Vertigo is officially dead

[JonaX]

Didn't DC once have a kids label called Johnny DC for a time? DC Kids to me sounds more like that in a new guise.

[Ilan Preskovsky]

I've made my thoughts known about Vertigo a number of times on these boards. No need to get into that now.

I understand the idea behind this streamlining of DC's input but I worry both about pop-up imprints and how they're actually going to implement this. With the newly prudish attitude to even "mature" comics from the corporate heads at DC/ Warners, what does that actually mean for Black Label as a viable label?

Didio has talked about a "consistency of tone" for the DC Universe titles published under the "DC" banner, which is a problem in and of itself but I don't think the T/T+ divide will make much difference. There has never actually been a difference between the two and the general attitude has largely been massive levels of violence are OK, any swearing, nudity or sexual content is not. For all my worries about Didio's ineptitude as a creative overseer of the DCU, I would imagine that titles published under "DC" will be much the same as always.

My biggest question, though, is what does this mean for pop-up imprints like Young Animal and Wonder Comics. They have their own distinct tones that I'm worried will get lost if they're just folded into Black Label and DC, respectively.

And what about Bendis' Jinxworld imprint? His joining DC was contingent on them giving him space for his creator-owned works and I don't think he will be all too pleased if they shutter Jinxworld and fold his own stuff into Black Label.

And on that point, what is Black Label? Will it be mature company owned comics or will it also include creator-owned content too? I believe that American Vampire is joining Black Label but what about new creator-owned series? Will they stop publishing anything new not directly owned by DC or will they continue with the current Vertigo strategy but moved over to Black Label?

What about non-adult comics that have been published under the Black Label brand like New Frontier and All-Star Superman? Will they be re-rebranded?

There's still so much that is still in the air right now that I am worried that this is going to be yet another half-baked, disorganized mess that will come back to bite both DC and its customers in the ass.

[Frontier]

I've made my thoughts known about Vertigo a number of times on these boards. No need to get into that now.

I understand the idea behind this streamlining of DC's input but I worry both about pop-up imprints and how they're actually going to implement this. With the newly prudish attitude to even "mature" comics from the corporate heads at DC/ Warners, what does that actually mean for Black Label as a viable label?

Didio has talked about a "consistency of tone" for the DC Universe titles published under the "DC" banner, which is a problem in and of itself but I don't think the T/T+ divide will make much difference. There has never actually been a difference between the two and the general attitude has largely been massive levels of violence are OK, any swearing, nudity or sexual content is not. For all my worries about Didio's ineptitude as a creative overseer of the DCU, I would imagine that titles published under "DC" will be much the same as always.

My biggest question, though, is what does this mean for pop-up imprints like Young Animal and Wonder Comics. They have their own distinct tones that I'm worried will get lost if they're just folded into Black Label and DC, respectively.

And what about Bendis' Jinxworld imprint? His joining DC was contingent on them giving him space for his creator-owned works and I don't think he will be all too pleased if they shutter Jinxworld and fold his own stuff into Black Label.

And on that point, what is Black Label? Will it be mature company owned comics or will it also include creator-owned content too? I believe that American Vampire is joining Black Label but what about new creator-owned series? Will they stop publishing anything new not directly owned by DC or will they continue with the current Vertigo strategy but moved over to Black Label?

What about non-adult comics that have been published under the Black Label brand like New Frontier and All-Star Superman? Will they be re-rebranded?

There's still so much that is still in the air right now that I am worried that this is going to be yet another half-baked, disorganized mess that will come back to bite both DC and its customers in the ass.

On the positive side "DC Kids" looks to be pretty robust with all the stuff it has coming up (unsurprising since it collects both the Zoom and Ink books now).

[Nite-Wing]

This is mostly a result of the bad publicity and fallout of the bat penis issue
Give it a couple of years and vertigo will relaunch again
This is mostly for DC to save face and act like they have a clear cut publishing demo for all their books when in reality black label content is probably going to fall under the regular DC brand and vice versa

[Factor]

On the positive side "DC Kids" looks to be pretty robust with all the stuff it has coming up (unsurprising since it collects both the Zoom and Ink books now).

I was under the impression DC Kids is just the zoom books. Ink falls under the regular DC label now.

[Ilan Preskovsky]

I was under the impression DC Kids is just the zoom books. Ink falls under the regular DC label now.

