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  1. #1
    Mighty Member
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    Default why do humans discriminate against mutants and not mutates?

    In the marvel universe

    We obviously know that mutants are portrayed as the other in the marvel universe, but what is it that really differentiates them from a mutate

    Why is it that humans that gain powers are not as dehumanized by people in the MU as much as mutants. What is it about the x-gene that frightens people, is it mainly because they were born this way and mutates only developed their ability through external ways

    Has this ever been talked about in comics. Why are people like Logan and Cyclops seen as other, but Spider-man and Hulk are not, on a practical level you wouldn't differentiate between all 4. You wouldn't know 2 are mutants and 2 are mutates.

  2. #2
    Astonishing Member Cville's Avatar
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    Probably because they were born that way.

    I remember in the Fox Spiderman cartoon when he crossed over with the xmen during his Man-Spider arc, he said he didn't want to be a freak because he was mutating. Implying that even SM thinks mutants are freaks. lol.

  3. #3
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    Literally nothing differentiates them to the point some have been mistaken or lumped in with mutants outright.

    The X-gene is the deciding factor, but even then the racism usually just extends into all with powers anyways.
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  4. #4
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Well Im not an expert but as I understand it humans fear mutants for two reasons;

    First, they can manifest in anyone, at any time. They're random kids, good, bad and in-between, who very suddenly become weaponized. Kids aren't the most responsible people in the first place, some of them struggle to control their powers (at least initially) and that leads to sometimes lethal accidents.....and sometimes the kid is a monster in the first place. So the problem people have is that there's no control, no way to make sure only good, decent people get powers, or to ensure that those who get them can handle them. Its the fear of school shootings, only with super powers.

    The second reason people fear mutants appears to be a fear of being replaced. Humans are afraid that homo superior will take over the world and they'll become second class citizens, ruled over by a race of supermen beyond the understanding or influence of regular people.

    I've never really thought this "hated and feared" thing made much sense in the MU though. I mean, I understand being concerned about random kids manifesting powers they might not be able to control.....but in the MU its not like this is the only superhuman threat out there. The MU is a very dangerous place, and while mutants manifesting randomly would be a concern I don't see it being such a huge concern it generates active bigotry and hate. Not when people are fine with all the other crazy, deadly things that can happen at any given moment.

    And the fear of being replaced seems foolish to me as well. First off, we've got immortals like Thor and Hercules, running around for centuries, sleeping with whole villages of women, and mythology tells us these gods can breed true and have superhuman kids. And then there's the Captain Americas and Spider-Men, who could very well also pass on their powers too. There's not a ton of superhumans in the world compared to regular people, but more appear every year at a seemingly increasing rate and if that keeps up? In a few generations who knows how many will be out there? If you're worried about being replaced, superhumans as a whole should concern you, just not mutants.

    I think the whole mutant bigotry thing makes a lot more sense when the mutants are the only superhumans in the world (as much as any bigotry makes sense anyway). It just doesn't fly in a world that also has gods and aliens and wizards and science experiments....and all that stuff is fine, but if little Timmy got powers just because of good genes? He's a monster we have to burn alive. Like, what?
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  5. #5
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    X-Men Grand Design gives an answer. It's rather incomplete, but I'll take it.

    Basically, humans were relatively indifferent to mutants for centuries. Some were chased out and killed via torches and pitchforks. Others were worshiped as gods.

    Namor, the mutant Atlantean hybrid, decided to flood New York City and wage war on the surface world. He was stopped by a manmade superhero, the Android Human Torch, thus explaining why the public doesn't fear the tech based, magic based, and squishy normie heroes that much. Although it doesn't explain why they don't hold similar sentiments against Atlanteans or how they're able to tell mutates and inhumans from mutants.

    Actually, there was a story where Marvel citizens freak out over the inhumans and called the Sentinels on them since they mistook the Royal Family for mutant.

  6. #6
    Incredible Member Force de Phenix's Avatar
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    They fear mutants because they are random, can cause omega level destruction, and have the same rights as humans (unless they do otherwise). They hate inhumans because they see them as a migrant invasion and pretty much the same stuff as the mutants.

