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  1. #16
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    I donít feel to bad about it, there are plenty of characters both old and new that are not Batman related that have pretty good comic runs. I love Naomi, Young Justice (yes I know Tim is there but itís a team thing), The Terrifics, and Shazam to name a few off the top of my head. Heck Iím even cautiously optimistic about the Legion of Superheroes. Sure Batman is freaking everywhere but there is still plenty to read without him.
    "It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
    Words to live by.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackalope89 View Post
    So much to disagree with. With Bendis, Lois looks after her kid for a short time, believes a preteen is suddenly fine without family or friends, and ditches him right after. Without telling Clark. Even though they agreed as a couple on the arrangement.

    Let's not forget Lois, up until Bendis took over, was a tiger mom. Fiercely protective of both Jon and Clark, even though both had super powers. But, meh. Let's just have her walk away from her grade school aged son and leave him in the care of a very dubious person (blood related or not). And Clark, despite having friends, trusted friends, in positions to look for Jon, never brought it up.

    I'm with manwhohaseverything on this. The whole setup for Bendis' run is premised on the central characters being extremely out of character for it to even work. Hell, Jor-El could have kidnapped Jon and it would have worked better.
    Again, agree to disagree. When you read the issue itself, Lois's decision actually makes a lot more sense than the picture you're painting. She only decided to leave after watching that grade-school-aged son of hers save an alien race from being sold into slavery by an intergalactic empire. So, despite being the badass mama bear and bulldog reporter we know, what exactly is she supposed to do to protect him? If anything, he'd probably have to protect her. She knew that. And, despite his issues, up until that point, Jor-El presented himself as someone who would never willfully hurt Jon or any member of his family. They didn't realize that he was actually as unhinged as he ended up being.

    And I think the point needs to be made that there's a difference between a tiger mom and a helicopter mom. Good parents realize when they need to step back and let their kids grow into the people they're meant to be. Lois saw that she was probably more of a hindrance to Jon than an asset. She believed she that needed to step back and let Jon spread his wings. It was a mistake, but a) Bendis is not shying away from Lois showing regrets for that decision and b) a lot of the time, parents make mistakes. Shocker.
    Last edited by Zeeguy91; 07-19-2019 at 05:22 PM.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeeguy91 View Post
    Again, agree to disagree. When you read the issue itself, Lois's decision actually makes a lot more sense than the picture you're painting. She only decided to leave after watching that grade-school-aged son of hers save an alien race from being sold into slavery by an intergalactic empire. So, despite being the badass mama bear and bulldog reporter we know, what exactly is she supposed to do to protect him? If anything, he'd probably have to protect her. She knew that. And, despite his issues, up until that point, Jor-El presented himself as someone who would never willfully hurt Jon or any member of his family. They didn't realize that he was actually as unhinged as he ended up being.

    And I think the point needs to be made that there's a difference between a tiger mom and a helicopter mom. Good parents realize when they need to step back and let their kids grow into the people they're meant to be. Lois saw that she was probably more of a hindrance to Jon than an asset. She believed she that needed to step back and let Jon spread his wings. It was a mistake, but a) Bendis is not shying away from Lois showing regrets for that decision and b) a lot of the time, parents make mistakes. Shocker.
    Do you have kids? If so then you need to look at your parenting. No resonable parent would leave their 10 year old in the care of someone who had already been proven unstable prior to Bendis ever showing up. You know, back when he was calling himself Mr Oz? Then she and Clark made the idiotic decision to allow him to go but only if Lois joined him and then she disregarded that agreement after a couple of weeks. Came back to Earth, didn't tell Clark that she was back OR that she'd abandoned their son in space with his crazy ass dad and Oh, she needs to be on her own for a bit. That's not how normal couples work. Bendis has definitely screwed up Lois's character. The things she did weren't just mistakes they were complete neglegince.

  4. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeeguy91 View Post
    Again, agree to disagree. When you read the issue itself, Lois's decision actually makes a lot more sense than the picture you're painting. She only decided to leave after watching that grade-school-aged son of hers save an alien race from being sold into slavery by an intergalactic empire. So, despite being the badass mama bear and bulldog reporter we know, what exactly is she supposed to do to protect him? If anything, he'd probably have to protect her. She knew that. And, despite his issues, up until that point, Jor-El presented himself as someone who would never willfully hurt Jon or any member of his family. They didn't realize that he was actually as unhinged as he ended up being.

