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  1. #166
    Ultimate Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beaddle View Post
    It was the post disney movies that MCU stood no chance of writing good villains, plus the slippery slope of too much humor and lighthearted stories that ruins many of their villains.
    Disney stepped in during the time the first Avengers was being made. Pre-Disney, the only good villain we got was Loki. Post-Disney (and, albeit, after a long start), we got Zemo (maybe an honorary mention, but a good start), Ego, Vulture, Hela and the Grandmaster (maybe not as deep characters, but well-executed in terms of being memorable and well-defined), Killmonger, Thanos (technically introduced before, but was actually fleshed out here), Ghost and Talos (technically not villians, but well-written antagonists), and Mysterio. (Also, Nebula deserves a nod; while not a villain, her path to redemption was very well plotted, creating a very multi-dimensional character.)

    Now, that might be more credit to Marvel Studios then Disney, but it is observable that the MCU started getting consistently good villains under Disney's management. Make of that what you will.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaddle View Post
    It will be a no contender for me, as much as I can believe Spiderman is a Pixar character.
    Whatever you say.
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    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
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  2. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    Disney stepped in during the time the first Avengers was being made. Pre-Disney, the only good villain we got was Loki. Post-Disney (and, albeit, after a long start), we got Zemo (maybe an honorary mention, but a good start), Ego, Vulture, Hela and the Grandmaster (maybe not as deep characters, but well-executed in terms of being memorable and well-defined), Killmonger, Thanos (technically introduced before, but was actually fleshed out here), Ghost and Talos (technically not villians, but well-written antagonists), and Mysterio. (Also, Nebula deserves a nod; while not a villain, her path to redemption was very well plotted, creating a very multi-dimensional character.)

    Now, that might be more credit to Marvel Studios then Disney, but it is observable that the MCU started getting consistently good villains under Disney's management. Make of that what you will.



    Whatever you say.
    It depends on what you see as good villains. I don't consider most of them on that list great villains. It is true that when Disney steeped in Marvel movies filmmaking approach began to deteriorate more with the humor and lighthearted stories. I have no doubt in my mind MCU movies all turning into comedy is because of Disney, many other Disney movies are just the same.


    Whatever you say.
    Spiderman is not a Pixar character.


  3. #168
    Spectacular Member PoorStudent's Avatar
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    I don't hate Marvel, but I do hate how much the film industry has shifted as a result of them.

    They are really only releasing two or three movies a year, compared to like 500 that come out a year, so it's not that they themselves are the problem, but that every studio is trying to copy them and usually produce less quality results.

    It's frustrating that Disney is dominating the industry and that it feels so much like a monopoly, but that's not Disney's fault as much as it is other studios for not being able to produce films that have done as well as them.

    Warner Brothers feels like they are asleep at the wheel and the other studios seem like they only have one or two franchise movies that are keeping the studios a float. And it's not that I don't like Warner Brothers movies, but they make so few and take such few risks as well.

    All studios do it, but I don't like how Marvel markets their movies. The fanaticism and celebrity worship that occurs around these movies always felt gross and creepy.

  4. #169
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    MCU celebrity worship is a problem? Do elaborate, because the MCU/Marvel/Disney definitely did not invent the wheel there.

  5. #170
    Astonishing Member Godzilla2099's Avatar
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    Depends which films

    Iron Man 3 was horrible . (I seriously can't grasp why this movie did so well)

    Iron Man 2: Boring

    Thor: Beginning and End were good. The middle was a complete drag

    Captain America: Mediocre

    Captain Marvel: Didn't give it a chance. Used to read Ms Marvel religiously. Carol was a mess trying to be the best hero she can. All of a sudden she's this 'perfect' champion. After that I dropped the title. The movie amplified why I lost interest

  6. #171
    Chad Jar Jar Pinsir's Avatar
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    I've been checking Google news since Marvel did their press conference and I have yet to find an article concerning the fact that the Ant-Man franchise has effectively been cancelled. This is a franchise that grossed over a billion dollars and have high Rotten Tomato scores yet its death has seemingly gone unnoticed by the MCU fandom as a whole and pop culture media.

    When I talk about 'fanless' MCU films this is what I'm talking about. People only watched these films because they were part of a larger universe and developed no attachment to the individual films. The only thing saving the Ant-Man films from oblivion is because its tethered to the MCU and people will inevitably watch the films if they're going to marathon the MCU.

    No doubt MCU apologist are already are going to respond by saying that the Ant-Man franchise was the weakest link in the MCU chain (which it isn't, Hulk is), but I don't think the Dr. Strange franchise is any better, as its getting a sequel 5 years after the original and I don't think there was much of a groundswell for another one. Individually too, most MCU films are treated with the same indifference as Ant-Man.
    #InGunnITrust, #ZackSnyderistheBlueprint, #ReleasetheAyerCut

  7. #172
    Incredible Member Wandering_Wand's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinsir View Post
    I've been checking Google news since Marvel did their press conference and I have yet to find an article concerning the fact that the Ant-Man franchise has effectively been cancelled. This is a franchise that grossed over a billion dollars and have high Rotten Tomato scores yet its death has seemingly gone unnoticed by the MCU fandom as a whole and pop culture media.

