Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 37
  1. #1
    BANNED
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    155

    Default JL movie cut 4 racial bias? Johns unnecessarily the fall guy?

    I wonder if it's possible that the Justice League movie was edited in part (however minor) do to the fact that Cyborg is a black superhero?

    Before the Black Panther made a billion plus, the overwelming thought was that black films do not play well in foreign avenues like China.

    And today that may still be the case. The movie Shaft, which features all black leads, debuted poorly. But still might make up most of it's 30m budget because it has a high cinema score. But the shocking part about it is that when it hits international markets it will do so via Netflix on June 28. It's kind of surprising that Samuel L. Jackson's movie is going straight to streaming internationally in 2 weeks.

    Zach Snyder just released another still of his JL cut and like many others before it features Cyborg. But this one seems to be directly inspired by a scene from Geoff Johns Darkseid War storyline when Cyborg hacked and went into the Green Lantern ring. Also in Cyborg # 7 by David Walker Cyborg's mother came back to life in a cybernetic 'ghost' form thanks to the motherbox. Zach's JL is heavily influenced by Geoff John's JL run so it's kind of strange for Geoff John to shoulder the blame for JL's failure. I believe that in part Geoff was force to cut out Cyborg's scenes so it would sell better in foreign markets like China.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Wakeneuron; 06-17-2019 at 05:48 AM.

  2. #2
    BANNED
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    155

    Default

    I didn't realise the caption had the f bomb. I can't seem to edit it out.

  3. #3
    Extraordinary Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    6,137

    Default

    Honestly if they cut Cyborgs role down it had probably more to do with him being far less popular then the rest of the team, then with him being Black. And one black guy in a team with 5 white guys is also not really a black lead movie.

    About Johns being unfairly blamed for the failure, imo that's at least partly the case, since they were imo already to far into production of the movie before Johns came on board, for him to really make substantial changes, and a big part for Justice League underperforming was probably also BvS.

    The two movies that afaik started production when Jones was in charge (Aquaman and Shazam) on the other hand were actually quite good (even if Shazam didn't make much money).

  4. #4
    Extraordinary Member j9ac9k's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    5,459

    Default

    The answer to your question is always going to be "Maybe, maybe not" unless someone in charge of the project actually says so. The rest will be idle speculation potentially leading to very heated race-based debates that will go nowhere and the answer will still be "Maybe, maybe not."

  5. #5
    Astonishing Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    3,472

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aahz View Post
    Honestly if they cut Cyborgs role down it had probably more to do with him being far less popular then the rest of the team, then with him being Black. And one black guy in a team with 5 white guys is also not really a black lead movie.
    Justice league had three white guys(batman,flash,superman),one white woman(wonder woman) and two poc(cyborg and aquaman).

  6. #6
    Mighty Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    1,924

    Default

    Johns and Diane Nelson were the falls guys to protect the leadership of WB especially Tsujihara who we have since learned is a total scumbag (and also has been shown the door in light of revelations about his behavior).

    Quote Originally Posted by Aahz View Post
    Honestly if they cut Cyborgs role down it had probably more to do with him being far less popular then the rest of the team, then with him being Black. And one black guy in a team with 5 white guys is also not really a black lead movie.

    About Johns being unfairly blamed for the failure, imo that's at least partly the case, since they were imo already to far into production of the movie before Johns came on board, for him to really make substantial changes, and a big part for Justice League underperforming was probably also BvS.

    The two movies that afaik started production when Jones was in charge (Aquaman and Shazam) on the other hand were actually quite good (even if Shazam didn't make much money).
    And he also had a hand in WW. And that turned out well. Too bad he lost the job and Rebirth went down the toilet as a result.

  7. #7
    Spectacular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Posts
    177

    Default

    Johns was definitely the fall guy for Justice League. His attempts to make it more humorous and lighter made it better received than BvS and the real fault of the movie was split between Snyder and Whedon, the lack of a delay leading to bad CGI and Ben Affleck just not caring anymore after the humiliation of BvS. The other DC movies with Johns involvement have all done a lot better.

  8. #8
    Astonishing Member kjn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    4,208

    Default

    Did racial bias play any role in how JL was edited or changed with the move from Snyder to Whedon as director, that might have an impact on Cyborg's role? Possible, but likely impossible to prove. Even if you were there. Everyday racism is death by a thousand small cuts rather than single big things.

