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  1. #46
    Astonishing Member Tuck's Avatar
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    Love is an abstract concept. A reductionist view of it alters it to the point of making it something else.

    Science can't tell us what justice is, or friendship, what is moral. There are things that can be studied by science that might inform how we approach those topics, even potentially how or why we came up with them, but not what they are, or should be, or what their bounds are.

  2. #47
    Swollen Member GOLGO 13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    So can you choose to believe Jesus was the son of God?
    Speaking as God's 3rd most favorite son I can speak quite confidently that you & I are also sons of God.

  3. #48
    Oni of the Ash Moon Ronin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tuck View Post
    Love is an abstract concept. A reductionist view of it alters it to the point of making it something else.

    Science can't tell us what justice is, or friendship, what is moral. There are things that can be studied by science that might inform how we approach those topics, even potentially how or why we came up with them, but not what they are, or should be, or what their bounds are.
    Thank you, That backs up my idea of love in the realm of believe rather than concrete truth. Science, has not the capacity to delve the Spiritual by definition (Sam Harris has tried though) the same with love. Now there is biological connection to love but that is not the same as what the social abstraction of love as shown in books, movies, songs, and such.
    Surely not everybody was kung fu fighting

  4. #49
    Invincible Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GOLGO 13 View Post
    Speaking as God's 3rd most favorite son I can speak quite confidently that you & I are also sons of God.
    Then I am an orphan, for my "Father" does not exist.
    There came a time when the Old Gods died! The Brave died with the Cunning! The Noble perished locked in battle with unleashed Evil! It was the last day for them! An ancient era was passing in fiery holocaust!

  5. #50
    Astonishing Member Tuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Ronin View Post
    Thank you, That backs up my idea of love in the realm of believe rather than concrete truth. Science, has not the capacity to delve the Spiritual by definition (Sam Harris has tried though) the same with love. Now there is biological connection to love but that is not the same as what the social abstraction of love as shown in books, movies, songs, and such.
    I would still argue it's real simply because we have a concept of it and people experience it. It may, as a result of its subjectiveness, be impossible to nail down. And the recurring biological symptoms do strengthen at least the argument that it exists. (Someone else's professed love would fall under belief in that person's sincerity and/or capacity to comprehend their own feelings.)

    I guess the issue is more of linguistics in this way. And I'm not suggesting that the concept of unicorns mean they exist. But we don't see proof of unicorns. We do see proof of love, and those expressions themselves help to form and/or shore up the definition of love. (I kind of think this is the situation with a lot of abstractions, from as I wrote previously justice to even things like economics.)

  6. #51
    Invincible Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    Love doesn't so much exists as much as it is a construct to describe of how we feel and think.
    There came a time when the Old Gods died! The Brave died with the Cunning! The Noble perished locked in battle with unleashed Evil! It was the last day for them! An ancient era was passing in fiery holocaust!

  7. #52
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    If you're indoctrinated as a child to be in x religion, did you really have a choice?

  8. #53
    Postin' since Aug '05 Dalak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shooshoomanjoe View Post
    If you're indoctrinated as a child to be in x religion, did you really have a choice?
    Considering how many have abandoned cults and/or being raised by strict fundamentalist believers of BLANK when exposed to outside ideas I think they still get a chance to free their minds rather than ignore that which threatens their worldview.

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