    When I talk about 'fanless' MCU films this is what I'm talking about. People only watched these films because they were part of a larger universe and developed no attachment to the individual films. The only thing saving the Ant-Man films from oblivion is because its tethered to the MCU and people will inevitably watch the films if they're going to marathon the MCU.

    No doubt MCU apologist are already are going to respond by saying that the Ant-Man franchise was the weakest link in the MCU chain (which it isn't, Hulk is), but I don't think the Dr. Strange franchise is any better, as its getting a sequel 5 years after the original and I don't think there was much of a groundswell for another one. Individually too, most MCU films are treated with the same indifference as Ant-Man.
    This is Disney's M.O. They did it with two franchises that I adore: National Treasure and Tron. They simply aren't interested in properties that don't make them billions. Hence why Disney is so focused on remaking all their classic properties, Star Wars, and now the Marvel machine.

    I get it, they have to make money - I have no problem with that. But because some things don't make TONS of money by Disney's definition, they cast it to the way side. In your example, Ant-Man (albeit, your example that two movies made over a billion, the new standard could be argued that they want all billion+ hits). Which, Disney has found a way to shoehorn properties in to make them seem more interconnected than they really are and people lap it up (think the cameos that are being put into the various movies now - Tony Stark in Spiderman: HC, Hulk not having his own movies anymore and just being tossed into Thor: Ragnarok, etc. It's all equivalent to quick cash grabs, IMO. So, maybe Ant-Man's future is with cameos?

  8. #173
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    I don’t get why it’s taking so long for a Black Panther sequel, it should be Marvel’s top priority

  9. #174
    Spectacular Member PoorStudent's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Star_Jammer View Post
    MCU celebrity worship is a problem? Do elaborate, because the MCU/Marvel/Disney definitely did not invent the wheel there.
    Yeah, like this type of stuff:

    https://youtu.be/dQw4w9WgXcQ

  10. #175
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    When these movies are announced later, and they may well be announced in the next few months at Disney events, I wonder how some of these recent posts will be spun to save face.

  11. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theleviathan View Post
    When these movies are announced later, and they may well be announced in the next few months at Disney events, I wonder how some of these recent posts will be spun to save face.
    What? Even if they announce Ant-Man 3 tomorrow my post will still stand. All I have to do is replace the word death with absence.
    #InGunnITrust, #ZackSnyderistheBlueprint, #ReleasetheAyerCut

  12. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinsir View Post
    What? Even if they announce Ant-Man 3 tomorrow my post will still stand. All I have to do is replace the word death with absence.
    You are very obviously proving with this comment that you will argue whatever you see fit to reach the conclusion you want to be true as opposed to looking for truth in a fair way. That's fine, it just means a discourse with you isnt possible because your mind is not just made up, but will remain made up regardless of anything presented to you.

  13. #178
    Astonishing Member Tuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinsir View Post
    People only watched these films because they were part of a larger universe and developed no attachment to the individual films. The only thing saving the Ant-Man films from oblivion is because its tethered to the MCU and people will inevitably watch the films if they're going to marathon the MCU.
    People watched Ant-Man because Paul Rudd was in it. People love that guy like they love Ryan Reynolds.

  14. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinsir View Post
    No doubt MCU apologist are already are going to respond by saying that the Ant-Man franchise was the weakest link in the MCU chain (which it isn't, Hulk is), but I don't think the Dr. Strange franchise is any better, as its getting a sequel 5 years after the original and I don't think there was much of a groundswell for another one. Individually too, most MCU films are treated with the same indifference as Ant-Man.
    You really are hating the MCU for the sake of hating. But that's okay, freedom to hate whatever you choose to should be allowed to a certain extent.

    But in the case of the MCU, Disney's M.O. is to farm out as many IP's as possible. Too many options means a lot of franchises are going to be left out in the dust. Disney is all about moving forward and will leave a hot IP to venture on a new one. They've done this many times with their animated movies and will do so with a lot of Marvel movies even though several sequels could be made. Every new IP that gets introduced onscreen means more merch. Why continue with one and there are hundreds in the vault?

    That's the bad thing about Disney taking over. Why bother extending a franchise beyond a certain amount of films when they can tap onto the next IP and make more revenue thru merch?

  15. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by luprki View Post
    I don’t get why it’s taking so long for a Black Panther sequel, it should be Marvel’s top priority
    It really is baffling. Disturbing actually given the movie was a monster success. Like really Marvel...

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