    And I think the point needs to be made that there's a difference between a tiger mom and a helicopter mom. Good parents realize when they need to step back and let their kids grow into the people they're meant to be. Lois saw that she was probably more of a hindrance to Jon than an asset. She believed she that needed to step back and let Jon spread his wings. It was a mistake, but a) Bendis is not shying away from Lois showing regrets for that decision and b) a lot of the time, parents make mistakes. Shocker.
    Dude, she didn't even have any means of communicating with her kid or tracking him and his body vitals.. Etc,when she left. It was standard procedure for the superfamily to do that, before bendis.heck! Clark had the entire league on the look out for the damian and jon. Everything the kids had and did was under surveillance by the bat. Lois did none of that when she decided to leave. She just left without any thought. This decision was not even in the presence and with the knowledge of the father of the kid.

    Lois has seen jon do wayyy cooler things like taming hellhounds of apocalypse, fighting the eradicator. She has even seen him being kidnapped and tortured. That had never changed her attitude regarding the kid before, why now? She treated jon, like she should. As a kid.suddenly, she is treating him like talia treated damian, like an adult.really? I wouldn't buy that for a second. CLois has never been shown to treat Damian like an adult, let alone Jon.

    Jon always protected her and vice versa. So, what is new in that? That's what family does.i believe, lois will value her son's life than her own.she wouldn't abandon her son, just cause she got scared. Please, she took on the demons of apocalypse for her son and the eradicator.

    She used to give him room to grow(a little "super" extra considering Jon's predicament and needs), but always had him under her watchful eyes directly or indirectly or with someone she can trust like alfred. That's what mothers do they keep tabs on their kids,even when they let them go play with neighbours or friends. They don't just let them of the hook to gallivant around until certain age. That's what i call a "tiger" mom.This wasn't a mistake. This was pure negligence.

    It is not about making a mistakes. Everybody does that. Bad things happen. But that should never stop a parent from doing what they can. It is about doing everything you can for kids to grow up safe. Clark and lois have failed to do that.Jon has suffered for it. He lost his childhood.he was abused for much of his life by a man who looks like his father. The gravity of that is not even shown properly under Bendis's pen.

    Clark didn't even inform hal about jon,who could have easily found him. Hal Jordan was even specifically asking about the wellbeing of jon and hal Jordan was Clark's friend. Clark decided, no I am too much of a proud idiot to ask authorities such as a space cop, when i have lost my kid in space.

    Superfamily isn't great to read under bendis. It is a status quo thrusted upon him, not the one he wanted i feel. So, superfamily which was like the fantastic 4 of dcu is reduced to strangers and idiots .
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 07-19-2019 at 09:53 PM.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    Dude, she didn't even have any means of communicating with her kid or tracking him and his body vitals.. Etc,when she left. It was standard procedure for the superfamily to do that, before bendis.heck! Clark had the entire league on the look out for the damian and jon. Everything the kids had and did was under surveillance by the bat. Lois did none of that when she decided to leave. She just left without any thought. This decision was not even in the presence and with the knowledge of the father of the kid.
    As I recall, Clark did have a method of getting in touch with Jon if needed: the deep space communicator. Lois didn't know that the communicator had been destroyed by Rogol Zaar. So, she probably thought that Clark was checking in. And, again, he was with his grandfather and when she left, he appeared to be in good hands. She did not know that things were going to go to shit when she left.

    Lois has seen jon do wayyy cooler things like taming hellhounds of apocalypse, fighting the eradicator. She has even seen him being kidnapped and tortured. That had never changed her attitude regarding the kid before, why now? She treated jon, like she should. As a kid.suddenly, she is treating him like talia treated damian, like an adult.really? I wouldn't buy that for a second. CLois has never been shown to treat Damian like an adult, let alone Jon.
    Maybe because he chose to go on his own. Jon himself believed that this is what he needed. She even says in the Man of Steel miniseries that there was no stopping him. Then, later on in Action, she says that she basically saw what he was talking about. She even said that it was like he "hit puberty the minute we left orbit." Tht was her perspective. Her son needed to be without his mother to spread his wings because he himself said he needed to change. He said that he needed this.