  7. #7
    The Celestial Dragon Tien Long's Avatar
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    In a broad sense, I think that all Marvel heroes have been hated and feared in a way, mutant or not. It's one of the defining characteristics of a Marvel superhero. There's always this sense that they're a menace and can't be controlled. Thus, there is the distrust. Spider-Man, the Hulk, Namor, Ghost Rider are some of the "heroes" that come off the top of my head. But there have been instances when Captain America, Iron Man, and the Fantastic Four have been deemed threats and menaces.

    But okay, that's stretching things. Yes, all MU heroes have encountered fears, but the X-Men have gotten it WAAAAYYY worse. Straight up prejudice and discrimination, the likes of which Captain America hasn't encountered before. I think of the reasons MU superhumans never encountered discrimination was because humans saw them as being "one of their own." As amazing as Captain America was, he still sided with humans and fought for them. Mutants, on the other hand, were seen as the other and, as already been pointed out, were the next stage of evolution. Busiek's and Ross' "Marvels" touched on that a lot, how humans were afraid that they would be enslaved by mutants and killed by them all. Phil Sheldon confronted that prejudice starkly when he finds Maggie, a mutant girl hiding in his basement:



    Compound that with Magneto and his Brotherhood constantly saying that mutants were superior to humans and deserved to be enslaved, and well, that's how you have that attitude.
    Last edited by Tien Long; 07-29-2019 at 06:45 PM.
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  8. #8
    Invincible Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Random4 View Post
    In the marvel universe

    We obviously know that mutants are portrayed as the other in the marvel universe, but what is it that really differentiates them from a mutate

    Why is it that humans that gain powers are not as dehumanized by people in the MU as much as mutants. What is it about the x-gene that frightens people, is it mainly because they were born this way and mutates only developed their ability through external ways

    Has this ever been talked about in comics. Why are people like Logan and Cyclops seen as other, but Spider-man and Hulk are not, on a practical level you wouldn't differentiate between all 4. You wouldn't know 2 are mutants and 2 are mutates.
    Funny thing is for the most part, the only way the average person would even know if a super hero is a mutant or not is if they have an X on their uniform.

    But I suppose the nice thing about Civil War is that the whole fear thing spread to the entire super hero community, at least for awhile. So it slightly made more sense I guess.

  9. #9
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    Might as well ask why in movies about evil aliens, the humans will do recklessly naive things like stand right under the alien ships in "Independence Day" with welcoming signs. Yet in movies about good aliens, humans will immediately trot out the torches and pitchforks. It's about story theme. In the evil alien stories, the protagonist is that One Man who can see that the aliens are here to kill us all. And in movies about good aliens, the protagonist is that One Man who can see that the alien isn't here to kill us.

    The theme of the mutant comics is about dealing with bigotry.

    The themes of the mutate comics are more varied. Some are gritty crime stories that just happen to have metahumans, Raymond Chandler with laser-eyes instead of pistols. Evil in such stories is petty and personal, not en masse and political. The protagonist in such stories doesn't have time to be persecuted by large groups; he's too busy getting drunk and leaning his head against the shower wall for long stretches and getting conned by the lady in red who pretends to love him but is actually motivated by greed. Jessica Jones is an example of this.

    Some are about balancing a personal life with the responsibility to help the community. Villains tend to be things like the rent, or characters who offer an easy solution to the conundrum but turn out to be devoid of personal responsibility, like movie Mysterio. Massive bigot movements are too much for such stories. They complicate the narrative in ways that are drama destroying rather than enhancing. Spider-Man is the obvious example of this.

    Some are about balancing responsibility and hubris. The protagonist himself is the villain half the time in such stories, as he struggles to find the line between doing all he can to help the world, and controlling the world or being a mad scientist/mad wizard. Massive bigot movements have no real place in such stories. Typically the hero could beat such movements almost casually. The question is how far should he go to do so before he becomes a controlling dictator or mad god. Villains in such stories tend to be characters who either push the hero into giving in to his flaws, or examples of what the hero is becoming if he continues his path. Iron Man is the poster-boy for this sort of story.
    Last edited by MichaelC; 07-29-2019 at 07:22 PM.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by U.N. Owen View Post
    X-Men Grand Design gives an answer. It's rather incomplete, but I'll take it.

