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  1. #1
    I'm at least a C-Lister! exile001's Avatar
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    Default Two-Face, your favourite stories & where he stands in the hierarchy of Bat-foes

    In the recent thread about Bane, the conversation drifted to Batman's greatest enemies and, of course, Two-Face came up.

    An interesting point was made that some feel Two-Face's only decent story is his original appearance, re-tellings of his origin or stories that tie directly to it (e.g. The Big Burn). My immediate thought was to deny this, but the stories that came to mind were almost all based around his origin. This seems to be a more recent phenomena, I'd say from the early 90's onward (that is relatively recent in Batman terms, and also I am old), but there is a trend for Two-Face stories to be tied to his origin more-so than in prior decades or even compared to other Batman's enemies.

    I'm interested to see where people stand on the character, his stories and his development over the years. Do you think he's one-note (he'd hate that!), or a more versatile character? Is he one of the best, or simply has one of the best origins? Is he just a great look, or is there something deeper?

    So with that in mind let's celebrate our favourite/least favourite/both (depending on the dominant personality) duality obsessed, acid scarred maniac! What are your favourite Two-Face stories? Comics, movies, animated series, whatever your choice.

    It doesn't have to be 5, I just used this to kick off the conversation. I'd tie it to the theme, but 2 is too few and 22 is a bit excessive.

    1. Detective Comics #66 - The Crimes of Two-Face. The first and still one of the best. It is still a great read, it still looks fantastic, and it is done in less than half the pages of a single comic book these days. I liked the intentionally open ending, too.

    2. Batman: Two-Face - Crime and Punishment. I am a big fan of J M DeMatteis' work from the late 80's to mid-late 90's, and this story is an absolute classic. Delving into Two-Face's past, but also using Harvey's duality to parallel Batman's own mask/humanity, this is a story about letting go of the past, facing your demons and overcoming them. The idea of the villain being the character trying to heal (but going about it in the worst possible way), and the hero comfortable with his demons is also pretty funny. Scott McDaniel is at the peak of his powers in this book (which he brings to Nightwing soon after). It's after he found himself on Daredevil, but before he completely nailed down his style (and became it bit less dynamic) with his run on Batman.

    3. Batman: Legends of the Dark Knight #28-30 - Faces. I like angry Two-Face. Two-face as the repressed side of Harvey that is constantly, violently lashing out at the world, and he is well represented here. The ending is pretty damn heart-wrenching, too. The art in this story is just something else, truly some of Wagner's best.

    4. Batman: The Animate Series - Two-Face Parts 1 & 2. I watch this at least every six months, and it is B:TAS at its finest. Special shout out to the score on this, and that they took the effort to introduce us to Harvey, and give him a friendship with Bruce, in a few episodes beforehand.

    5. Batman Annual #14 - Eye of the beholder. This comic still visually appeals to me. It is beautifully stylised, and a very well written tale. I think this introduced the abusive father aspects that JMD and other writers picked up on later, but also the theme of Two-Face himself being somewhat obsessed with the ideas of law and order (or maybe that's just because he is righting the injustices of his scarring).

    Honourable mentions;
    Gotham Central #6-10 - Half a Life. Really strong character work for Renee, also one of the better "two" themed Two-Face stories. Art is gorgeous.
    Batman: The Long Halloween. Surprise! This was actually a Two-Face origin all along! Works really well on the first read, not so much after the reveal. The lack of a clear "Holiday" resolution is a bit frustrating. Still a must-read classic.
    Batman: No Man's Land - The deal with Gordon, the (sudden but inevitable) betrayal and the court scene was all fantastic. One of NML's many highlights for me.
    There was an old newspaper serial called "Half Man Half Monster" included in the Batman in the Forties trade that I remember fondly (he robs a drive-in movie and winds up with a broken neck), but I re-read it last night and it is not as good as I remember. Also, his real name is Harvey Apollo in that story, which is a fun error.

    To be honest, from my picks it looks like I am on the side of the origin being greater than the character at large. This isn't really the case but when I think of Two-Face stories, these are the ones that come to mind. Well, these and Prodigal, which is such a mixed bag I honestly swing between liking and disliking it as I read through it. I don't think Two-Face was particularly well characterised, though.

    There are other good ones out there, and some awful ones. Feel free to give your thoughts, favourite stories, least favourite stories, or just your two cents.
    "Has Sariel summoned you here, Azrael? Have you come to witness the miracle of your brethren arriving on Earth?"

    "I WILL MIX THE ASHES OF YOUR BONES WITH SALT AND USE THEM TO ENSURE THE EARTH THE TEMPLARS TILLED NEVER BEARS FRUIT AGAIN!"

    "*sigh* I hoped it was for the miracle."

    Dan Watters' Azrael was incredible, a constant delight and perhaps too good for this world (but not the Forth). For the love of St. Dumas, DC, give us more!!!

