Wheel of Time

[Jackalope89]

okay I THINK there was some subtext of Moraine and Siuane being pillow friends in the prequel book so I guess spoilers:

them being full blown lovers

end of spoilers isn't too much of a stretch. If you squint hard enough at it. Or at the least I know where it's coming from.

In any case the Par Vollen stuff was starting to drag so glad they're past it

spoilers:

Yeah. Books made it more like a thing that Novices and Accepted did, but rarely continued into wearing the shawl. And I guess this makes more sense as to why they would remain so trusting in private, than just being friends. Though, depending on how the writers do things going forward, this will complicate a number of future events. And Moiraine healing Mat by herself? Don't get me wrong, her healing ability is pretty good. But when it took, like a full circle, I think it was, in the books to heal Mat, yeah.

end of spoilers

While I'm glad they're heading now as well, Loial's appearance just isn't what it could have been/what I thought it could be. The actor's voice and mannerisms are about spot on, no complaints there. But the costume itself bland. And a few camera tricks/cheap computer stuff to make the guy taller would have been welcome.

For those that don't know, Loial is supposed to be as big as a Trolloc, but otherwise a big teddy bear that loves books. Which, personality wise, they got. Visually though, kind of a let down.

[Gray Lensman]

spoilers:

Yeah. Books made it more like a thing that Novices and Accepted did, but rarely continued into wearing the shawl. And I guess this makes more sense as to why they would remain so trusting in private, than just being friends. Though, depending on how the writers do things going forward, this will complicate a number of future events. And Moiraine healing Mat by herself? Don't get me wrong, her healing ability is pretty good. But when it took, like a full circle, I think it was, in the books to heal Mat, yeah.

end of spoilers

While I'm glad they're heading now as well, Loial's appearance just isn't what it could have been/what I thought it could be. The actor's voice and mannerisms are about spot on, no complaints there. But the costume itself bland. And a few camera tricks/cheap computer stuff to make the guy taller would have been welcome.

For those that don't know, Loial is supposed to be as big as a Trolloc, but otherwise a big teddy bear that loves books. Which, personality wise, they got. Visually though, kind of a let down.

spoilers:

The bit with Morraine and Siuan looks to me more like expanding/updating the books rather than a heavy change. Jordan wrote that part of the relationship as a phase, which isn't how such relationships are seen as today. The bigger change to me, is the change to how the waygates operate - they didn't need channeling to operate, and that change creates a cascade effect throughout the show. The gates are how the trollocs got into the Two Rivers without being detected, Fain follows them through a waygate and escapes through one later (and leaves the Black Wind as a guard on them), and one of the characters has to return to the Two Rivers in a later book via the ways (and NO ONE in his group can channel) - and lastly, Loial has to permanently seal one - all without the Power. They were created to be used by the Ogier, not one of whom can, has ever been able to, and likely will never be able to - channel the One Power. The cascade effect of that change should have caused a Darth Vader Nooooooooooo! to spring from the throat of the person whose job it is to figure out the effect of changes to the overall story - and Rafe mentioned having such a person on staff during a Q&A. The stuff with Mat is due to outside forces, and can actually be fixed more easily than first appears - if he stays behind because the evil dagger took hold, and rejoins due to an ability to track it (coming along with Verin) - that handles most of the issues created by Barney Harris' exit.

end of spoilers

[Ascended]

Despite the episode breaking away from the source material I thought episode 6 was a good one. They handled the dynamics in Tar Valon well and gave us a good view of what life is like inside the Tower, the political games, the secret-keeping...the show sold all of that and it felt authentic.

Moiraine cleansing Mat of the dagger.....in the books she did contain and slow the corruption on her own when she found the boys in Caemyln (Mat had to keep the dagger on him until he could get to the Tower, remember?). It took a full circle in the Tower to completely Heal him but that happened later, so perhaps the show will still give us a version of this.

The relationship between Moiraine and Siuan is, I think, actually better than what the books did and helps highlight what these two are willing to sacrifice for their quest. It humanizes Moiraine, which is good. The books talked about pillow friends among novices (which these two were), and some of the adults were hinted at being gay (and a rarer few firmly established as such) but I think this is a better direction that doesn't hinder the story, and actually cuts away a subplot with Siuan that, while fun in the books, isn't at all necessary. And it removes a weird twist with Moiraine's love life towards the end of the series that I always felt came out of the blue without anything to support it. That always annoyed me, and I'm glad the show will be avoiding it.

The Waygate.....that I'm not as happy about. Seems like they fused Waygates and portal stones into one thing. That's the kind of simplifying that must look real attractive to a showrunner trying to cram this story into a manageable live action production but like Gray Lensman says, that screws up a ton of things, including how the trollocs got into the Two Rivers in the first place.

Mat being left behind....well, I guess that's because of the actor leaving so there's not much to be done about that. It'll twist up events in the Great Hunt but I feel like it's not as troubling a change as the Waygate. The Great Hunt's main plot could be reversed; rather than trying to find....that particular item......with Mat, they could be trying to find Mat instead, and everyone still ends up at roughly the same place.

I'm less impressed with how they're handling the Eye of the World. In the books, the characters hear several unrelated stories about it, each one confirming the others, and that sends Moiraine and the others after it. But I don't remember that happening here, it's just a dream Siuan has right? And the talk about how the Dark One is weak and they could kill him, and how the Eye sits at the Dark One's prison....none of that feels right.