    I think people need to realize that just because something is against a pattern doesn't mean it's out of character.

    It is not about making a mistakes. Everybody does that. Bad things happen. But that should never stop a parent from doing what they can. It is about doing everything you can for kids to grow up safe. Clark and lois have failed to do that.Jon has suffered for it. He lost his childhood.he was abused for much of his life by a man who looks like his father. The gravity of that is not even shown properly under Bendis's pen.
    You're acting as if Clark hasn't been actively portrayed as mad at all. One of the first things he's done is fly off into space to confront his father.

    Clark didn't even inform hal about jon,who could have easily found him. Hal Jordan was even specifically asking about the wellbeing of jon and hal Jordan was Clark's friend. Clark decided, no I am too much of a proud idiot to ask authorities such as a space cop, when i have lost my kid in space.
    Clark didn't ask because he thought Jon was with his father. Jon was also only gone for three weeks from Clark's perspective when he was supposed to be gone for the whole summer.

    Superfamily isn't great to read under bendis. It is a status quo thrusted upon him, not the one he wanted i feel. So, superfamily which was like the fantastic 4 of dcu is reduced to strangers and idiots .
    If Bendis didn't want to deal with Jon, then he would have just shunted him off somewhere to ignore him. He wouldn't have given us several issues dealing with what Jon went through. And, as for the FF, doesn't Slott currently have Franklin acting like a moody and emo teen?

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Talon1load View Post
    Do you have kids? If so then you need to look at your parenting. No resonable parent would leave their 10 year old in the care of someone who had already been proven unstable prior to Bendis ever showing up. You know, back when he was calling himself Mr Oz? Then she and Clark made the idiotic decision to allow him to go but only if Lois joined him and then she disregarded that agreement after a couple of weeks. Came back to Earth, didn't tell Clark that she was back OR that she'd abandoned their son in space with his crazy ass dad and Oh, she needs to be on her own for a bit. That's not how normal couples work. Bendis has definitely screwed up Lois's character. The things she did weren't just mistakes they were complete neglegince.
    If you're asking me if I'd leave my kid on an alien planet, no. But then again, I don't have a child with superpowers.

  7. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeeguy91 View Post
    As I recall, Clark did have a method of getting in touch with Jon if needed: the deep space communicator. Lois didn't know that the communicator had been destroyed by Rogol Zaar. So, she probably thought that Clark was checking in. And, again, he was with his grandfather and when she left, he appeared to be in good hands. She did not know that things were going to go to shit when she left.



    Maybe because he chose to go on his own. Jon himself believed that this is what he needed. She even says in the Man of Steel miniseries that there was no stopping him. Then, later on in Action, she says that she basically saw what he was talking about. She even said that it was like he "hit puberty the minute we left orbit." Tht was her perspective. Her son needed to be without his mother to spread his wings because he himself said he needed to change. He said that he needed this.

    I think people need to realize that just because something is against a pattern doesn't mean it's out of character.



    You're acting as if Clark hasn't been actively portrayed as mad at all. One of the first things he's done is fly off into space to confront his father.



    Clark didn't ask because he thought Jon was with his father. Jon was also only gone for three weeks from Clark's perspective when he was supposed to be gone for the whole summer.



    If Bendis didn't want to deal with Jon, then he would have just shunted him off somewhere to ignore him. He wouldn't have given us several issues dealing with what Jon went through. And, as for the FF, doesn't Slott currently have Franklin acting like a moody and emo teen?
    With his father? The guy is a stranger. He had been unstable last time they met. Are clois idiots? Some great investigative reporters. Even an idiot could have told them that this won't end well.

    I am sorry. I don't buy the father argument. Clark had trouble letting jon go with Damian, alfred and bruce, let alone a stranger who he knew as a freaking hollagram.
    Puberty doesn't mean anything. Jon was still a kid. Lois suddenly not treating him like one is not something i can buy. It was too sudden and didn't get elaborated.

    The minute the communicator broke, clark had no means to know the extent of his childs trip or his location. If i was a concerned parent i would start worrying and would have started started planning next course of action. Clark on the other hand was smashing rocks like a neanderthal.

