks like I'm downplaying or poopooing on Hal's feats) is the killing of with Krona. The Krona feat is super impressive but, similar to the rampage feat, it's a bit misinterpreted. It's often interpreted as a matter of power level ("Krona had 1,000,000 power so Hal went 1,000,010 and did the kamehama and blew frieza away on planet namek") but it isn't really, it's impressive due to him having the will to overcome the rings protocol that prevents the slaying of Guardians. It's more like he fought a guy twice above his weight-class and he knocked him straight the **** out rather than him just being physically stronger, ya know? Everything else, I understand and I concur

I don't think John vs Hal, when he was losing his ****, would've have been a fair right by virtue of the fact that John was a Guardian and, unlike the Guardians (who just watched him slaughter all the Lanterns then gave up and died) John would've actually just taken him out immediately. If he could've maintained his Guardianship and fought Hal when he became Parallax, that would've been a pretty righteous fight to behold.

I think if you boil it down, on paper, John and Hal are the ones (among the humans at least) who are the best candidates for most dangerous as strictly green lanterns but for different reasons. John has the tactical and skill advantage (kinda like the GL Batman) but Hal is kind of like the Superman of the GL, in the sense that he can just do some of the most ridiculously insane feats imaginable. It's one if those fights that I would like to see play out but the issue is that John's characterization has been consistently weaker than Hal's over the last few years so I unfortunately don't think he'd stand a chance until he has some better new storylines under his belt.

But in a broader sense I think people like Sodam Yat and Mogo present better cases in a straightforward battle of dangerous greens.

[Anthony Shaw]

"Oh no, humans are too good at progress, better punish them for it." It's a weird myth to reference in a world where we've become incredibly aware that the price of progress is not divine punishment, but that our own folly might be too great for our civilization to survive.

But anyway, that got dark, huh?

I think of it more like humans need to stay in their lane. You can't rub elbows with the higher power which seems like what Vidar & Krona were trying to do.

[Zero Hunter]

You all underestimate how dangerous Guy can be. Guy is born fighter and will not stop. John and Kyle both would hesitate in a kill or be killed situation while Guy would not. Even Hal would probably hesitate.

[Anthony Shaw]

Good points. My only nitpick (I hate to be that guy because as the one with the John icon it looks like I'm downplaying or poopooing on Hal's feats) is the killing of with Krona. The Krona feat is super impressive but, similar to the rampage feat, it's a bit misinterpreted. It's often interpreted as a matter of power level ("Krona had 1,000,000 power so Hal went 1,000,010 and did the kamehama and blew frieza away on planet namek") but it isn't really, it's impressive due to him having the will to overcome the rings protocol that prevents the slaying of Guardians. It's more like he fought a guy twice above his weight-class and he knocked him straight the **** out rather than him just being physically stronger, ya know? Everything else, I understand and I concur

I don't think John vs Hal, when he was losing his ****, would've have been a fair right by virtue of the fact that John was a Guardian and, unlike the Guardians (who just watched him slaughter all the Lanterns then gave up and died) John would've actually just taken him out immediately. If he could've maintained his Guardianship and fought Hal when he became Parallax, that would've been a pretty righteous fight to behold.

I think if you boil it down, on paper, John and Hal are the ones (among the humans at least) who are the best candidates for most dangerous as strictly green lanterns but for different reasons. John has the tactical and skill advantage (kinda like the GL Batman) but Hal is kind of like the Superman of the GL, in the sense that he can just do some of the most ridiculously insane feats imaginable. It's one if those fights that I would like to see play out but the issue is that John's characterization has been consistently weaker than Hal's over the last few years so I unfortunately don't think he'd stand a chance until he has some better new storylines under his belt.

But in a broader sense I think people like Sodam Yat and Mogo present better cases in a straightforward battle of dangerous greens.

Honestly, I have often compared Hal with Goku, lol. So, I totally see where you coming from. I consider Hal to be a Shōnen Jump hero. A lot of times, logic is gonna fly out the window.