Yeah, I was under the same impression. Either way, I'm glad these are continuing because for all of my issues with DC at the moment, especially in terms of their editorial/ business side, their attempts to reach out beyond the Direct Market is exceptionally admirable. I love comic book stores but they absolutely need to target other markets if the whole industry is to remain viable.

[Ramsay Snow]

Guys. I need consolation.
I was a poor kid from the ghettos of Istanbul, and Vertigo Comics meant everything to me. I cleaned toilets in order to make some money for a single floppy. I am also a person of literature, so to me, Vertigo was poetry in pictures, with all of its references to Italo Calvino, or Marques de Sade. Shade the Changing Man, Enigma, the Invisibles.... Today I cried for 2 minutes -remembering all those lonely hours in my bed trying to understand all the texts written in English...

I'm sad. Vertigo was special. Also, I don't think we are going to see collected editions of Shade or Sandman Mystery Theatre. Black Label won't touch anything other than Swamp, Hellblazer, or Transmetropolitan.

Thanks, Vertigo. You and the British indie band Suede were my backbones.

x

madmodpoetgod, you truly live up to your namesake.....While reading your post, I felt like I was watching a dramatic film which tugged at my heartstrings like nothing else! You, my friend, have a true appreciation of the arts, and I shall eat some kebap with rice pilaf in your honor.

I far prefer Depeche Mode over Suede, though, but we likely have differing tastes in music.

Iron chimp is correct about there being other books of a similar vein to those Vertigo titles of days yore. I haven't read that Milligan/McCarthy hardcover collection yet, but it's sitting in a pile of books in my bedroom waiting to be read. Plus, at least we have Image's current line-up of titles.

[friendly-fire-press]

Very concerned about the future of DC (but I guess I have been for several years now) and this just confirms it. Tho, like most people, I kinda saw the writing on the wall. Been a long time since Vertigo had a genuine blockbuster (obviously for a number of reasons). Concerned about the future of Black Label as well, frankly -- even tho it's only just started -- after the ridiculous hysteria over the full frontal nudity scene in Batman Damned and the subsequent censorship that followed, and the indefinite postponement of The Other History of the DC Universe. The whole thing just looks like wilful self-destruction. Such a senseless waste.

[Triniking1234]

This is mostly a result of the bad publicity and fallout of the bat penis issue
Give it a couple of years and vertigo will relaunch again
This is mostly for DC to save face and act like they have a clear cut publishing demo for all their books when in reality black label content is probably going to fall under the regular DC brand and vice versa

Bat Dick was a Black Label problem. Vertigo had a good series cancelled by puritans who don't read comics anyway and two writers had press so bad I'm not sure how they got hired in the first place. The remaining books weren't hits in the end. It's gonna be hard to recover from this now that Image is running laps around DC in terms of content outside the superhero stream.

[iron chimp]

I can see why they might want to clean up their act, get away from controversy, and reposition themselves as "safe" entertainment to chase the $$$.

But to market John Constantine to kids as part of that strategy? That is a Vertigo book level f'ed up thinking right there.
"We need something for kids"
"Hmm.. what about a smoking drinking drug using pervert demon slaying hex magician?"
"I dont know..."
"But its stories from when he's a kid at high school"
"Genius. Commission it"

What's next? The Young Hitler colouring book? The further adventures of Teenage Charles Manson and the Dune Buggy Attack Crew.

[Vampire Savior]

Vertigo had a number of misstepts.

First and foremost was bad content.
Then they apparently knowingly hired a sexual harrasser.
Then one of their artists sent Ethan Van Sciver a picture of his anus.
Then they had the troubles with that Jesus comic.
They couldn't compete with Image.

It probably wasn't worth the trouble, and on top of that DC had a glut of useless imprints. That said, I would have kept Vertigo because of the brand name and gotten rid of Black Label. I would have completely restructured Vertigo and fired the editors in charge, though.

[cgh]

Vertigo had a number of misstepts.

First and foremost was bad content.
Then they apparently knowingly hired a sexual harrasser.
Then one of their artists sent Ethan Van Sciver a picture of his anus.
Then they had the troubles with that Jesus comic.
They couldn't compete with Image.

It probably wasn't worth the trouble, and on top of that DC had a glut of useless imprints. That said, I would have kept Vertigo because of the brand name and gotten rid of Black Label. I would have completely restructured Vertigo and fired the editors in charge, though.