    Flying into space like an idiot without a plan. Great.that is not something i expect from someone with the title "the superman". That was a token scene to show" look guys, clark is mad!!!. See, see he is a concerned father". It did nothing for me. Clark had resources, friends like the league, lantern corps and other connections. I never saw any of that come into play. The old Clark kent would have scoured heaven and earth for his kid

    If my kid was on summer trip and i couldn't contact him.I would find another means to contact him. If i couldn't, I would go after him. Also, notify authorities like the cops for help. If i have friends who are authority figures then all the better. Here clark had that luxury. He didn't use it. It's freaking common sense. He didn't even do that.

    That's not the case at all. Lois and jon where not able to contact clark at all, since lois didn't contact him before leaving jon. She didn't or she couldn't. I think she couldn't (otherwise that is just shitty thing to do to father of the child). So,She should have made sure jon was talking to them Even if separately, since lois decided to live separate. Doesn't she want to talk to jon? I mean she is his mother.

    Shunting him off would have been better.atleast another writer could have used jon. Acting moody would be appropriate after you lose your childhood in a volcano with look alike abusive dad. After, jon's return he has lost all the things that made him relatable. He is now caricature "happy-go-lucky" guy..
    Superbook have only made Clois look like absolute idiots and bone-heads .And it had nothing to do with them being flawed great edgy reporters or superheroes. They are just dumb as parents. Like goku.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    With his father? The guy is a stranger. He had been unstable last time they met. Are clois idiots? Some great investigative reporters. Even an idiot could have told them that this won't end well.

    I am sorry. I don't buy the father argument. Clark had trouble letting jon go with Damian, alfred and bruce, let alone a stranger who he knew as a freaking hollagram.
    Puberty doesn't mean anything. Jon was still a kid. Lois suddenly not treating him like one is not something i can buy. It was too sudden and didn't get elaborated.

    The minute the communicator broke, clark had no means to know the extent of his childs trip or his location. If i was a concerned parent i would start worrying and would have started started planning next course of action. Clark on the other hand was smashing rocks like a neanderthal.

    Flying into space like an idiot without a plan. Great.that is not something i expect from someone with the title "the superman". That was a token scene to show" look guys, clark is mad!!!. See, see he is a concerned father". It did nothing for me. Clark had resources, friends like the league, lantern corps and other connections. I never saw any of that come into play. The old Clark kent would have scoured heaven and earth for his kid

    If my kid was on summer trip and i couldn't contact him.I would find another means to contact him. If i couldn't, I would go after him. Also, notify authorities like the cops for help. If i have friends who are authority figures then all the better. Here clark had that luxury. He didn't use it. It's freaking common sense. He didn't even do that.

    That's not the case at all. Lois and jon where not able to contact clark at all, since lois didn't contact him before leaving jon. She didn't or she couldn't. I think she couldn't (otherwise that is just shitty thing to do to father of the child). So,She should have made sure jon was talking to them Even if separately, since lois decided to live separate. Doesn't she want to talk to jon? I mean she is his mother.

    Shunting him off would have been better.atleast another writer could have used jon. Acting moody would be appropriate after you lose your childhood in a volcano with look alike abusive dad. After, jon's return he has lost all the things that made him relatable. He is now caricature "happy-go-lucky" guy..
    Superbook have only made Clois look like absolute idiots and bone-heads .And it had nothing to do with them being flawed great edgy reporters or superheroes. They are just dumb as parents. Like goku.
    Look, we're just not going to agree about this. I'm sorry, but IMO, Bendis's run isn't really out of character. In fact, it's actually quite good and that's not just me saying that. Pretty much every review I've read of Bendis's Superman has been glowing. I just think your refusing to acknowledge the things that put both Lois and Clark's choices in context.
    Last edited by Zeeguy91; 07-20-2019 at 01:39 AM.

  9. #24
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    Its not like the Batfamily is fairing much better.