  2. #2
    Uncanny Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    Also, feel free to check out
    Two-for-One: The Harvey Dent (Two-Face) Appreciation Thread(s) (2019)
    https://community.cbr.com/showthread...read(s)-(2019)

  3. #3
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    I really enjoyed Rucka's post Officer Down issue where Harvey came to toast Jim Gordon. Half a Life, his NML arc, and when they were trying to make him a Robin foil (Lonely Place of Dying, Prodigal) were interesting. Both Long Halloween (origin story) and Dark Victory were good.
    Blue text denotes sarcasm

  4. #4
    Spectacular Member Batknight's Avatar
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    Probably not a lot of people think of it as such, but Robin: Year One I think is a great Two-Face story. He's a legitimately scary antagonist in that story. In terms of villains, I'd easily put Two-Face right below Joker and Ra's in villains. And he's probably the most psychologically complex out of any of Batman rogues.
    Last edited by Batknight; 07-04-2019 at 09:45 AM.

  5. #5
    Extraordinary Member Restingvoice's Avatar
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    My original thought was simply that Two-Face is number 2 after Joker because of his early relationship with Jim and Batman, and if you wanna add Snyder's new back story, Bruce when they're kids. Then there's his beef with every Robin in their first appearances. Dick's first failure in Year One, Jason's dad, and Tim's debut.

    Plus of course, he's number 2.

    The only reason he's bumped off from number 2 is that I include international villains like Ra's and Talia and a multiversal villain like Batman Who Laughs, plus Bane who are all greater threats. You can also count Bane as international too since he owns his own island.

    So as far as local villains go, Two-Face is still number 2. The Riddler is a greater threat at his best, but not as personal.

  6. #6
    Mighty Member jb681131's Avatar
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    I would also add:

    - Long Halloween / Dark Victory
    - Batman: Jekyll & Hyde

  7. #7
    Astonishing Member kingaliencracker's Avatar
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    I think most of the important stories have been mentioned.

    I'll just say that what makes Two-Face such an incredible villain for me is he's one of the most tragic in all of comics.

  8. #8
    Mighty Member jb681131's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingaliencracker View Post
    for me is he's one of the most tragic in all of comics.
    I wouldn't be so sure. Have you read:
    - Vengeance of Bane
    - Penguin: Pain & Prejudice ?

  9. #9
    I'm at least a C-Lister! exile001's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    Also, feel free to check out
    Two-for-One: The Harvey Dent (Two-Face) Appreciation Thread(s) (2019)
    https://community.cbr.com/showthread...read(s)-(2019)
    Or, we could just discuss it separately as I'm inviting negative and positive discussion and am specifically interested in peoples opinions on whether Two-Face is just a decent origin or a worthwhile addition to the Bat-rogue gallery. I doubt, in an appreciation thread, there would be many who don't, you know, appreciate Two-Face.

    Thanks for the detailed thought and helpful reply, though.
    "Has Sariel summoned you here, Azrael? Have you come to witness the miracle of your brethren arriving on Earth?"

    "I WILL MIX THE ASHES OF YOUR BONES WITH SALT AND USE THEM TO ENSURE THE EARTH THE TEMPLARS TILLED NEVER BEARS FRUIT AGAIN!"

    "*sigh* I hoped it was for the miracle."

    Dan Watters' Azrael was incredible, a constant delight and perhaps too good for this world (but not the Forth). For the love of St. Dumas, DC, give us more!!!

  10. #10
    I'm at least a C-Lister! exile001's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bob/.schoonover View Post
    I really enjoyed Rucka's post Officer Down issue where Harvey came to toast Jim Gordon. Half a Life, his NML arc, and when they were trying to make him a Robin foil (Lonely Place of Dying, Prodigal) were interesting. Both Long Halloween (origin story) and Dark Victory were good.
    The toast was nicely done, I really liked the Rucka just stopped the action and described Harvey's speech. He could have just hit a wall of text, but it was almost more intimate the way it was written. But then, I am a bit of a Rucka mark and love most of his work.

    The period when he was becoming more of a Dick foe was interesting, his being Batman's "second", and I feel is an attempt to re-evaluate his place as a Batman enemy. The old "two" obsession and double-crosses were seeming a bit obvious and hokey by the late 80's, so having him be the guy who almost killed Batman, then Robin, actually murdering the DA in front of them, and getting inside Dick's head for years was a decent retcon. I found it strange that Dixon didn't build on this by having Two-Face as a major enemy in Nightwing (maybe he wanted him instead of Blockbuster but editorial blocked it or something).
    "Has Sariel summoned you here, Azrael? Have you come to witness the miracle of your brethren arriving on Earth?"

    "I WILL MIX THE ASHES OF YOUR BONES WITH SALT AND USE THEM TO ENSURE THE EARTH THE TEMPLARS TILLED NEVER BEARS FRUIT AGAIN!"

    "*sigh* I hoped it was for the miracle."

    Dan Watters' Azrael was incredible, a constant delight and perhaps too good for this world (but not the Forth). For the love of St. Dumas, DC, give us more!!!