    Basically, humans were relatively indifferent to mutants for centuries. Some were chased out and killed via torches and pitchforks. Others were worshiped as gods.

    Namor, the mutant Atlantean hybrid, decided to flood New York City and wage war on the surface world. He was stopped by a manmade superhero, the Android Human Torch, thus explaining why the public doesn't fear the tech based, magic based, and squishy normie heroes that much. Although it doesn't explain why they don't hold similar sentiments against Atlanteans or how they're able to tell mutates and inhumans from mutants.

    Actually, there was a story where Marvel citizens freak out over the inhumans and called the Sentinels on them since they mistook the Royal Family for mutant.
    I honestly don't think it made much sense since Namor would represent Atlanteans more than he represents Mutants.
    At least he doesn't represent the Mutants born in a human society.
    Military not taking actions against Atlantis yet people hating their neighbor Mutants are kinda absurd, it is not like that Namor came from a Mutant Civilization, it's Atlanteans.

  11. #11
    Ultimate Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    Funny thing is for the most part, the only way the average person would even know if a super hero is a mutant or not is if they have an X on their uniform.
    And even some X-Men don't wear an X. Firestar never added one when she joined the team, instead wearing her classic costume. Villains, obviously, don't wear the X either, nor do Molly Hayes and Vance Astrovik, who are associated with different teams.

  12. #12
    Astonishing Member Silvermoth's Avatar
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    Why do some straight blokes love lesbian porn but hate gay people? Hate makes no sense

  13. #13
    ...of the Black Priests Midnight_v's Avatar
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    In cannon?

    BECAUSE MAGENTO! ... and because Charles.

    They started this racist Darwin-istic:
    "On the Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection, or the Preservation of Favoured Races in the Struggle for Life"

    and decided what they should DO about it.

    Pre - 1963 - The only well known mutant was Namor, and unless there was some retconning... really there was ZERO anti-mutant talk
    during the Invaders books.

    Humans hadn't done anything in cannon to really be racist against mutants.

    It was pre-emptive:

    Magneto's experiences surviving Nazi Germany, Auschwitz, and Vinnytsia would shape his outlook on the situation that mutants face in the Marvel Universe. Determined to keep such atrocities from ever being committed against mutantkind, he is willing to use deadly force to protect mutants. He would believe that mutants ("Homo superior") will become the dominant life form on the planet and would set about either creating a homeland on Earth where mutants could live peacefully, or conquering and enslaving humanity in the name of mutantkind.

    Magneto's first villainous act is attacking a United States military base called Cape Citadel after bringing down missiles



    This dickhead.... started the whole damn thing.

    1. Declaring Mutants an ENTIRE different Species (HOMO Superior)
    2. Making the FIRST encounter that the BULK of the world would have be him attacking an Goddamn American military base at the height of the Cold war.

    Actually the term species is pretty nebulous and a lot of JOE BLOW average guy wouldn't have any idea if Captain America, Spidey, or Nova were actually Mutants
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  14. #14
    Spectacular Member Dark-Jacket's Avatar
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    I think, outside of the bigotery and the fear, there is envy.

    Mutants don't have to do anything, they are born this way and you can't become a mutant.
    On the other hand, mutates represents the possibility of evolution of the human race.

    Let's take the more popular heroes. Captain America ? Apex of the military. Fantastic Four ? Human explorers. Iron Man ? Money and intelligence. Thor ? A god Hawkeye ? An everyman. Captain Marvel ? A decorated military who struggles against aliens.
    All things humans can aspire to be.

    Mutants, they are born that way and humans can never match that.

  15. #15
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    I mean come on - you classify a group of people as being Homo-SUPERIOR, you pretty much invite everyone NOT in that group to be resentful.
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