How would you fix the Robins and Batgirls' origins in a new modern timeline?

[Flash Gordon]

Richard Grayson has none of the circus background. Instead he's a bit closer in age to Bruce and acts as a Watson to Bruce's Holmes. He's a young working class guy who deduced the Batman's identity early on and got himself involved in the fight. He's the lighthearted side of the dynamic duo, as Robin. He could have a background in martial arts, and Bruce perfects him. He's more of a brother than a son. Bruce's best friend and most trusted ally. He still goes by ROBIN and is a full fledged member of the Justice League.

Tim Drake never even met Batman. He just dresses like Robin and pretends to be the now legendary crime fighter. He's a smart kid who makes makeshift equipment in his parents garage. He goes after some gang violence. I'd try and keep him separate for quite some time. Young Justice is formed by him, and everyone there thinks he's the real Robin. Eventually this makes him a target for villains and he gets in over his head, his suburban life falling apart, and needs the help of the real Batman and Robin. He wouldn't know the secret identities of his mentors but he'd have a way to reach them and unofficially work with them from time to time.

Damian remains as is, but aged in real time. He mimics Richard for a while, trying to also be Robin. Sometimes he calls himself Batman, also.

[Restingvoice]

I can't fix it if I don't know what the current timeline is XD

I'll start with Damian because I like the idea that the age difference between Bruce, Dick, and Damian are the exact same.

So if Damian's 10, Dick's 20 and Bruce 30
That sounds too young so let's double it
Damian's 10, Dick's 30, Bruce's 50
That's too old, so let's go with 15 years

Damian's 10, Dick's 25, Bruce's 40
There. That's the ideal. Now I'll add the rest of the fam in the interval. Say, the exact half. 7.5 years.

Damian's 10, Tim, Steph, Jason, Cass around 17-18, Dick and Bette 25, Barbara, Helena, and Kate around 32-33, Bruce 40, Kathy 47-48

I put Kate lower since just because they're cousins they don't have to be the same age

[Aahz]

Damian's 10, Tim, Steph, Jason, Cass around 17-18, Dick and Bette 25, Barbara, Helena, and Kate around 32-33, Bruce 40, Kathy 47-48

Pre flashpoint Helena was iirc roughly the same age as Dick.

[Restingvoice]

Pre flashpoint Helena was iirc roughly the same age as Dick.

Okay let's just put her there

Damian's 10, Tim, Steph, Jason, Cass around 17-18, Dick, Helena and Bette 25, Barbara and Kate around 32-33, Bruce 40, Kathy 47-48

[nhienphan2808]

Richard Grayson has none of the circus background. Instead he's a bit closer in age to Bruce and acts as a Watson to Bruce's Holmes. He's a young working class guy who deduced the Batman's identity early on and got himself involved in the fight. He's the lighthearted side of the dynamic duo, as Robin. He could have a background in martial arts, and Bruce perfects him. He's more of a brother than a son. Bruce's best friend and most trusted ally.

Tim Drake never even met Batman. He just dresses like Robin and pretends to be the now legendary crime fighter. He's a smart kid who makes makeshift equipment in his parents garage. He goes after some gang violence. I'd try and keep him separate for quite some time. Young Justice is formed by him, and everyone there thinks he's the real Robin. Eventually this makes him a target for villains and he gets in over his head, his suburban life falling apart, and needs the help of the real Batman and Robin.

Damian remains as is.

Thank you I like this.

[nhienphan2808]

I can't fix it if I don't know what the current timeline is XD

I'll start with Damian because I like the idea that the age difference between Bruce, Dick, and Damian are the exact same.

So if Damian's 10, Dick's 20 and Bruce 30
That sounds too young so let's double it
Damian's 10, Dick's 30, Bruce's 50
That's too old, so let's go with 15 years

Damian's 10, Dick's 25, Bruce's 40
There. That's the ideal. Now I'll add the rest of the fam in the interval. Say, the exact half. 7.5 years.

Damian's 10, Tim, Steph, Jason, Cass around 17-18, Dick and Bette 25, Barbara, Helena, and Kate around 32-33, Bruce 40, Kathy 47-48

I put Kate lower since just because they're cousins they don't have to be the same age

I didn’t mean fixing the timelines I meant their origins if you were to reboot everything from the beginning.

[Jackalope89]

I can't fix it if I don't know what the current timeline is XD

I'll start with Damian because I like the idea that the age difference between Bruce, Dick, and Damian are the exact same.