  10. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeeguy91 View Post
    Look, we're just not going to agree about this. I'm sorry, but IMO, Bendis's run isn't really out of character. In fact, it's actually quite good and that's not just me saying that. Pretty much every review I've read of Bendis's Superman has been glowing. I just think your refusing to acknowledge the things that put both Lois and Clark's choices in context.
    Yeah! We are not going to agree. I disagree about out of character thing. I believe they are. especially , considering context of the previous run and "lois and clark" series. Really? Argument from authority. That too from comic book reviewers whose standards have never been tested. I could say the same. There are tons of youtube reviewers that say otherwise. And i am not talking about the comicsgate guys.
    What context? I would never buy that rebirth Clark and lois would leave their kid in space with some unstable stranger, especially without precautions.It's like, if Bendis or anyone decides to write lois sending jon with sam lane to a battlefield or something . I am not going to buy that either
    Jor el is a stranger. Biology doesn't mean anything.even,Alfred and damian had to go through litmus test for clark to trust them with his kid.
    From now on, if this is how clois is going to be. Jon needs a piccolo and fast.after all every kid needs a big green alien babysitter . Maybe Martian manhunter can stepup. I am just joking, ofcourse.

    It's funny how this applies to clark-jor el situation as well.
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 07-20-2019 at 04:17 AM.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    Yeah! We are not going to agree. I disagree about out of character thing. I believe they are. especially , considering context of the previous run and "lois and clark" series. Really? Argument from authority. That too from comic book reviewers whose standards have never been tested. I could say the same. There are tons of youtube reviewers that say otherwise. And i am not talking about the comicsgate guys.
    They're likely Comicsgate guys. :P

    But, here are just some reviews for the most recent issue:
    https://www.youdontreadcomics.com/co...10/superman-13
    https://www.superpoweredfancast.com/superman-13-review/
    https://comicbooklegion.com/index.ph...man-13-review/

    What context? I would never buy that rebirth Clark and lois would leave their kid in space with some unstable stranger, especially without precautions.It's like, if Bendis or anyone decides to write lois sending jon with sam lane to a battlefield or something . I am not going to buy that either
    Jor el is a stranger. Biology doesn't mean anything.even,Alfred and damian had to go through litmus test for clark to trust them with his kid.
    From now on, if this is how clois is going to be. Jon needs a piccolo and fast.after all every kid needs a big green alien babysitter . Maybe Martian manhunter can stepup. I am just joking, ofcourse.
    The context being that:

    a) Jon himself wanted to go and said this is what he needed
    b) Jor El is, like it or not, his grandfather and actually did come to Jon's rescue and searched endlessly for Jon when he went missing. I don't care if Clark had Damian go through a litmus test. Damian was also raised by a supervillain and is not blood-related to Jon.
    c) Lois was pretty useless up in space due to her not having powers and likely being a liability to Jon and Jor El
    d) Jon had literally just saved an entire race from slavery
    e) The title is dealing with the consequences of Lois's decision. You're acting as if Bendis is saying that everything ended up hunky dorey. He's not.

    I mean, I keep telling you these things and you keep ignoring them.

  12. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeeguy91 View Post
    They're likely Comicsgate guys. :P

    But, here are just some reviews for the most recent issue:
    https://www.youdontreadcomics.com/co...10/superman-13
    https://www.superpoweredfancast.com/superman-13-review/
    https://comicbooklegion.com/index.ph...man-13-review/



    The context being that:

    a) Jon himself wanted to go and said this is what he needed
    b) Jor El is, like it or not, his grandfather and actually did come to Jon's rescue and searched endlessly for Jon when he went missing. I don't care if Clark had Damian go through a litmus test. Damian was also raised by a supervillain and is not blood-related to Jon.
    c) Lois was pretty useless up in space due to her not having powers and likely being a liability to Jon and Jor El
    d) Jon had literally just saved an entire race from slavery
    e) The title is dealing with the consequences of Lois's decision. You're acting as if Bendis is saying that everything ended up hunky dorey. He's not.

    I mean, I keep telling you these things and you keep ignoring them.
    no way. It was guys like caped joel, comicpop.. Etc those aren't comicsgate as far as i know.as for the guys you linked. as i said, argument from authority is not a good argument. Their opinions mean nothing to me.

    A) jon wanted to do all sorts stupid things before. You know what clois did. They turned him the fuck down. That's what parents do.jon wanted go out during the night like batman. You know what clark did, he said go to your bed kid.a kid. That is what jon is.

    B) oh! Please, blood. Still doesn't change the fact that he is a stranger. His name is Jonathan Kent. Not Jon El. He was raised on a farm in Hamilton county. Damian's past means shit. Damian would give his life to protect jon. He is more of a family to jon than the stranger jor el. Damian earned his trust from clark. Unlike the contrived nonesense trust clark has on jor el due to Bendis's writing . As for searching goes, jon wouldn't be in the predicament if it wasn't for Jor el and his "great parenting" . Jor el has been nothing but a jerk and an asshole,since return.

