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  1. #31
    Extraordinary Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swallowtail View Post
    Do these great writers who adhere perfectly to continuity have names?
    Yes Synder for one. I can't recall an instance where he ignored continuity when representing a character.Taylor is another.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    Yes Synder for one. I can't recall an instance where he ignored continuity when representing a character.Taylor is another.
    Snyder is a good writer who has subzero interest in protecting other peopleís continuity. Snyderís really only consistent with his own internal continuity. After Tomasi killed Two Face, Snyder didnít even handwave bringing him back. And he wasnít losing any sleep about Batgirlís continuity when he established that actually James Gordon Jr has actually been on a long term work release for months. Heís given people like calendar man heretofore unknown powers. And obviously his Justice League and Batman Who Laughs arenít consistent with or acknowledging anything thatís going on in the Batbooks. Thereís even a recentish quote from him saying he only considers books written by Himself, King and Bendis to even affect continuity.

    And, uh, Taylorís two major DC books have been outside continuity and havenít had to match to any ongoing book so iím not sure how that even applies to this argument.

  3. #33
    Extraordinary Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swallowtail View Post
    Snyder is a good writer who has subzero interest in protecting other peopleís continuity. Snyderís really only consistent with his own internal continuity. After Tomasi killed Two Face, Snyder didnít even handwave bringing him back. And he wasnít losing any sleep about Batgirlís continuity when he established that actually James Gordon Jr has actually been on a long term work release for months. Heís given people like calendar man heretofore unknown powers. And obviously his Justice League and Batman Who Laughs arenít consistent with or acknowledging anything thatís going on in the Batbooks. Thereís even a recentish quote from him saying he only considers books written by Himself, King and Bendis to even affect continuity.

    And, uh, Taylorís two major DC books have been outside continuity and havenít had to match to any ongoing book so iím not sure how that even applies to this argument.
    can i have your source for that Synder quote?

  4. #34
    Mighty Member RedBird's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swallowtail View Post
    Agreed, it’s a bread and butter info exchange. Nothing particularly ground breaking but with a completely acceptable dialogue rhythm for how you would expect these two to talk to each other when putting aside their differences and focused on a common goal.
    It's only a few pages, a bit hard to tell so early on, (we'll see how characterization pans out when the issue drops) but for now, I agree with this.
    I mean, sure, the whole fact that Bruce and Jason are interacting is obviously going against the story in rhato, that was a given, with that aside though nothing in this exchange feels too ooc.

    It really is just generic information exposition.
    Even when you do focus on character intention for Jason, it seems fair enough.
    Jason agrees to work together only after finding out about Babs.
    Of course all the bats would help if they find out one of the fam is in danger, but I mean considering Jasons current 'circumstance', that is one of the few reasons I think he would believably be willing to call a truce and assist.

    Mocking, being accusatory, and critical of Bruce in his statements.

    'You used to fantasize about something like this happening'
    '...and you didn't see any of this coming'?


    Again, accurate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swallowtail View Post
    Its a two page, mainly factual exchange of information wherein he still gets in two I am suspicious of your motives jabs. Jason's supposed to be a professional detective and that's attributed to him here, is all. He will never evolve as a character if every time he appears on the page with Batman he has to yell, 'go eat a crowbar and die, old man'. Within 30 seconds. He has to be able to do more.
    Agreed.

    Interactions that are nothing but THAT always feel like caricature.
    (Not by any means saying this in the sense that character history and emotions have to be stripped away, the longstanding resentment behind those kinds of statements and interactions, should remain, I just want some more nuance in the dialogue sometimes.)

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    can i have your source for that Synder quote?
    His YouTube channel. I want to say itís in the video comic craft: marvel style vs full script but it might have been any of the ones that came out around the time of Batman who Laughs #1 release in November.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedBird View Post

    Interactions that are nothing but THAT always feel like caricature.
    (Not by any means saying this in the sense that character history and emotions have to be stripped away, the longstanding resentment behind those kinds of statements and interactions, should remain, I just want some more nuance in the dialogue sometimes.)
    No, exactly. I want exchanges that are informed by their history, but not always overtly about that history. We’ve seen Jason as a villain in a Batman comic, and we’ve seen Batman as the major gravitational force in Jason’s life in Red Hood comics, but we actually don’t have much of a benchmark for ‘Red Hood and Batman work a case together’ and this is a reasonably promising start to extrapolate what that might look like.