So if Damian's 10, Dick's 20 and Bruce 30
That sounds too young so let's double it
Damian's 10, Dick's 30, Bruce's 50
That's too old, so let's go with 15 years

Damian's 10, Dick's 25, Bruce's 40
There. That's the ideal. Now I'll add the rest of the fam in the interval. Say, the exact half. 7.5 years.

Damian's 10, Tim, Steph, Jason, Cass around 17-18, Dick and Bette 25, Barbara, Helena, and Kate around 32-33, Bruce 40, Kathy 47-48

I put Kate lower since just because they're cousins they don't have to be the same age

I'm about the same age as a good number of my own cousins.

Plus, in Batwoman Rebirth, it showed Kate at Bruce's parents funeral, and they looked about the same age.

For my own age thing:
Bruce-40ish
Dick- 25
Jason- 21
Tim- 17 (enough of him being eternally 16)
Steph- 17
Babs- 25
Damian- 10 when introduced, but now 13
Cass- 21 (a few months older than Jason though)
Kate- 40ish
Alfred- Timeless

[Rakiduam]

Richard Grayson has none of the circus background. Instead he's a bit closer in age to Bruce and acts as a Watson to Bruce's Holmes. He's a young working class guy who deduced the Batman's identity early on and got himself involved in the fight. He's the lighthearted side of the dynamic duo, as Robin. He could have a background in martial arts, and Bruce perfects him. He's more of a brother than a son. Bruce's best friend and most trusted ally.

Tim Drake never even met Batman. He just dresses like Robin and pretends to be the now legendary crime fighter. He's a smart kid who makes makeshift equipment in his parents garage. He goes after some gang violence. I'd try and keep him separate for quite some time. Young Justice is formed by him, and everyone there thinks he's the real Robin. Eventually this makes him a target for villains and he gets in over his head, his suburban life falling apart, and needs the help of the real Batman and Robin.

Damian remains as is.

So Dick gets Tim's origen and Tim gets Carrie's?

[dietrich]

I like Dick, Jay and Damian's origins just fine. They work. Tim's on the other hand doesn't. I don't like the idea of a kid going up to a grieving parent and lobbying to replace his kid.

Robin isn't batman's light. Family is his light, his hope, the thing that he thinks of when it gets hard or he's challenged . His sons were his answer when Clark asked him that question not Robin.

I know it was just a gimmick to sell the new Robin but it undermines batman. not to mention that the idea that Bruce who just lost his son would knowingly and willingly endanger another persons kid is damaging.

What kind of adult or decent human being would encourage a kid to sneak out from his safe bed at night to dress up and hang out in a cave with two grown men [strangers] The whole setup sounds dodgy and corrupt. No way would Batman take a kid out of a safe environment and place him in a dangerous one.
Robin is a mantle created to save at risk young boys and give them purpose it wasn't created to endanger safe and stable young boys. That's what Tim's origin turned Robin into.

That is the only origin I would change.

I like the idea of Tim dressing up as Robin because he's a fanboy. Perhaps his attempts at playing hero keeps getting him in trouble where Batman has to constantly save him. I'd go from there but under no circumstances does Bruce take Tim under his wing without his parents consent.

I'd make Tim less of a replacement for Jason because you can't replace a son with a random kid but also because it minimises the need to blame and vilify the dead victim. Tim's intro was built on trashing Jason so I'd get rid of any comparisons to Jason. Rather have bruce only talk about Jason the son not Jason the sidekick.

[Aahz]

I didnÂ’t mean fixing the timelines I meant their origins if you were to reboot everything from the beginning.

The Intersting question would be what is even wrong with their origins.

- Dick: I think the biggest problem is that it just doesn't make much sense to commit a double murder to extort money from a circus
- Jason: I think the Origin works, but I think you would have to show better how talented/skilled Jason was before being Robin (or scale the others back to the skill levels they had in their 80s/early 90s origin stories). And they need a better motivation for Talia to bring him back. And maybe explain why he and Damian apparently never met during their time with the league.
- Tim: needs imo a better story about how he found out about Bruce and Dicks identity. And expand more on his family background.
- Damian: ???