    As for the team, it might be better to describe both Gal Gadot and Jason Momoa as white-passing than anything else here. Neither of them would likely experience any racism due to their looks alone; both of them have a heritage from cultures that have experienced a lot of oppression and racism.
    «Speaking generally, it is because of the desire of the tragic poets for the marvellous that so varied and inconsistent an account of Medea has been given out» (Diodorus Siculus, The Library of History [4.56.1])

  9. #9
    Extraordinary Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    6,137

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mace11 View Post
    Justice league had three white guys(batman,flash,superman),one white woman(wonder woman) and two poc(cyborg and aquaman).
    Ok I was more thinking about the comics version where Aquaman is also white. Btw. did they confirm his ethnicity already in Justice League ?

  10. #10
    Astonishing Member El_Gato's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    California
    Posts
    3,831

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aahz View Post
    Ok I was more thinking about the comics version where Aquaman is also white. Btw. did they confirm his ethnicity already in Justice League ?
    I haven't seen JL in a while so I can't say but I know in Aquaman they made it pretty clear he is biracial. His dad is a Brown Polynesian man.
    Done with DC. Can't handle the constant whiplash! Time to go on a hiatus!

  11. #11
    BANNED
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    155

    Default

    Warner Bros bought the rights to Mark Wahlberg's 6 Billion Dollar Man in Dec. 2017 one month after Justice League debuted from Harvey Weinstein's company. But deals like these takes months to negotiate. Could it be possible that they were negotiating even months before the JL reshoots and before the Harvey Weinstein accusations surface. It's a bit odd that the 6 Billion Dollar Man was sold before Harvey Weinstein's company filed for bankruptcy a few months later in Feb. 2018.

    This could definitely be a bit more evidence for racial bias. JL served as a spring board for a Cyborg solo film. But Warner Bros knew it wasn't going to happen many months before (speculation) because they were in the middle of negotiations for t6bdm. So the extra 50 million for reshoots were not just for added humor and to make the film a shorter stand alone instead of the first of a 2 parter. No. It could be possible that (speculation) this is a case of gentrification on film. The added cost for the JL reshoots may have also been use by Warner Bros to push Cyborg aside to make way for the six billion dollar man.tenor.jpg

    If the DCEU fails blame Marky Mark?
    Last edited by Wakeneuron; 06-17-2019 at 01:34 PM.

  12. #12
    Incredible Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    684

    Default

    I'm only surprised they attempted another shaft film with Samuel L Jackson after his previous attempt.

  13. #13
    Astonishing Member Clark_Kent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Smallville, KS
    Posts
    2,321

    Default

    It was ordered from on high that JL be no longer than 2 hours...as much as I would have enjoyed seeing Cyborg's expanded role, it wasn't crucial to the plot and so it was cut. See also: Clark's return to the ship to get a new suit, his conversation with Alfred to find out where Batman went, and many more things that weren't crucial to the plot. Snyder has heavily suggested that JL was 3hrs 14mins, so when you factor in that an hour and 14 minutes were removed to hit the 2hr mark, a lot of plot lines were dropped and not just for the Black character.
    "Darkseid...always hated music..."

    Every post I make, it should be assumed by the reader that the following statement is attached: "It's all subjective. What works for me doesn't necessarily work for you, and vice versa, and that's ok. You may have a different opinion on it, but this is mine. That's the wonderful thing about being a comics fan, it's all subjective."

  14. #14
    Three Legged Member married guy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Location
    Your mum's place
    Posts
    1,583

    Default

    There is no doubt that Geoff Johns was the fall guy.
    However, it's a stretch to suggest the film was cut for racial bias.
    As mentioned earlier, it was deemed that the film could be longer than 2 hours. It required a LOT of editing - to the point where the finished product was left feeling disjointed, despite best efforts.
    I am one of the few who enjoyed Justice League, despite it's many faults. Yes, it definitely could've been better, but I have also seen PLENTY worse.
    "My name is Wally West. I'm the fastest man alive!"
    I'll try being nicer if you try being smarter.

  15. #15

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by married guy View Post
    There is no doubt that Geoff Johns was the fall guy.
    Well, not THE fall guy, least we forget that Zack Snyder "stepped down" from the movie early in post-production.

    I think there was plenty of blame to go around for Justice League's failure.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •