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  1. #16
    Mighty Member Anthony W's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    I'm going to respect She Hulk's me too movement. People were making pin ups of her.
    Which is happening to famous people right now which means it was ahead of its time.

    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    She was laughed at many times as the lesser Hulk. writers did have villians flirting with her instead of taking her seriously.
    You mean like how Ulik asked her to marry him? Kind of weird that Aaron is doing the same thing he is accusing others of. It's almost like he is using a movement as a cover to whine and throw tantrums...oh wait he is.

    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    And as seen by the court room scene in her mind all of her persona's exist but in this era of Time's Up this is the one she feels most comfortable in. Time is up on thinking Jen is just some bombshell hulk who is not to be taken seriously.
    Nope,I think ruined up on Jen being her own unique character but instead a whiney copy of the Hulk that villains STILL make passes at as she takes them out.

    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    Now she will be taken as seriously in battles as she is in the court room.
    I take it you missed the fight with Ulik? The one where he asked her to marry him?

    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    I'm here for it while it lasts and to me it was explained greatly. How many men are like oh women don't have to suffer cause their cute and people like them and they should be happy that they are seen that way. It wasn't Bruce's place to tell Jenn how she should or shouldn't feel because he wanted an outlet to complain about his own transformations.
    We are talking about Jen in particular, having a conversation that NEVER HAPPENED in a comic. It's just Aaron handwaving away his bad writing and hoping people buy into his faux woke act.
    Last edited by Anthony W; 06-26-2019 at 09:16 PM.
    "The Marvel EIC Chair has a certain curse that goes along with it: it tends to drive people insane, and ultimately, out of the business altogether. It is the notorious last stop for many staffers, as once you've sat in The Big Chair, your pariah status is usually locked in." Christopher Priest

  2. #17
    Mighty Member Biclopcicle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurolegacy View Post
    How long until we can get a new writer on Avengers because, not gonna lie, I’d even rank Bendis above Aaron thus far.
    Quoted for truth! I got sick of Bendis but I never dropped an arc as fast as I did this Aaron run on Avengers. This take on Jen is not a step forward, it's a step back. She was already empowered. Not the way maybe today's audience wants someone to be empowered, but empowered nonetheless.

    At some point the pendulum will swing back somewhat and people will realize that attractiveness is not some social construct, it's biological. It's an indicator of health and genetic fitness. We are biological entities last time I checked...this is a fundamental truth of our existence. People trying to say down is up etc is countproductive. Eat healthy and exercise, be the best version of you. How is that not an empowering and progressive message?

  3. #18
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurolegacy View Post
    And so what if there were pin-ups of her in the MU? There are pin-ups of actresses in the real world and they are still taken seriously for their. Hell there still exists things where men and women are voted sexiest man/woman on Earth and that detracts nothings from who they are or their accomplishments. This is a blatant point of just looking for things to be offended by that has become more prevalent and at the end of the day solves nothing because rather than focusing on actual problems, instead chooses to focus on the most minuscule of issues.

    And you keep say that at some point that she'll go back to normal but that shouldn't mean that fans should have to consume garbage that blatantly disrespects that character and all they stand for for God knows how long. So fans have a right to be bothered by such a thing.
    It also doesn't make sense to me since Jen generally enjoys being a bombshell and getting attention. If it's unwarranted she won't put up with it and she'll turn it around into something that empowers her because, well, she's She-Hulk. Not discount Hulk.

    I'm almost wondering if this Hulk overload form is messing with her mind and perspective to try and keep her in that form by making her think less of her old self.

  4. #19
    Mighty Member Biclopcicle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    It also doesn't make sense to me since Jen generally enjoys being a bombshell and getting attention. If it's unwarranted she won't put up with it and she'll turn it around into something that empowers her because, well, she's She-Hulk. Not discount Hulk.

    I'm almost wondering if this Hulk overload form is messing with her mind and perspective to try and keep her in that form by making her think less of her old self.
    I mean, ai get Aaron's point. Hes saying, "Jen's previous incarnation is invalid because dudes wrote it.". But Aaron --- you're also a dude! Do you not know women who enjoy looking good and being "proactive in their relationships?" Go to a large metropolitan area! Go to another country! Go to Brasil! Go to France! What the hell man

  5. #20
    Mighty Member Anthony W's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I'm almost wondering if this Hulk overload form is messing with her mind and perspective to try and keep her in that form by making her think less of her old self.
    You are giving Aaron way too much credit lol.
    "The Marvel EIC Chair has a certain curse that goes along with it: it tends to drive people insane, and ultimately, out of the business altogether. It is the notorious last stop for many staffers, as once you've sat in The Big Chair, your pariah status is usually locked in." Christopher Priest

  6. #21
    Mighty Member Anthony W's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Warren View Post
    As for those who didn't like it, oh well. Somehow Aaron has managed to craft a classic Thor run even while some fans insist that he's "ruined" the character. I think his treatment of Jen will survive similar criticism.
    His Thor run is "classic" in the same way the Clone Saga is classic. Once the novelty died so did it. History is not going to be kind to that run. It's only hope is a movie being made of it but everything Hemsworth does outside of Thor movies tank (See Men In Black...on second thought don't)so he is going to be in that role for quite some time.
    Last edited by Anthony W; 06-27-2019 at 12:06 AM.
    "The Marvel EIC Chair has a certain curse that goes along with it: it tends to drive people insane, and ultimately, out of the business altogether. It is the notorious last stop for many staffers, as once you've sat in The Big Chair, your pariah status is usually locked in." Christopher Priest

  7. #22
    Mighty Member Biclopcicle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony W View Post
    His Thor run is "classic" in the same way the Clone Saga is classic. Once the novelty died so did it. History is not going to be kind to that run. It's only hope is a movie being made of it but everything Hemsworth does outside of Thor movies tank (See Men In Black...on second thought don't)so he is going to be in that roll for quite some time.
    God Butcher and God Bomb were so great...if you want social commentary, there you go-- the gods are very easily seen as markers for social elite and big party politics. He overstepped his bounds with what happened after Thor became unworthy. Not just with Jane but with Odin. Odin, another guy who took his own eye to gain wisdom. Odin, who confronted the Celestials and parleyed with all the other earthly pantheons and had their trust. Odin, who mated with Gaea for the express reason of bearing a son who could have a greater impact in Midgard for its own betterment and protection. Just so lame

  8. #23
    Incredible Member charliehustle415's Avatar
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    Ulik the literal and forum troll, gotta love it

  9. #24
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    The problem with the She-Hulk thing is Aaron is doing the classic thing of "Women who want to be taken seriously arent sexy and dont like being sexy" which is ironically sexist in itself. There was whole runs with Janet coming to appreciate her human side and not getting the attention that she enjoyed as a party girl gamma with her also dealing with paparazzi types being a pita.

  10. #25
    Fantastic Member Flashback's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    I'm going to respect She Hulk's me too movement. People were making pin ups of her. She was laughed at many times as the lesser Hulk. writers did have villians flirting with her instead of taking her seriously. And as seen by the court room scene in her mind all of her persona's exist but in this era of Time's Up this is the one she feels most comfortable in. Time is up on thinking Jen is just some bombshell hulk who is not to be taken seriously. Now she will be taken as seriously in battles as she is in the court room. I'm here for it while it lasts and to me it was explained greatly. How many men are like oh women don't have to suffer cause their cute and people like them and they should be happy that they are seen that way. It wasn't Bruce's place to tell Jenn how she should or shouldn't feel because he wanted an outlet to complain about his own transformations.
    Yep, I just read it. I interpreted the line where she said:

    "I told him...looking like a big scary monster didn't sound so bad to me sometimes"

    to mean exactly what you said.

  11. #26
    Kinky Lil' Canine Snoop Dogg's Avatar
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    that all-seeing prick daredevil didn't mention hydra just let me die
    Dance games are my divine punishment from the Lord. May my furnace be forever fueled.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Warren View Post
    Yes, this was my feelings as well. I thought it was a strong issue and I really liked Aaron's take on Jen and I'm glad he had the space to explore it.

    He laid out Jen's state of mind in a compelling way and I appreciated the commentary on Jen always having to be the "sexy" Hulk in order to be more palatable.

    As for those who didn't like it, oh well. Somehow Aaron has managed to craft a classic Thor run even while some fans insist that he's "ruined" the character. I think his treatment of Jen will survive similar criticism.
    Opinions of his Thor vary, yes many love it and to them its 'classic', others, myself included in that detest what he'd written of Thor,

    Opinions vary, no one is more correct than the other

    Popular does not equal high quality, neither does it equal a lack of it

    Haven't read this avengers yet, but if it's suggested banner had it easy as the hulk, I'd take a camera over a nuclear strike or gated to some horrible dimensions or planets by my friends any day

  13. #28
    Kinky Lil' Canine Snoop Dogg's Avatar
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    looked up twitter reactions, found some porn
    Dance games are my divine punishment from the Lord. May my furnace be forever fueled.

  14. #29
    Extraordinary Member JKtheMac's Avatar
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    Stunning issue. All the more fun because people are bound to take it far too seriously.

    The lived experience of She Hulk, through the eyes of modern comics. The art is up to the task too. Let’s face it, drawn like this she is still a pin-up.

    Aaron has been doing a whole string of one and done character studies recently, and every one of them is well executed, thoughtful, mature and nuanced. This isn’t just peak Aaron, this is peak modern Marvel.

    One of the questions Aaron sometimes asks is can comic book fans take a bit of banter, it seems pretty obvious that some just can’t.
    Last edited by JKtheMac; 06-27-2019 at 01:22 AM.

  15. #30
    Extraordinary Member JKtheMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurolegacy View Post
    And so what if there were pin-ups of her in the MU? There are pin-ups of actresses in the real world and they are still taken seriously for their. Hell there still exists things where men and women are voted sexiest man/woman on Earth and that detracts nothings from who they are or their accomplishments. This is a blatant point of just looking for things to be offended by that has become more prevalent and at the end of the day solves nothing because rather than focusing on actual problems, instead chooses to focus on the most minuscule of issues.

    And you keep say that at some point that she'll go back to normal but that shouldn't mean that fans should have to consume garbage that blatantly disrespects that character and all they stand for for God knows how long. So fans have a right to be bothered by such a thing.
    Hang on. Turn that back on your own comments for a second. You are clearly jumping to the defence of something that wasn’t being attacked in the way you suggest. Aaron is not saying that pin-ups are invalid or taking them away from anyone. It would be a brave man that walked into a teenager’s bedroom and ripped down pin-ups. And he certainly isn’t walking into your own past selves bedroom and pointing at anything you personally liked.

    He is simply making it clear what a pin-up is and how it is separate from the lived experience of people depicted in those photographs. It is perfectly fine to be a pin-up, it is perfectly fine to enjoy pin-ups. It is not OK to invalidate the people behind the image and especially not great if the person behind them has identity issues. And that is kind of the point. Who better to explore identity issues and issues of self worth and self image than a Hulk?

    Before you jump to conclusions about your fandom being invalidated, consider for a moment what is really being said.

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