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  1. #91
    Titans Together!! byrd156's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BohemiaDrinker View Post
    That's unfair. We may harp on Lobdell all we want, but he does put on more effort than anyone else.

    It can't be easy to be the guy editorial turns to every time they need a turd polished, and he does it like a pro.
    Is it really that hard to hand over something mediocre after something truly awful?

    Ric is basically We Are Nightwing right now with overly 90s narration boxes that explains how "Ric" feels all the time, nothing unique and a very boring style to read. There's nothing subtle to his writing, it is what it is. That's the best way to describe him. He's honestly the only comic book writer I can think of where I haven't like a single issue he has put out.

    The guy gets to write comics for a living, I would do anything to have that job. Give me a weekend, a terrible story as my springboard and I can push out a "pro" script like his. I think most people could do that kinda work with just a little bit of effort. It's professional of him to always take these jobs but I would argue that his quality is not up to pro status. He always takes a job which I respect that about him but other than that what he does with those assignments have always been less than meh to me. If DC asks you do do a follow up to a terrible story, you have nowhere to go but up. If it's bad then oh well so was the thing it spawned from, but it decent to good suddenly that guy looks like a big shot. He could say no to something but if he keeps saying yes then he'll get more clout at DC and start doing more things that he wants which is kinda worrying to me. He feels like he could be one of the guys at the top or near it for DC in the next decade or so. I don't want someone who is molded by this era going to the top but it will happen. Whether it's Lobdell or someone else.
    "It's too bad she won't live! But then again, who does? - Gaff Blade Runner

    "In a short time, this will be a long time ago." - Werner Slow West

    "One of the biggest problems in the industry is apathy right now." - Dan Didio Co-Publisher of I Wonder Why That Is Comics

  2. #92
    Ultimate Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cranger View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by BohemiaDrinker View Post
    Further, rumors were that this book was to be announced at SDCC,right? Yet it's announcement comes in an uneventful Wednesday. Written by a so-so, yes-man writer. I can only think that they had to rush the announcement out because of HiC's reception, and that they had to put Lobdell in it because he was the only one who'd say "yes" fast enough to both doing the book and writing whatever editorial wanted in it.
    Rumor/speculation? They are announcing a bunch of stuff today, so is Marvel. Coincidence? Plan? Conspiracy? Where is BC to tell us?
    How much is SDCC even really focusing on "comic books" these days?
    I thought it was more heavily into things like movies and maybe TV shows in the past few years?

  3. #93
    Titans Together!! byrd156's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    How much is SDCC even really focusing on "comic books" these days?
    I thought it was more heavily into things like movies and maybe TV shows in the past few years?
    Most comic related stuff I hear from SDCC is generally from creators who heckle fans for loving their products.
    "It's too bad she won't live! But then again, who does? - Gaff Blade Runner

    "In a short time, this will be a long time ago." - Werner Slow West

    "One of the biggest problems in the industry is apathy right now." - Dan Didio Co-Publisher of I Wonder Why That Is Comics

  4. #94
    D*mned Prince of Gotham JasonTodd428's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dred View Post
    This is literally the last chance some of us might ever get to support our favorite character. Not buying it just "proves" there is no interest in Wally for Didio to send up to his higher ups. That's literally why hey put this creative team on it, by the by.
    I don't believe this will be the absolute last chance to support a book starring Wally, not by a long shot. I've been reading for decades and seen lots of books and characters cycle in and out so I think its safe to say at some point a writer you enjoy will come onto a Wally book. If you think not buying this book is going to "prove" to Didio and the rest that there is no interest in the character (when there are plenty of outlets were fans are showing their support in a multitude of ways) then that is your opinion and you're entirely welcome to have it. I just happen to think that supporting a book you already know your going to dislike anyway wastes your time and money, which is why I've never understood that mentality, and is something that is only going to make you an unhappy fan of the character in the end. Personally, I don't like being an unhappy fan of a character because a creative team isn't my cuppa so I chose not to support those types of books and to wait until a creative team I like better comes onto a book. To be honest I'm not even sure that by supporting a book you loathe your doing the character any favors but that's just my opinion.
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  5. #95
    Astonishing Member Dark_Tzitzimine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by byrd156 View Post
    Is it really that hard to hand over something mediocre after something truly awful?

    Ric is basically We Are Nightwing right now with overly 90s narration boxes that explains how "Ric" feels all the time, nothing unique and a very boring style to read. There's nothing subtle to his writing, it is what it is. That's the best way to describe him. He's honestly the only comic book writer I can think of where I haven't like a single issue he has put out.