    C) lois lane has been to apocalypse and back. She became a fury for crying out loud. Her feeling useless, can be relatable. But, her running away is cowardly. Lois would never do that. He married superman knowing that she wouldn't be able to keep up but still she is there, does what she can every single day. If lois can go after leviathan and shit she can hang in space. She also had Clark's suit as protection . So, her leaving her kid as an adult and mother,who gave word to her husband is despeakable

    D) so what? He saved puppies from apocalypse as well.he even got to ride them.he saved an entire planet before. But, that doesnít make him an adult. Still a kid, that needs supervision.

    E) clearly, i rather it not. Books are better when superfamily is not focus Like action comics for instance. They are only dealing with "the kiss" anyways . Clois being idiotic parents is not being dealt with. Jon seems to be pretty ok with his parents. Jon is getting send to the legion for god knows what reason.

    I keep repeating,
    Jurgen's and tomasi's rebirth clois characterisation as parents=/= bendis's clois characterisation as parents.
    Therefore, characters acting out of character.
    Anyways, i don't think we are going to agree on it.so,let's just leave it at that. Heck! Snyder had an issue in jl with superfamily that i quiet liked better. I like superfamily in dceased. I just don't like Bendis's Clois as parents and his superfamily characterisation.
    Other than that lois seem to be doing ok under rucka. Clark otherwise is great under bendis so far.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    A) jon wanted to do all sorts stupid things before. You know what clois did. They turned him the fuck down. That's what parents do.jon wanted go out during the night like batman. You know what clark did, he said go to your bed kid.a kid. That is what jon is.
    I see nothing stupid about a young man wanting to find himself and learn how to live up to his father's legacy. That's what the whole trip was about. If Lois and Clark denied him the chance to learn how to be his own man, they'd be bad parents.

    B) oh! Please, blood. Still doesn't change the fact that he is a stranger. His name is Jonathan Kent. Not Jon El. He was raised on a farm in Hamilton county. Damian's past means shit. Damian would give his life to protect jon. He is more of a family to jon than the stranger jor el. Damian earned his trust from clark. Unlike the contrived nonesense trust clark has on jor el due to Bendis's writing . As for searching goes, jon wouldn't be in the predicament if it wasn't for Jor el and his "great parenting" . Jor el has been nothing but a jerk and an asshole,since return.
    Again, a lot of peope would tell you blood does mean something. Its not like Lois and Clark weren't skeptical, but at the end of the day, Jor El is his grandfather. And also at the end of the day, Jor El searched for Jon for years when he went missing and rescued him from Superwoman.

    C) lois lane has been to apocalypse and back. She became a fury for crying out loud. Her feeling useless, can be relatable. But, her running away is cowardly. Lois would never do that. He married superman knowing that she wouldn't be able to keep up but still she is there, does what she can every single day. If lois can go after leviathan and shit she can hang in space. She also had Clark's suit as protection . So, her leaving her kid as an adult and mother,who gave word to her husband is despeakable
    Except for one important thing: for Jon to grow, she needed to let him. Right before he left, Jon expressed the need to grow and know who he was without his parents. That's the difference. If you can't see the significance of that, I don't know what to tell you.

    D) so what? He saved puppies from apocalypse as well.he even got to ride them.he saved an entire planet before. But, that doesn’t make him an adult. Still a kid, that needs supervision.
    Again, he said he needed to find out who he was and to her it was obvious that he'd never accomplish that with her hovering over his shoulder. And, AGAIN, Lois thought she was leaving him with supervision with his grandfather. I don't see how this is worse than Reed Richards and Sue Storm literally welcoming Doom, their archenemy who has a creepy relationship with their daughter into the FF. In fact, I'd say Lois and Clark's choice here to be significantly more understandable. Yet, you don't see anyone attacking Reed and Sue's judgment.