The thing with John, like Piccolo, is that he's woefully underutilized. I honestly think John has as much will power as Hal. John's willpower exceeded his ring. John has the tactical thinking that Hal lacks. Hal is spur of the moment. He will literally say: I'll figure out a plan once I get there. While John has already plotted possible scenarios (and zeroing in on the best one).

I don't consider Guy the most dangerous due to the fact that he has been defeated. John defeated him when Guy was possibly at his most dangerous, Pre-Crisis. Guy can be stopped.

I have not put any energy into considering John dangerous because I believe the man is too rational, perhaps to his own detriment.

John has suffered as much trauma as Hal & Guy, yet has never really lost it. He has acted weird, even contemplated suicide, but nothing that would make him a world threat level. John may be more prone to harm himself before harming someone else. His trauma has yet to be retconned, like Hal & Guy, so he carries a world full of hurt.

I'm equating dangerous with unstable, someone who could lose control. I could be misinterpreting the premise of the thread. If so, I'm sorry.

I would consider Sodam & Mogo as powerhouses. Mogo is probably the most capable GL. I don't know enough about them to classify as dangerous.

[Anthony Shaw]

You all underestimate how dangerous Guy can be. Guy is born fighter and will not stop. John and Kyle both would hesitate in a kill or be killed situation while Guy would not. Even Hal would probably hesitate.

I love Guy, but his threat level can be contained through psychological manipulation. His anger can be used against him. I am basing my opinions on older stories. Both Hal & Batman have defeated Guy by messing with his head.

[Falcon16]

It is definitely Tower of Babel-ish.

STOP! Don't remind me of Justice League: Doom!

[lemonpeace]

Honestly, I have often compared Hal with Goku, lol. So, I totally see where you coming from. I consider Hal to be a Shōnen Jump hero. A lot of times, logic is gonna fly out the window.

The thing with John, like Piccolo, is that he's woefully underutilized. I honestly think John has as much will power as Hal. John's willpower exceeded his ring. John has the tactical thinking that Hal lacks. Hal is spur of the moment. He will literally say: I'll figure out a plan once I get there. While John has already plotted possible scenarios (and zeroing in on the best one).

I don't consider Guy the most dangerous due to the fact that he has been defeated. John defeated him when Guy was possibly at his most dangerous, Pre-Crisis. Guy can be stopped.

I have not put any energy into considering John dangerous because I believe the man is too rational, perhaps to his own detriment.

John has suffered as much trauma as Hal & Guy, yet has never really lost it. He has acted weird, even contemplated suicide, but nothing that would make him a world threat level. John may be more prone to harm himself before harming someone else. His trauma has yet to be retconned, like Hal & Guy, so he carries a world full of hurt.

I'm equating dangerous with unstable, someone who could lose control. I could be misinterpreting the premise of the thread. If so, I'm sorry.

I would consider Sodam & Mogo as powerhouses. Mogo is probably the most capable GL. I don't know enough about them to classify as dangerous.

Oh man, that shounen comparison is dead on, especially when the story is heavily focused on the extended Emotional Spectrum mythos.

But yeah, no that's definitely a viable interpretation of the premise, I try not to overexplain my threads to allow for more interesting answers and interpretations. My initial idea was more like in terms of how efficiently they could dispatch an enemy in a kill or be killed situation; like if you dropped the Corps in a royal rumble of sorts who would be the most dangerous person in that context more or less. However, your interpretation is definitely an interesting take on the premise, in that context, I think Guy or Hal would be the most dangerous considering their volatile natures. Kyle is too soft (read:well adjusted) to really lose control, Mogo is too nurturing and generally docile, and John is too emotionally disciplined. Sodam Yat is a wild card, he's a decently well-adjusted guy but not so much that I couldn't see him cutting loose if he was REEEEALLY pushed to the edge.

Guy is dangerous but nothing that most of the other high-tier Lanterns couldn't deal with, unless he was red or dual-wielding. Hal has a gained a more level head (if still reckless) disposition nowadays, however, despite later attempts to absolve him of the incident, has demonstrated that if pushed to extreme distress can be an exceedingly dangerous individual that not too many heroes (not just Lanterns) would be able to handle.

