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  1. #226
    Obsessed & Compelled Bored at 3:00AM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by j9ac9k View Post
    Two things about Jay's "son" comment:
    1) Men were "men" at a younger age back then and
    2) People live longer now and age slower - Barry probably looks and comes across as younger to them.

    I mean, when I see some of those older movie stars in their prime, it doesn't matter if I'm ten or more years older than they were, those guys still look older than me to my eyes.

    Do I get the "NO-Prize?"
    It's in the mail.

  2. #227
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Maybe that's ultimately why it was hard for people to completely buy into New 52 Earth-2...
    I bet that's a part of it at least.

    I think with Earth-2 it was a combination of several things; the characters being younger, the re-designs, the huge changes to the status quo and history......I thought E-2 was great under Robinson, but damn little about that book was anything that established JSA fans were going to recognize. And I cant speak for anyone else, but when I heard E-2 was coming back I was hoping it'd be the pre-Crisis JSA and older fans would have a familiar place to go, in the face of all the changes the New52 had wrought. Alas, we didn't get that nostalgic safe place.
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  3. #228
    FF purist/snob CaptCleghorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ascended View Post
    I bet that's a part of it at least.

    I think with Earth-2 it was a combination of several things; the characters being younger, the re-designs, the huge changes to the status quo and history......I thought E-2 was great under Robinson, but damn little about that book was anything that established JSA fans were going to recognize. And I cant speak for anyone else, but when I heard E-2 was coming back I was hoping it'd be the pre-Crisis JSA and older fans would have a familiar place to go, in the face of all the changes the New52 had wrought. Alas, we didn't get that nostalgic safe place.
    Earth 2 originally was a reimagining of the JSA characters being reborn in the modern age with modern sensibilites. The characterizations were meant to be similar to what they were in the Golden Age. Robinson did a pretty good job of this. But them DC wanted something else and Robinson left.

    The discussions about how much of Tom Taylor's run was him and how much was editorially driven has gone on and on. The direction was a new focus on Superman, Batman and their franchises. The characters who the book was about became back-up characters almost invisible for the first few months. The Daniel Wilson run has few supporters. Dan Abnett eventually brought the book back to where Robinson had it.

    Still, the series sold dozens of issues. I take from this the idea that DC wants to sell the franchise and there are enough fans to support it.

  4. #229
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptCleghorn View Post
    Earth 2 originally was a reimagining of the JSA characters being reborn in the modern age with modern sensibilites. The characterizations were meant to be similar to what they were in the Golden Age. Robinson did a pretty good job of this. But them DC wanted something else and Robinson left.

    The discussions about how much of Tom Taylor's run was him and how much was editorially driven has gone on and on. The direction was a new focus on Superman, Batman and their franchises. The characters who the book was about became back-up characters almost invisible for the first few months. The Daniel Wilson run has few supporters. Dan Abnett eventually brought the book back to where Robinson had it.

    Still, the series sold dozens of issues. I take from this the idea that DC wants to sell the franchise and there are enough fans to support it.
    It was basically an "Ultimate" take on the JSA and Earth-2. I think Robinson had a good handle on that kind of concept before it went sideways quick, though it's not a substitute for the real JSA in my opinion.

  5. #230
    Mighty Member Electricmastro's Avatar
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    I never did quite understand why DC resorted to having multiple different earths for the Justice Society and Justice League, when they could have just presented the conclusion that they both existed on the same Earth, but in different time periods.

  6. #231
    Mighty Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Electricmastro View Post
    I never did quite understand why DC resorted to having multiple different earths for the Justice Society and Justice League, when they could have just presented the conclusion that they both existed on the same Earth, but in different time periods.
    Probably because Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman couldn't be part of both teams without a significant age up.

  7. #232
    Mighty Member Electricmastro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    Probably because Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman couldn't be part of both teams without a significant age up.
    See, I wasn't always so sure about that, because I figured that could easily be explained away with Superman's alien background, Wonder Woman's mythological background, and Batman be in suspended animation, and even have Dick Grayson take over as Batman for a time.


  8. #233
    Mighty Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Electricmastro View Post
    See, I wasn't always so sure about that, because I figured that could easily be explained away with Superman's alien background, Wonder Woman's mythological background, and Batman be in suspended animation, and even have Dick Grayson take over as Batman for a time.

    Well, that could solve it for them, but not their supporting cast, it'd look a lot less believable to have a Supes who should be Perry's age and still look like he's on his 30's, and the three of them would have this issue, since Diana also had a secret identity back then.

    Excuses could be made to why the supporting cast isn't being aged, but honestly, the writters would be raising more questions than answers, saying JSA and JLA aren't from the same universe looks like the easier alternative, and that one raises more questions than answers too...