- Bette: Here you would actually have to give her a real origin story in the first place ...
- Barbara: I think the main problem is that one would have to fix at what stage of her live she became Batgirl, and if you have her become Batgirl at a young age, just drop the whole libarian thing
- Helena: I'm not sure what qualification you need to be a teacher in the US, but based on her age and (pre flashpoint) origin story, there is no way that she could teach in my country
- Cass: I think you would have to start with giving David Cain and Lady Shiva proper origin stories in the first, place and then imo massively shorten the time between her running away from Cain and ending up with the Batfamily
- Steph: I don't see a problem

[Restingvoice]

I didn’t mean fixing the timelines I meant their origins if you were to reboot everything from the beginning.

Well... I prefer if Dick really was the first person Bruce told his identity, meaning Alfred will be unavailable during that period, but I don't know how am I gonna do it yet because I like Alfred as the person who raised Bruce.

I think during the Zero Year where Bruce kicked Alfred out I'm gonna make it so he left for a longer time... or I'll have it like Long Halloween where Alfred was actually pretty cold and butler-like during Bruce's youth so while he did raise him, it wasn't really a good raising. So he didn't care that much to return during Zero Year.

Yeah, I think that's it. I like how the way Bruce views Alfred as father developed slowly during 75 years of publication, so I want it to happen in real time inside comic as well. Slowly. Alfred started as a professional butler but that slowly change.

That's it for now.

I'm about the same age as a good number of my own cousins.

Plus, in Batwoman Rebirth, it showed Kate at Bruce's parents funeral, and they looked about the same age.

My cousin too, but I just think it will be more varied if they're not conveniently the same age

[Bat-Meal]

I'm about the same age as a good number of my own cousins.

Plus, in Batwoman Rebirth, it showed Kate at Bruce's parents funeral, and they looked about the same age.

For my own age thing:
Bruce-40ish
Dick- 25
Jason- 21
Tim- 17 (enough of him being eternally 16)
Steph- 17
Babs- 25
Damian- 10 when introduced, but now 13
Cass- 21 (a few months older than Jason though)
Kate- 40ish
Alfred- Timeless

In the most recent solo Kate's age was reset to 27, with no explanation, just stated in the now part as 27 (in the previous solo she was 32). Then, yes, as you said she was depicted as being only about a year younger than Bruce in the 'Tec run.

How old are Luke, Helena, and Azrael in all this?

[Restingvoice]

Yeah, how old are Luke and Jean in the canon? Every canon.

[nhienphan2808]

- Tim: needs imo a better story about how he found out about Bruce and Dicks identity. And expand more on his family background.

He finds and rescues out-of-comission Babs and discovered Batman and Robin's identity and also come to them through knowing her, because obsession with Dick Grayson or rescuing Batman and Nightwing makes 0 sense even if they were grieving. I would make him real smart by making him closer with her instead of victim blaming Jason and stalking Dick and hearsay smart.

Otherwise, a better connection to justice maybe. I think what Flash Gordon said works fine.

[Arsenal]

Dick’s origin largely remains untouched. He’s Robin for a few years but eventually decides it’s time to become something else so he willingly retires the Robin persona and leaves to discover what that is.

Babs’s origin is largely the same. Her time as Batgirl covers both Dick’s and Jason’s tenures as Robin but during Jason’s time she wasn’t Batgirling as frequently as she used to. Joker shoots Babs and a month later kills Jason.

Jason’s origin would remain the same during his first annual patrol in Crime Alley after Dick leaves. Only change I’d make is some of his better pre-Crisis stories/appearances (the broad strokes atleast) are added into his time his time as Robin until his relationship with Bruce falls apart which ultimately leads to him dying at the hands of the Joker. Due to his upbringing, Jason would never talk about his past so he would never talk about the time he met Talia. She’s been keeping tabs on him from afar ever since he helped her kill an Untitled so when she gets word that he’s wandering the streets of Gotham in a catatonic state she decides to take him in.

Tim Drake is a Batman & Robin fanboy whose been following them for years. He starts to train himself after hearing Joker killed Robin because Gotham needs a Robin. Either Bruce learns of this new “Robin” or stumbles upon him during patrol. Either way, Bruce quickly attempts to shut Tim down but his attempts are futile upon discovering the boy largely lives on his own. So Tim keeps going out until him and Bruce end up in a situation where they are forced to work together to escape from which results in Bruce reluctantly deciding to properly train and equip Tim to avoid another child dying to this life.

Cass & Steph’s origins remain the same.

Damian’s origin remains the same. He was conceived shortly before Bruce makes his debut as Batman so his age (give or take a few months) reflects how long Bruce has been batmaning for. Only change I’d make is that Damian never dies but instead is critically injured which leads to Bruce going temporarily off the rails in his attempts to save him.