    The guy gets to write comics for a living, I would do anything to have that job. Give me a weekend, a terrible story as my springboard and I can push out a "pro" script like his. I think most people could do that kinda work with just a little bit of effort. It's professional of him to always take these jobs but I would argue that his quality is not up to pro status. He always takes a job which I respect that about him but other than that what he does with those assignments have always been less than meh to me. If DC asks you do do a follow up to a terrible story, you have nowhere to go but up. If it's bad then oh well so was the thing it spawned from, but it decent to good suddenly that guy looks like a big shot. He could say no to something but if he keeps saying yes then he'll get more clout at DC and start doing more things that he wants which is kinda worrying to me. He feels like he could be one of the guys at the top or near it for DC in the next decade or so. I don't want someone who is molded by this era going to the top but it will happen. Whether it's Lobdell or someone else.
    Jurgens has been writing Nightwing for months now though.

  6. #96
    Titans Together!! byrd156's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark_Tzitzimine View Post
    Jurgens has been writing Nightwing for months now though.
    Haven't read those, stopped reading outside of preview pages.
    "It's too bad she won't live! But then again, who does? - Gaff Blade Runner

    "In a short time, this will be a long time ago." - Werner Slow West

    "One of the biggest problems in the industry is apathy right now." - Dan Didio Co-Publisher of I Wonder Why That Is Comics

  7. #97
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    Lobdell was awesome on the X-men and he’s been killing it on Red Hood so I’ll give him a chance. Rich wasn’t his choice and King screws characters up so bad that it is difficult to clean up after him. I’ll be hoping that Lobdell is up to it and if, after reading a couple of issues, I don’t like it then I’ll drop it.

  8. #98
    Titans Together!! byrd156's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark_Tzitzimine View Post
    Jurgens has been writing Nightwing for months now though.
    Just checked and it's only been 2 months which is 2 seconds in comic time. And what's your point in pointing that out? Just because a new pinch hitter replaced the old one makes it seem like the previous one wasn't doing so hot.

    My thoughts on Lodbell don't change the books I've read of his. I bet if I read the stuff that Jurgens is putting out will be bad but I can probably find something enjoyable, maybe a funny line or something. Lodbell doesn't have anything like that to me.
    "It's too bad she won't live! But then again, who does? - Gaff Blade Runner

    "In a short time, this will be a long time ago." - Werner Slow West

    "One of the biggest problems in the industry is apathy right now." - Dan Didio Co-Publisher of I Wonder Why That Is Comics

  9. #99
    Anyone. Anywhere.Anytime. Arsenal's Avatar
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    Honest question: Why does Percy get no blame for Ric? Isn't he the one who set up how Ric behaves, why nobody else is involved, the taxi driving and all of the other stuff that people hate about the character so much? Is there some part of the equation that I'm missing here?

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by JasonTodd428 View Post
    I don't believe this will be the absolute last chance to support a book starring Wally, not by a long shot. I've been reading for decades and seen lots of books and characters cycle in and out so I think its safe to say at some point a writer you enjoy will come onto a Wally book. If you think not buying this book is going to "prove" to Didio and the rest that there is no interest in the character (when there are plenty of outlets were fans are showing their support in a multitude of ways) then that is your opinion and you're entirely welcome to have it. I just happen to think that supporting a book you already know your going to dislike anyway wastes your time and money, which is why I've never understood that mentality, and is something that is only going to make you an unhappy fan of the character in the end. Personally, I don't like being an unhappy fan of a character because a creative team isn't my cuppa so I chose not to support those types of books and to wait until a creative team I like better comes onto a book. To be honest I'm not even sure that by supporting a book you loathe your doing the character any favors but that's just my opinion.
    I'm already unhappy. Some success for him would be the first step to getting the unhappiness reversed.

    I'm glad your characters have such a freaking dirge of books that you have all the time in the world to see them come and go. But I'm guessing you haven't been paying attention to this particular character for the last 15 years if you think he's going to definitely get a book some day after this one. Because there's no guarantee on that by any stretch of the imagination. Wally West isn't a Batman character. He's not going to get cashed out for some tie in bucks. He is a marginal character that has no role in the universe to the people who control the universe.

    I don't know how many more 15 year periods I've got. I don't even know if DC Comics has 15 more years before it goes under. That you think A: Comics are endless and B: we have endless time is great for you but I don't.

  11. #101
    (Formerly ilash) Ilan Preskovsky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eto View Post
    Well, I mean at least it’s not written by Bendis/King, because that’d leave a terrible move.

    I’ll check out the first arc.
    I love King's work generally but can't disagree there. Bendis, on the other hand, would freaking kill it with a Wally West book. Hell, of all the writers at DC right now, he is probably my number 1 pick for a solo Wally West title.
    Check out my blog, Because Everyone Else Has One, for my regularly updated movie reviews.

  12. #102

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    I can understand the dread for Scott Lobdell. He's never been more than mediocre as a writer. His X-Men was bad Claremont-rehash (but I acknowledge that that's what Marvel wanted).

