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  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by superduperman View Post
    The way I see it, there are only two ways to go:

    1) Hard reboot ala the Earth One line. Everyone starts at zero. New Superman. New Batman. New Wonder Woman. No sidekicks. We get to see everything from the beginning. In a way I could see the EO line becoming a sort of new continuity unto itself. This might be kind of a hard sell. New 52 was a hard enough sell and it still tried to keep some of the old history.

    2) Go back to the pre-COIE continuity by having some big event where the heroes go back and prevent the Crisis from ever happening in the first place and then incorporate some of the modern elements into the "old" continuity. Like the Super-marriage or the birth of Damien. Even then it might be a little hard to incorporate some elements like Jessica Cruz or what to do with Wally.
    You do that and that mass exodus of fans is even LARGER.

    Because you are still held hostage by when does BLANK show up. If Dick is Robin when does Jason, Tim & Damian show up? No one is going to wait 10-25 years.

    You would be better off doing a history of DC guide that starts out with a set origin for everybody. From Batman to Hawk & Dove and even Z list folks.

    Have it online and DC no fans update it. So if someone sees say Sideways in a book you have a place where you can go and get all his appearances and history to find those books.

  2. #47
    Ultimate Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    . . . You would be better off doing a history of DC guide that starts out with a set origin for everybody. From Batman to Hawk & Dove and even Z list folks.

    Have it online and DC no fans update it. So if someone sees say Sideways in a book you have a place where you can go and get all his appearances and history to find those books.
    If it's on-line only, might as well make all the comic books on-line only.

    Since I buy and read actual, physical comic books, I'm not interested in being told I HAVE TO go on-line if I really want something. It's a pain in the neck to me.

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    You do that and that mass exodus of fans is even LARGER.

    Because you are still held hostage by when does BLANK show up. If Dick is Robin when does Jason, Tim & Damian show up? No one is going to wait 10-25 years.
    And they shouldn't. The whole point of doing a hard reboot isn't so we can see the same stories retold. My opinion is that if you reset to Dick Grayson as Robin you might integrate things from Jason, Tim or Damian but that the rebooted Dick isn't locked into becoming Nightwing at any future point and there should be no plans in place to ever introduce his replacement. If someone writing a story in, say 2024, decides to revisit Jason or have Dick replacd by him- then so be it. But as of 2020 the plan going in should be Grayson as Robin forever.

    And with Kon-El, you come up with an origin when you are ready to introduce him that has no ties to Superman's death, the debut of Steel/Eradicator/Henshaw. Or you decide that finding a way to introduce Jon Samuel Kent is a better idea and leave Kon-El's time as Superboy a relic of old stories. Maybe you debut Bart as only slightly younger than Grayson with an older Wally having a short "Kid" Flash career before replacing the short lived Barry Allen, but even then this Wally isn't introduced destined to marry Linda Park just to perfectly recreate the prior stories. maybe you never introduce Donna and have Cassie as the first and only Wonder Girl. Maybe Roy Harper is an equal partner to Ollie from day one as Arsenal and a female Speedy (Mia or Emiko) is Ollie's tag-along sibling who becomes a hero over Ollie's objetions.

    The point is that the reboot should not be bound to wait to introduce characters if they feel it is better for sales or story to debut them earlier. It also is not bound to introduce things that were there before just because they were there before. Maybe this time instead of the Big Seven League slowly expanding we start day one in our second year with Superman, Batman, Hawkwoman, Black Lightning, Steel (Natasha posing as John Henry in the armor). Mister Miracle, an adult Blue Beetle (Ted or Jaime but they are the first hero with the name), and 3-5 other characters whose 1st year sale support their inclusion. Guys like Woneder Woman, Aquaman, and Martian Manhunter no longer get founder status just because in 1961 they were big names.

    Bottom line you aren't trying to appeal to the nostalgia of the readers from the 70's-2000's. And you aren't just counting on reintroducing the characters who sold big in the last 5 years and have a fanbase. You are trying to pull in the eyes who want to see these heroes as newbies and see where their stories go when they aren't tied to repeating some Wikipedia list of past adventures.

  4. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by AdamFTF View Post
    Okay, here's the idea for a new take on Hawkman. Katar and Shayera Hol are peacekeepers on the planet Thanagar, a desert planet with Egypt-like architecture. The peacekeepers are the equivalent of both soldiers and police officers. Most crimes on Thanagar occur because of base greed or the desire for thrills, usually by outsiders but not always. Crimes committed out of desperation are rare, not because hunger is unheard of but because the notion of "Thanagarian honor" is so strong that it's actually considered preferable to die of hunger than to steal food (okay, I can see problems with this one. I'm not married to it). There are all sorts of esoteric cultural rules like that on Thanagar. It's why Thanagarian peacekeepers don't use guns. It's considered the ultimate dishonor to deny an enemy the right of hand-to-hand combat. Unlike Hawkworld, which played up this whole corrupt '80s sci-fi society thing, the new one is meant to feel more like pulp sci-fi. Like Burroughs's Barsoom with some of Star Trek's Klingon warrior ethos added to it. Less focus on society, more on culture (the '60s Hawkman had all sorts of fun little Thangarian cultural bits in it). So, ultimately when they get to Earth it becomes about a couple of warriors from a truly alien culture trying to adapt to Earth by playing the roles of superheroes.

    Also, I'd like to keep the whole pseudo-fantasy vibe that Hawkman's enemies had. Hawkman's rogues often looked like some kind of mythical or fantastical creature but had a super-science basis. The Man-Hawks looked like Harpies. Shadow Thief looked like some kind of shadow demon. Matter Master looked like a wizard. The only one I can think of that didn't quite match up was I.Q., who dressed more like a pilot from a pulp adventuire novel.
    Sounds intriguing. Better than the reincarnated couple angle.
    Pull List:
    Marvel: Spider-Man:Renew Your Vows, Champions, Marvel Two-in-One, Fantastic Four (2018), Avengers (2018), Mr and Mrs X, Ironheart
    DC: Not much these days, but being cautiously optimistic for Shazam! (2018-2019) and Young Justice

  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Clark View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    You do that and that mass exodus of fans is even LARGER.

    Because you are still held hostage by when does BLANK show up. If Dick is Robin when does Jason, Tim & Damian show up? No one is going to wait 10-25 years.

    You would be better off doing a history of DC guide that starts out with a set origin for everybody. From Batman to Hawk & Dove and even Z list folks.

    Have it online and DC no fans update it. So if someone sees say Sideways in a book you have a place where you can go and get all his appearances and history to find those books.
    And they shouldn't. The whole point of doing a hard reboot isn't so we can see the same stories retold. My opinion is that if you reset to Dick Grayson as Robin you might integrate things from Jason, Tim or Damian but that the rebooted Dick isn't locked into becoming Nightwing at any future point and there should be no plans in place to ever introduce his replacement. If someone writing a story in, say 2024, decides to revisit Jason or have Dick replacd by him- then so be it. But as of 2020 the plan going in should be Grayson as Robin forever.

    And with Kon-El, you come up with an origin when you are ready to introduce him that has no ties to Superman's death, the debut of Steel/Eradicator/Henshaw. Or you decide that finding a way to introduce Jon Samuel Kent is a better idea and leave Kon-El's time as Superboy a relic of old stories. Maybe you debut Bart as only slightly younger than Grayson with an older Wally having a short "Kid" Flash career before replacing the short lived Barry Allen, but even then this Wally isn't introduced destined to marry Linda Park just to perfectly recreate the prior stories. maybe you never introduce Donna and have Cassie as the first and only Wonder Girl. Maybe Roy Harper is an equal partner to Ollie from day one as Arsenal and a female Speedy (Mia or Emiko) is Ollie's tag-along sibling who becomes a hero over Ollie's objetions.

    The point is that the reboot should not be bound to wait to introduce characters if they feel it is better for sales or story to debut them earlier. It also is not bound to introduce things that were there before just because they were there before. Maybe this time instead of the Big Seven League slowly expanding we start day one in our second year with Superman, Batman, Hawkwoman, Black Lightning, Steel (Natasha posing as John Henry in the armor). Mister Miracle, an adult Blue Beetle (Ted or Jaime but they are the first hero with the name), and 3-5 other characters whose 1st year sale support their inclusion. Guys like Woneder Woman, Aquaman, and Martian Manhunter no longer get founder status just because in 1961 they were big names.

    Bottom line you aren't trying to appeal to the nostalgia of the readers from the 70's-2000's. And you aren't just counting on reintroducing the characters who sold big in the last 5 years and have a fanbase. You are trying to pull in the eyes who want to see these heroes as newbies and see where their stories go when they aren't tied to repeating some Wikipedia list of past adventures.
    Impressive.

    I want a hard reboot because I want a simpler universe to tell stories. I also want the elimination of as much GrimDark as possible.

    I expect characters and other elements of mythology to be reintroduced...but not the same stories told again.

    I like your ideas, Jon Clark.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    No. A lot of folks were introduced before those events and many got screwed over.
    Are you sure? Because at least a few people in this thread seem to think so.

  7. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by scary harpy View Post
    Impressive.

    I want a hard reboot because I want a simpler universe to tell stories. I also want the elimination of as much GrimDark as possible.

    I expect characters and other elements of mythology to be reintroduced...but not the same stories told again.

    I like your ideas, Jon Clark.
    Sounds rather reasonable to me.
    Pull List:
    Marvel: Spider-Man:Renew Your Vows, Champions, Marvel Two-in-One, Fantastic Four (2018), Avengers (2018), Mr and Mrs X, Ironheart
    DC: Not much these days, but being cautiously optimistic for Shazam! (2018-2019) and Young Justice

  8. #53
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    Haven't thought much for the rest of the universe but have a few ideas regarding the Arrow clan and some magic/fantasy characters.

    Arrow Clan

    Artemis is a part of the group and has her YJ origin of being Jade's sister. She and Jade are half-sisters via the same mother. Jade went missing when they were children and ended up an assassin. She and Artemis reunite in present. Since the Wally relationship may not happen, I'll just pair her with Mia.

    Roy is of Navajo and Sioux origin here and has a sister named Brooke who is a government agent.

    Sin is a metahuman with the same powers as Dinah.

    Sara Lance exists as Dinah's half sister.

  9. #54
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    Shadowpact

    Members are Nightshade (I made her half-Filipino based on a fan project that race bent her), a new Nightmaster, Blue Devil, Lourdes Lucero, the Enchantress and Ragman.

    Eve's brother is alive and is a member of LAW (Living Assault Weapons) along with Judomaster, Ted Kord, Peacemaker, Crimson Avenger (Jill Carlyle) and Rampage.

    Enchantress doesn't have a split personality.

    Neron is a major antagonist for Shadowpact.

    They are public superheroes

  10. #55

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    New solos for my boys Jonah Hex, Sgt. Rock, Enemy Ace, and Lobo!
    Frag off ya krutackin' bastiches. Feetal's Gizz, am I the only one here with any D'ast sense? ...Ah shock, why did I spew all of that hateful drokk at y'all? That was fekt up of me. Sorry everyone, I'll make sure I'm not an ornery sprock next time I talk to ya.

  11. #56
    Mighty Member Robanker's Avatar
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    If we must reboot, we must enter the Justice Riders universe. Six shooters and super powers. A horse and cantankerous son-of-a-gun in every issue or you get a full refund.

    I don't care for reboots. Nothing says "toxic" to new readers than constantly hitting the reset button. Will they come back when they see #1s? Yes. Will they leave when they see that this is a trend and it will collapse in on them in five years? Also yes.


    People come to comics to read the adventures of the character they saw or played recently. History is the appeal. Just create entries. Don't cover them up and tell readers those stories aren't as worth their money because they don't count. Incentivize your readers to consume everything and just keep on with the same continuity.

    The ouroboros needs to stop, DC. Use events to retcon, sure, but move forward. So long as reboots are an option, "just one more" will keep occurring. No status quo will ever be perfect. Stop the lunacy.
    Last edited by Robanker; 07-22-2019 at 02:23 AM.

  12. #57
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    Anything other than JLA offspring titles or Batman related.hopefully some other Team Books coming back w new teams and members.


    The Squadron-formerly the All Star Squadron
    Gen 13
    Global Guardians
    Infinity Inc.
    JSA
    Marvel Family
    New Guardians
    Night Force
    The Omega Men
    Power Co.
    Primal Force
    Shadowpact
    Team Titans=1 book w multiple teams.

  13. #58
    Incredible Member Katana500's Avatar
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    rebooting back before new 52 and rebirth is such a bad idea.

    It will put off newer readers who started reading then, because everything they read would suddenly be pointless.

    the past should stay in the past. we need new stories and new status quo's

  14. #59
    Incredible Member kingaliencracker's Avatar
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    A hard reboot of the entire line. All the major players get a 6 issue mini series to flesh out the general parameters of the origin. That'll lead into the regular monthlies, as well as a 12 issue max series about the formation of the Justice League. Then we just keep rolling from there.

  15. #60
    Astonishing Member Starter Set's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingaliencracker View Post
    A hard reboot of the entire line
    That. And that would fix, till they mess it up again, the timeline.

    I don't think of course that it's ever going to happen but still, it's a somewhat enjoyable fantasy.

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