It's one thing for the village kids to believe the Dark One can die, quite another for people as intelligent and educated as Moiraine and Siuan. That was even a point of contention between Rand and Moiraine for a time; he thought the Shadow was dead while she knew better. And Moiraine doing something as risky as taking the Ways, based on nothing but a dream Siuan has? Is Moiraine aware of the dreams the kids are having? I don't recall if they told her in the show but if so, trusting Siuan's dream when you know the Shadow is screwing with the dreams of potential Dragons seems straight up stupid.

And the idea that the Eye is at Shayol Ghul....I dunno. I always thought the Eye was a bit of a weird tangent for the series; it's true purpose remains unknown and you never see anything quite like the Eye again. It ends up being rather pointless really, beyond just setting up the next series of events. But making it part of the Dark One's prison....that might work, depending on how they spin it, but it could just as easily screw up everything that comes afterwards.

[Hiromi]

yeah the Mat thing is a bit more than what happened in the book but provided he does what I think he'll do next andspoilers:

steal back the dagger

end of spoilersthe plot line will remain essentially unchanged outside of some details, the warnings Moraine gave about it were too explicit to be anything other than foreshadowing

at this point I'm just hoping spoilers:

they reveal Rand as the dragon sooner rather than later so they'll stop bringing up Egwene and now even Nynaeve as possibly Dragon reborn as I still utterly despise this particular change)

end of spoilers

Also I don't like this Loial costume either but Animashaun at least absolutely nails the character and has been really enjoyable on screen so its not as bad as it could be

[Sutekh]

The Waygate... that I'm not as happy about. Seems like they fused Waygates and portal stones into one thing. That's the kind of simplifying that must look real attractive to a showrunner trying to cram this story into a manageable live action production but like Gray Lensman says, that screws up a ton of things, including how the trollocs got into the Two Rivers in the first place.

My current thought is that since they are having to condense so much, it's going to be a lead-in to the introduction of the Forsaken, that they are the channelers that are opening up the waygates for the trollocs.

Given the difference between screen and page, I'd also expect there to be fewer of them. Thirteen new characters (in addition to all the other ones they've yet to address, if they even do, like Elayne, Min, Birgitte, Aviendha, etc.) seems a bit much.

[Hiromi]

honestly think the number of Forsaken as a problem is overblown, its not like the 13 were ever active in the story all at the same time, some either die quickly with their entire plot told within a single book, some disappear for large chunks if not the majority of the story, etc
so I could see it handled either way either by condensing them to a smaller number or just focusing on a few of them at a time like the books did without any major blow to the story

[Jackalope89]

One thing the show squashed early on that will ruin any memes of it going forward is the severe lack of Bella. Poor horse. She deserves a statue honoring her.

The Waygate thing, yeah. That is a big difference from the books. And really, not in a good way (for the reasons already mentioned).

For the "having too many characters", I think we'll still get the major ones like Elayne, Aviendha, and a few others. But ones like spoilers:

Elaida

end of spoilers are now a huge question mark, considering what they've done with Liandrin.

[Gray Lensman]

One thing the show squashed early on that will ruin any memes of it going forward is the severe lack of Bella. Poor horse. She deserves a statue honoring her.

The Waygate thing, yeah. That is a big difference from the books. And really, not in a good way (for the reasons already mentioned).

For the "having too many characters", I think we'll still get the major ones like Elayne, Aviendha, and a few others. But ones like spoilers:

Elaida

end of spoilers are now a huge question mark, considering what they've done with Liandrin.

It could be that Liandrin is combined with Galina rather than the person you mentioned. Galina's story is much closer, even ending with a similar fate.

[CosmiComic]

I'm watching this show but haven't read the source material. How accurate is it?

[BeastieRunner]

I'm watching this show but haven't read the source material. How accurate is it?

The tone is pretty spot on as are the visuals. The characterizations are pretty spot on save a couple. Loial is really the only one, looks wise, that is disappointing. His take is book-accurate ... it is just the visual that is disappointing.

The story beats are similar but enough different so far to not feel weird. A 1:1 is not going to work with a prose to visual adaptation. I think the most important parts (the big story beats, tone, look, & feel) are pretty dang spot on.

[CosmiComic]

The tone is pretty spot on as are the visuals. The characterizations are pretty spot on save a couple. Loial is really the only one, looks wise, that is disappointing. His take is book-accurate ... it is just the visual that is disappointing.

The story beats are similar but enough different so far to not feel weird. A 1:1 is not going to work with a prose to visual adaptation. I think the most important parts (the big story beats, tone, look, & feel) are pretty dang spot on.

That's good to hear. You think the difference in Loial's appearance is due to budget, or is it a choice by the filmmakers.

[BeastieRunner]

That's good to hear. You think the difference in Loial's appearance is due to budget, or is it a choice by the filmmakers.

I honestly have no idea.

Given the expense they went for on some aspects, I'm confused why they would cheap out on the character look. I mean the trollocs are friggin' brilliant!

I'm sure when convention season hits after the first season is done, we'll have fans asking that question and maybe we'll get an answer.

[CosmiComic]

I honestly have no idea.

Given the expense they went for on some aspects, I'm confused why they would cheap out on the character look. I mean the trollocs are friggin' brilliant!

I'm sure when convention season hits after the first season is done, we'll have fans asking that question and maybe we'll get an answer.

Probably, yeah. Do you know which books are being adapted in S1?

[BeastieRunner]

Probably, yeah. Do you know which books are being adapted in S1?

So far the first one, Eye of the World, with some of the prequel (New Springs) sprinkled in. They are setting up via foreshadowing a lot of future events.

[hulahulk]

So, I'm asking for some speculation here from those who read the books (I have not). Based on the source material, how many seasons theoretically could this show run?