    E) clearly, i rather it not. Books are better when superfamily is not focus Like action comics for instance. They are only dealing with "the kiss" anyways . Clois being idiotic parents is not being dealt with. Jon seems to be pretty ok with his parents. Jon is getting send to the legion for god knows what reason.
    Yeah, why wouldn't he be okay with his parents. It was HIS choice to go with his grandfather. And Clark's anger at his father is being dealt with in the main Superman title. You know, if you're going to criticize something, it usually helps to read it first.

    I keep repeating,
    Jurgen's and tomasi's rebirth clois characterisation as parents=/= bendis's clois characterisation as parents.
    Therefore, characters acting out of character.
    Except for one really important thing: people act differently in different circumstances. This is something Peter David pointed out in an interview a few years back: that when fans say that someone is being out of character, sometimes its just code for "I don't like what happened here." People don't act the same way 100% of the time. They react to different things differently. It depends on the circumstance. There's a difference between Jon simply going on adventures with his dad and Jon needing to go out and discover who he is.

    But, yeah, let's just leave it at that.

  14. #29
    Astonishing Member Jackalope89's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeeguy91 View Post
    I see nothing stupid about a young man wanting to find himself and learn how to live up to his father's legacy. That's what the whole trip was about. If Lois and Clark denied him the chance to learn how to be his own man, they'd be bad parents.
    Own man? Jon was maybe 11 at most. Still in grade school. Still learning as a KID. If he was 16-17, then maybe. But 11? Come on!



    Again, a lot of peope would tell you blood does mean something. Its not like Lois and Clark weren't skeptical, but at the end of the day, Jor El is his grandfather. And also at the end of the day, Jor El searched for Jon for years when he went missing and rescued him from Superwoman.
    Except, Jor-El was a stranger to even Clark, his own son. Let alone Jon. He never raised either, never talked to them until the Oz Effect, etc. So, no. Blood has nothing to do with it. Jonathon Kent Senior would be the better grandparent. He may not be blood related, but he was still Clark's father.


    Except for one important thing: for Jon to grow, she needed to let him. Right before he left, Jon expressed the need to grow and know who he was without his parents. That's the difference. If you can't see the significance of that, I don't know what to tell you.
    Once again; Jon was still 11 (tops). He wasn't even a teenager. Not even out of grade school. This whole "need to grow without his parents" doesn't fly at that age.



    Again, he said he needed to find out who he was and to her it was obvious that he'd never accomplish that with her hovering over his shoulder. And, AGAIN, Lois thought she was leaving him with supervision with his grandfather. I don't see how this is worse than Reed Richards and Sue Storm literally welcoming Doom, their archenemy who has a creepy relationship with their daughter into the FF. In fact, I'd say Lois and Clark's choice here to be significantly more understandable. Yet, you don't see anyone attacking Reed and Sue's judgment.
    Again; ELEVEN years old. And that's not even including that he and Damian did their own thing on the weekends as the Super Sons.


    Yeah, why wouldn't he be okay with his parents. It was HIS choice to go with his grandfather. And Clark's anger at his father is being dealt with in the main Superman title. You know, if you're going to criticize something, it usually helps to read it first.
    11 year old. Still young kid that only really heroed when he didn't have school work to do. Stupid parents left him with highly questionable stranger that when they last saw him (before Man of Steel), was behind numerous acts of terrorism and atrocities. Then he suddenly goes *poof*, only turn up out of nowhere? C'mon!



    Except for one really important thing: people act differently in different circumstances. This is something Peter David pointed out in an interview a few years back: that when fans say that someone is being out of character, sometimes its just code for "I don't like what happened here." People don't act the same way 100% of the time. They react to different things differently. It depends on the circumstance. There's a difference between Jon simply going on adventures with his dad and Jon needing to go out and discover who he is.
    Jon is STILL a grade school kid. What's more, his parents have no problem helping him discover who he is. But letting him go off with Jor-El, and then Lois abandoning him there, and Clark NOT asking his many friends and contacts for help in regards to his son, is rank with out of character moments. Whereas in Rebirth, Clark smashed into the Bat Cave, pissed that his son was taken there.

    But, yeah, let's just leave it at that.
    Yeah, leaving your son with a proven terrorist enabler, at 11 on a supposed "self discovery" quest, is freakin' stupid.

  15. #30
    Astonishing Member Restingvoice's Avatar
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    I feel bad for nonfans of Batman and that includes fans of the Batfam who are nonfans of Batman XD

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