  9. #234
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptCleghorn View Post
    Earth 2 originally was a reimagining of the JSA characters being reborn in the modern age with modern sensibilites. The characterizations were meant to be similar to what they were in the Golden Age. Robinson did a pretty good job of this. But them DC wanted something else and Robinson left.
    Oh, I know. I thought Robinson did a solid job. But even a fairly loyal adaptation of the JSA into modern, new heroes is a huge change from how people think of the group.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    Well, that could solve it for them, but not their supporting cast, it'd look a lot less believable to have a Supes who should be Perry's age and still look like he's on his 30's, and the three of them would have this issue, since Diana also had a secret identity back then.

    Excuses could be made to why the supporting cast isn't being aged, but honestly, the writters would be raising more questions than answers, saying JSA and JLA aren't from the same universe looks like the easier alternative, and that one raises more questions than answers too...
    I think at this point you're going to have problems no matter what. Half the team's history is set in pre-Crisis, the other half post-Crisis clutter earth. That alone isn't super easy to reconcile in a seamless, easy to digest manner. The WWII setting is too important to the JSA to be ignored, and you gotta account for how these heroes are still alive, much less active. That's not such a big deal (the important/popular ones are largely kept young-ish by their powers), but the spouses and kids are another matter. No matter how you handle it now, it's gonna be weird and clumsy.
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  10. #235
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    With the JSA flourishing in other mediums outside of comics and no JSA title on the horizon even after the conclusion of Doomsday Clock, it's hard not to read a little into a comment by the Golden Age Robotman in the Dan DiDio written Metal Men issue 4..."Geriatric JSA fans" indeed...Wonder if this is DiDio's meta commentary on how he views the original super-team and their fans and why no one at DC seems able to produce (or even cares enough to produce ) a worthy successor to the original 1999 HIT JSA series?

    https://www.bleedingcool.com/2020/01...en-4-spoilers/

  11. #236
    Astonishing Member sifighter's Avatar
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    I think we are gonna have to wait until post Snyder's "Death Metal" and 5G for the JSA. We have already established they definitely exist in the universe, not just from Doomsday Clock but also Justice League and Wonder Woman #750, but I think the current state of things are just to crazy to have them start up in the universe again and are waiting for the relaunch titles period before letting them loose.

    I mean right now we have to deal with all the crazy universe bending effects of Doomsday Clock, The Dark Multiverse from Metal, and Perpetua of the JL story plus whatever crazy crisis is next that will age the universe. I think once those have all ended and DC has started relaunching things in 5G is when we will see them get an ongoing, whether that will be the classic line-up, geoff johns line-up from Doomsday Clock, or some new line-up will remain to be seen.
    "It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
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  12. #237
    Incredible Member docmidnite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stingo View Post
    With the JSA flourishing in other mediums outside of comics and no JSA title on the horizon even after the conclusion of Doomsday Clock, it's hard not to read a little into a comment by the Golden Age Robotman in the Dan DiDio written Metal Men issue 4..."Geriatric JSA fans" indeed...Wonder if this is DiDio's meta commentary on how he views the original super-team and their fans and why no one at DC seems able to produce (or even cares enough to produce ) a worthy successor to the original 1999 HIT JSA series?

    https://www.bleedingcool.com/2020/01...en-4-spoilers/
    I think you’re reading something into it that isn’t there. Robert Crane (who retroactively became a member of the JSA) is just lamenting the fact that the Metal Men/Tin was getting more autograph seekers than he was. That’s all.

  13. #238
    Astonishing Member sifighter's Avatar
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    Ok so apparently Geoff Johns is just flat out bringing them back as they were in Doomsday Clock in issue 14 of Shazam during his whole Superboy Prime story.

    https://www.newsarama.com/48752-geof...shazam-10.html
    "It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
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  14. #239
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    Quote Originally Posted by sifighter View Post
    Ok so apparently Geoff Johns is just flat out bringing them back as they were in Doomsday Clock in issue 14 of Shazam during his whole Superboy Prime story.

    https://www.newsarama.com/48752-geof...shazam-10.html
    Kind of shows you how important DC thinks the JSA are.

  15. #240
    Astonishing Member sifighter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by achilles View Post
    Kind of shows you how important DC thinks the JSA are.
    I'd more equate it to Geoff Johns honestly, I'd imagine that he feels that if he is bringing the team back he will write it again, but there's no JSA ongoing so he gonna use the ongoing he has. I'd assume especially more so after Bendis took the Legion of Superheroes.
    Last edited by sifighter; 01-23-2020 at 06:51 PM.
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