[Adekis]

I think of it more like humans need to stay in their lane. You can't rub elbows with the higher power which seems like what Vidar & Krona were trying to do.

I mean frankly, that explanation doesn't really make sense in the DCU. Lesser higher powers than whatever you might see at the Dawn of Creation "rub elbows" with humans all the time, and the ones that look down upon us are easily classified as megalomaniacs. The Source gets off in my opinion because it isn't a being, but the wellspring of Being, but if you ascribe too much agency too it, and it becomes too restrictive and too judgmental to humans, it starts to just look like a really big Super-Villain to me. So, you know, don't ascribe that kind of agency or judgment to it, obviously. Easy fix.

Because in the DCU, the best treatment for megalomaniacs with phenomenal cosmic power who consider themselves higher beings? Is for an uppity lesser being like Superman or Hal Jordan to stare it down and knock it the hell out. I mean, for example, certain unsympathetic Guardians pretty much fit that description, Krona included. If the main difference between Krona and the "higher power" is weight class, pure and simple, then I might actually be on Krona's side just out of principle, at least in that particular fight.

And, you know, again, the danger of getting too advanced or powerful isn't that it's just inherently wrong, it's that the powerful might misuse their power to hurt the weak.

[Anthony Shaw]

Oh man, that shounen comparison is dead on, especially when the story is heavily focused on the extended Emotional Spectrum mythos.

But yeah, no that's definitely a viable interpretation of the premise, I try not to overexplain my threads to allow for more interesting answers and interpretations. My initial idea was more like in terms of how efficiently they could dispatch an enemy in a kill or be killed situation; like if you dropped the Corps in a royal rumble of sorts who would be the most dangerous person in that context more or less. However, your interpretation is definitely an interesting take on the premise, in that context, I think Guy or Hal would be the most dangerous considering their volatile natures. Kyle is too soft (read:well adjusted) to really lose control, Mogo is too nurturing and generally docile, and John is too emotionally disciplined. Sodam Yat is a wild card, he's a decently well-adjusted guy but not so much that I couldn't see him cutting loose if he was REEEEALLY pushed to the edge.

Guy is dangerous but nothing that most of the other high-tier Lanterns couldn't deal with, unless he was red or dual-wielding. Hal has a gained a more level head (if still reckless) disposition nowadays, however, despite later attempts to absolve him of the incident, has demonstrated that if pushed to extreme distress can be an exceedingly dangerous individual that not too many heroes (not just Lanterns) would be able to handle.

I think Hal & John are the most capable, imo. Their extreme styles can be tough to deal with.

Hal may not even know how he will defeat you until the battle starts. Worse, he might see it as an adrenaline rush.

John was probably sizing his opponents up prior to the battle. During the fight, he's not running his mouth, he's analyzing the situation, and coming up with a feasible solution.

My problem with Sodam, iirc, he has one weakness, and was still exposed to lead in battle. His ring should be programmed to always be aware of lead.

Give Hugo Strange a power ring, and Guy Gardner is in trouble. Batman used basic mind tricks to defeat Guy. The fact that Guy still looks for ways to troll Bats to this day is telling. A master manipulator might make easy work of Guy.

While Hal has more feats, I will say John is the most capable GL.

The main weakness in Hal is his inability to utilize his comrades. He gotta put the whole world on his shoulders. Like Goku, Hal will be the one fighting while everyone else stands still, and watches. DC just has not written the story where that backfires on Hal. Hal has capable allies, but us hesitant to use them. With Hal, what you see is what you get. It is a matter of how strong & aware your defense is when he comes at you.

With John, he knows how to maximize his resources, and allies. Everyone has a usage on the battlefield, and John will take advantage of that. The offense John throws at you might be a smokescreen for his real attack.

Sure, Hal's way can be more exciting, but it diminishes the supporting cast.

In sports terms, it is better for the whole team to lose, as opposed to the star having a bad game.

As a villain, I'd be more worried dealing with John Stewart.