For sure these are all problems. But the fundamental issue is that the deal Image (and others, eg Boom!, where Matt Kindt seems to hang out) offers is simply better. Creators own their work and therefore make more money. I think a lot of stupidity, like unasked-for anus pics, would be easily overlooked if there was adequate compensation and rights acknowledgment. But that is not the Big Two business model.

I think we'll continue to see creators building their reputations in superhero comics and then eventually making the jump to creator-owned to do the stuff they really want to do and to get paid. It brings to mind the old saying that no one does superhero comics because they want to, but because they have to. I'm sure that's an exaggeration but still truthful at its core.

[Triniking1234]

For sure these are all problems. But the fundamental issue is that the deal Image (and others, eg Boom!, where Matt Kindt seems to hang out) offers is simply better. Creators own their work and therefore make more money. I think a lot of stupidity, like unasked-for anus pics, would be easily overlooked if there was adequate compensation and rights acknowledgment. But that is not the Big Two business model.

I think we'll continue to see creators building their reputations in superhero comics and then eventually making the jump to creator-owned to do the stuff they really want to do and to get paid. It brings to mind the old saying that no one does superhero comics because they want to, but because they have to. I'm sure that's an exaggeration but still truthful at its core.

Harassing people shouldn't be overlooked. Stop hiring shady people.

[Vampire Savior]

For sure these are all problems. But the fundamental issue is that the deal Image (and others, eg Boom!, where Matt Kindt seems to hang out) offers is simply better. Creators own their work and therefore make more money. I think a lot of stupidity, like unasked-for anus pics, would be easily overlooked if there was adequate compensation and rights acknowledgment. But that is not the Big Two business model.

I mentioned that Vertigo can't compete with Image, which is a big part of the equation, but the stuff you want overlooked is legitimate harassment, and it contributes heavily to bad publicity. And then when the company decided to promote that Jesus comic (which I'm personally indifferent to), that was even more bad publicity, on top of having a dude who allegedly sexually harasses underage girls. It was a sh*t show of bad publicity for Vertigo, while the imprint likely wasn't even bringing in much money.

[skyvolt2000]

Harassing people shouldn't be overlooked. Stop hiring shady people.

If you mean Eric-I agree 100%.

If you mean Magdalene Visaggio-who was attacked by that group since DAY ONE-we have to disagree.

If the entitlement group who take issue with books that they NEVER read because they feel like certain folks have to have an accumulate resume to write comics. So far all I have seen are the same few names being tossed out not one thing about the CONTENT of the books. If "politics" in comics is such an issue for these books-the complainers would have had STROKES with books like Animal Man, Doom Patrol, Preacher, Y, DMZ, Sandman & Swamp Thing.

Not to mention these guys-
American Way 1 & 2 (a book about the first super hero who HAPPENS to be a Black Man) written by an Oscar winner for 12 Years a Slave and a black man.
Same with Unknown Solider-about a black man fighting during the Lord's Resistance Army insurgency of Uganda in 2002 and drawn by an artist who lived it.
100 Bullets says HI. With a story where a black boy gets his BRAINS blown out on orders by a thug because the kid shot the wrong person.
Millennium Fever-a biracial black guy turns into a pregnant woman.
Haunted Tank-where that Jeb Stuart hates the fact one of his descendant is black
Do we even need to discuss Scalped? Social commentary on Native Americans on a reservation by the person who made Jane Foster Thor.

the stuff you want overlooked is legitimate harassment, and it contributes heavily to bad publicity.

They were doing it for years with that Wonder Woman editor. Even when he got called out in the past. They stood by him for a long time.
See when you LET this crap go on for years with one guy don't be shocked when it happens again.

Bottom line is Vertigo got shutdown because DC did not want to properly COMPENSATE or give CREDIT to folks. It's what Tony Isabella, Dan Decarlos, Sulkinds and others FOUGHT for. It why Ethan Van Sciver threw away his DC career to work on his own stuff. It's why DC does NOT own Static.
Folks saw this and bolted to other places to get their just DUE. Or they don't bother trying comics and stay in movies & tv.

That is a DC management issue and that falls on WHO??

THIS IS WHAT NEEDS TO BE TALKED ABOUT-not creators that certain folks don't like. DC is about to have more competition.

But to market John Constantine to kids as part of that strategy? That is a Vertigo book level f'ed up thinking right there.

John and the Vertigo books are ALREADY being marketed to kids. Check your local library. If you go the ones in my city-all those books are mixed in with kids books at libraries.
Most stores do NOT separate the books unless they have a cartoon show like My Little Pony.