    However, why is there so much dislike for Brett Booth? He did Superman Rebirth, didn't he? I thought his Superman was pretty interesting. I think his take on Wally is just fine, so I'm not getting the backlash against Booth. Even if Booth was part of a hated Titans run, he wasn't the writer.




    Serious question: what exactly is wrong with the above picture? Are there better artists out there? Of course, but his stuff from the last few years that I've seen has been fine to me.

  13. #103
    Astonishing Member Pohzee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Comic-Reader Lad View Post
    I can understand the dread for Scott Lobdell. He's never been more than mediocre as a writer. His X-Men was bad Claremont-rehash (but I acknowledge that that's what Marvel wanted).

    However, why is there so much dislike for Brett Booth? He did Superman Rebirth, didn't he? I thought his Superman was pretty interesting. I think his take on Wally is just fine, so I'm not getting the backlash against Booth. Even if Booth was part of a hated Titans run, he wasn't the writer.




    Serious question: what exactly is wrong with the above picture? Are there better artists out there? Of course, but his stuff from the last few years that I've seen has been fine to me.
    On top of making all of his characters look like the same 18 year old on steroids, he's talked about how character driven stories are boring. He's all action, no storytelling in the worst way, so I doubt he was the tact to pull off something so delicate as this arc will need to be.

    Look no further than his collaborations in Titans Rebirth.
    It's the Dynamic Duo! Batman and Robin!... and Red Robin and Red Hood and Nightwing and Batwoman and Batgirl and Orphan and Spoiler and Bluebird and Lark and Gotham Girl and Talon and Batwing and Huntress and Azreal and Flamebird and Batcow?

    Since when could just anybody do what we trained to do? It makes it all dumb instead of special. Like it doesn't matter anymore.
    -Dick Grayson (Batman Inc.)


  14. #104
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    Booth's art is bad. I'm glad he's one of the voices fighting for Wally but I'd rather his art not drag down a book that's already going to struggle to sell. So many people will buy a book PURELY because of the art, and those same people will be driven away by schlocky 90s sameface, awful poses, terrible paneling, terrible expressions, complete inability to convey story, and blah blah the list goes on. No one's going to open these pages and think it's an instant buy when Booth's name and work are there. Far more will do the opposite.

    Put it this way. Imagine if this was announced with Manapul as the artist. Imagine how much the tenor of the conversation would change. People would still be upset that Lobdell is writing it, but they'd be excited to see Manapul draw Wally and The Flash again. That's not the case with Booth. He might have some small fanbase, but there is absolutely no excitement for him to draw it. There are 3 aspects to this announcement: Art, Writing, #of issues. Booth, Lobdell, Mini are all the bottom of the barrel.

    All of that said, Booth's art is obviously the least bad news about this direction in general. It's just the set up punch for the Lobdell awfulness haymaker. Booth also has a sordid history drawing Flash characters, presiding over such incidents as Bar Torr with Lobdell, New 52 horrible Wally rehash with Venditti, and the infamous pacemaker Wally Lazarus Contract bullshit. Every time he's touched it everything ended up bad. Not a good omen.
    Last edited by Dred; 06-12-2019 at 07:07 PM.

  15. #105
    (Formerly ilash) Ilan Preskovsky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Comic-Reader Lad View Post
    I can understand the dread for Scott Lobdell. He's never been more than mediocre as a writer. His X-Men was bad Claremont-rehash (but I acknowledge that that's what Marvel wanted).

    However, why is there so much dislike for Brett Booth? He did Superman Rebirth, didn't he? I thought his Superman was pretty interesting. I think his take on Wally is just fine, so I'm not getting the backlash against Booth. Even if Booth was part of a hated Titans run, he wasn't the writer.




    Serious question: what exactly is wrong with the above picture? Are there better artists out there? Of course, but his stuff from the last few years that I've seen has been fine to me.
    That piece is perfectly fine. Not amazing but, sure enough, nothing to complain about.

    The problem mostly arises when you get to Booth's sequential storytelling. He isn't good with facial expressions or character "acting". His sense of composition is really lacking. His pages usually come across as cluttered. His layouts are jarring at best, incomprehensible at worst. Whoever always colours his art is... not good. His faces look the same and the stock face he uses is not very appealing - especially on his female characters.

    This picture is easily among the best I've seen from him but mostly I just find his work incredibly ugly and offputting. Considering just how good the vast majority of art is at DC right now - even on books I have no interest in - he simply isn't good enough. Not by a very long shot.

    Sorry, I appreciate his enthusiasm and he may well be a nice guy but his art looks like it's permanently stuck in the mode of the worst of '90s Image.
    Check out my blog, Because Everyone Else Has One, for my regularly updated movie reviews.

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