  7. #37
    Extraordinary Member adrikito's Avatar
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    Thanks for the preview.

  8. #38
    Mighty Member RedBird's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swallowtail View Post
    I want exchanges that are informed by their history, but not always overtly about that history.
    Yup, there it is.
    Thanks, you put it into words much better than I could.

  9. #39
    Caperucita Roja Zaresh's Avatar
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    Right, that line about the plans, I totally passed that one. In character, definitely. I guess I was too prejudiced agains the writers work. My apologies.
    This is a signature. It has letters on it, and those letters form words. Words like these. I will not quote anything because I'm uninspired but, I read a lot: I could!

    And this is my Tumblr. Sometimes I post stuff there.

  10. #40
    Anyone. Anywhere.Anytime. Arsenal's Avatar
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    If this is what Bendis’ hood sounds like, honestly I can live with it.

  11. #41
    Don't Bully a Hurt Dragon Sergard's Avatar
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    I'm actually not mad at that preview.
    It does sound like Jason most of the time to me.

    Bruce asks a pretty simple question like "What do you see, Jason?" and it's obvious that Bruce isn't there for small talk or in need of a description of the scenery - but Jason doesn't want to talk with Bruce. So he makes a snarky comment that answers the question without answering it but it works as a signal for Bruce that Jason isn't interested in whatever Bruce is trying to do and wants him to back off.

    (Although I'm not sure in which world this statue counts as gargoyle. And of course there's a full moon behind Batman. It's always full moon.)

    Then Bruce cuts straight to the point by saying that Barbara was in the attack and is now missing - and Jason's demeanor immediately changes. Barbara is family and when family is in danger there's no place for disputes. "Let's go work the wreckage" - because it's not nice to be buried alive (Jason knows).

    "You used to fantasize about something like this happening ..." sounds more like something from Jason's time as Robin. Maybe some old forgotten plan similar to the "Tower of Babel" story line.

    Then some observations follow. Jason talks about not seeing any dead bodies - which is an important information to repeat but also Jason being in denial that Barbara could be dead.
    Bruce is more harsh saying that there are no dead bodies because they could already be burned to ashes. Maybe he really suspects that Jason is Leviathan - or he wants to confront Jason this way to see his reaction. All in all the last panel gives me the impression that Jason realizes that Bruce isn't here because he sees Jason as an ally but as a possible culprit.

    I agree when people say that the relationship between Bruce and Jason here isn't as intense as currently in RHatO but for one, we don't know how the dialog would have continued if Bruce hadn't mentioned Barbara missing, and also we don't know when this story takes place. This could easily be set after RH:O #27 (in which Bruce and Jason reconcile) and before the current story arc (in which Bruce and Jason have drifted apart again), at least Jason's short hair would be an indication for the latter. And being blamed by Bruce although he's innocent could be the reason for Jason's gruff behavior towards Bruce in the current RH:O arc.

  12. #42
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    To be honest, even being treated as a prime suspect in the case is probably an upgrade for Jason if It means heís back to being considered smart enough to pull off that sort of coup. He spent quite a lot of the New-52 and Rebirth as the dumb jock outside his own book.

  13. #43
    Anyone. Anywhere.Anytime. Arsenal's Avatar
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    Well... that sure was a lot of talking.

  14. #44
    Astonishing Member Korath's Avatar
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    Bruce sure is a piece of work.

    Overall, I really liked the issue, it's kicking things into high gear while probably reinforcing Jason has a red herring.

    The little hint about Plastic Man and a certain team, considering what's coming at DC, was also great.

  15. #45
    Extraordinary Member dietrich's Avatar
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    I think Bruce should no longer be called the world's greatest detective after this

    spoilers:
    Why is TheY hunting Jason now? What in the world makes him think Jason could be leviathan? The whole thing is silly and Damian sounds like an idiot. Jason was the only one that seemed like he was thinking in this
    end of spoilers

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