  11. #11
    I'm at least a C-Lister! exile001's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Batknight View Post
    Probably not a lot of people think of it as such, but Robin: Year One I think is a great Two-Face story. He's a legitimately scary antagonist in that story. In terms of villains, I'd easily put Two-Face right below Joker and Ra's in villains. And he's probably the most psychologically complex out of any of Batman rogues.
    R:YO was GORGEOUS to look at, and a solid work. And yeah, he was pretty damn terrifying.
    "Has Sariel summoned you here, Azrael? Have you come to witness the miracle of your brethren arriving on Earth?"

    "I WILL MIX THE ASHES OF YOUR BONES WITH SALT AND USE THEM TO ENSURE THE EARTH THE TEMPLARS TILLED NEVER BEARS FRUIT AGAIN!"

    "*sigh* I hoped it was for the miracle."

    Dan Watters' Azrael was incredible, a constant delight and perhaps too good for this world (but not the Forth). For the love of St. Dumas, DC, give us more!!!

  12. #12
    I'm at least a C-Lister! exile001's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Restingvoice View Post
    My original thought was simply that Two-Face is number 2 after Joker because of his early relationship with Jim and Batman, and if you wanna add Snyder's new back story, Bruce when they're kids. Then there's his beef with every Robin in their first appearances. Dick's first failure in Year One, Jason's dad, and Tim's debut.

    Plus of course, he's number 2.

    The only reason he's bumped off from number 2 is that I include international villains like Ra's and Talia and a multiversal villain like Batman Who Laughs, plus Bane who are all greater threats. You can also count Bane as international too since he owns his own island.

    So as far as local villains go, Two-Face is still number 2. The Riddler is a greater threat at his best, but not as personal.
    I had completely forgot about killing Jason's dad! Post-Crisis Two-Face really had a thing for Robins.
    "Has Sariel summoned you here, Azrael? Have you come to witness the miracle of your brethren arriving on Earth?"

    "I WILL MIX THE ASHES OF YOUR BONES WITH SALT AND USE THEM TO ENSURE THE EARTH THE TEMPLARS TILLED NEVER BEARS FRUIT AGAIN!"

    "*sigh* I hoped it was for the miracle."

    Dan Watters' Azrael was incredible, a constant delight and perhaps too good for this world (but not the Forth). For the love of St. Dumas, DC, give us more!!!

  13. #13
    I'm at least a C-Lister! exile001's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jb681131 View Post
    I would also add:

    - Long Halloween / Dark Victory
    - Batman: Jekyll & Hyde
    I don't really remember Batman: Jekyll & Hyde, but didn't it give us the "Batman hates chocolate" thing? I'll fish it out this weekend for a re-read.
    "Has Sariel summoned you here, Azrael? Have you come to witness the miracle of your brethren arriving on Earth?"

    "I WILL MIX THE ASHES OF YOUR BONES WITH SALT AND USE THEM TO ENSURE THE EARTH THE TEMPLARS TILLED NEVER BEARS FRUIT AGAIN!"

    "*sigh* I hoped it was for the miracle."

    Dan Watters' Azrael was incredible, a constant delight and perhaps too good for this world (but not the Forth). For the love of St. Dumas, DC, give us more!!!

  14. #14
    I'm at least a C-Lister! exile001's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingaliencracker View Post
    I'll just say that what makes Two-Face such an incredible villain for me is he's one of the most tragic in all of comics.
    Definitely, and decade upon decade more tragedy seems to be layer on. Soon, we'll have to wonder how he became DA or even managed to buy bread without a psychotic break. Lol

    I do like the addition of his being Bruce's acquaintance or even friend. They would be in similar circles, and I liked the old portrayal of Bruce having an interest in crime.
    "Has Sariel summoned you here, Azrael? Have you come to witness the miracle of your brethren arriving on Earth?"

    "I WILL MIX THE ASHES OF YOUR BONES WITH SALT AND USE THEM TO ENSURE THE EARTH THE TEMPLARS TILLED NEVER BEARS FRUIT AGAIN!"

    "*sigh* I hoped it was for the miracle."

    Dan Watters' Azrael was incredible, a constant delight and perhaps too good for this world (but not the Forth). For the love of St. Dumas, DC, give us more!!!

  15. #15
    I'm at least a C-Lister! exile001's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jb681131 View Post
    - Penguin: Pain & Prejudice ?
    Pain and Prejudice is one of my favourite Penguin stories. And the art is to die for.
    "Has Sariel summoned you here, Azrael? Have you come to witness the miracle of your brethren arriving on Earth?"

    "I WILL MIX THE ASHES OF YOUR BONES WITH SALT AND USE THEM TO ENSURE THE EARTH THE TEMPLARS TILLED NEVER BEARS FRUIT AGAIN!"

    "*sigh* I hoped it was for the miracle."

    Dan Watters' Azrael was incredible, a constant delight and perhaps too good for this world (but not the Forth). For the love of St. Dumas, DC, give us more!!!

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