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  1. #76
    Mighty Member Marvelboy1974's Avatar
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    Just for fun: Ororo plus Jean, J’roro.

  2. #77
    Fantastic Member HomoSuperior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    And that makes the civil rights mutant metaphor a tad more interesting with one of founders of each side also a racial minority. And for this topic that means merging Magneto with Moses Magnum.
    More interesting? Both sides a minority?

    FB4F4CA1-89B8-49D4-A1A8-AD0280B713E4.jpg

    Uhh, you know Magneto is a Slavic Jew, right?

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashkenazi_Jews

    Check out the Viktov Hill memorial in Prague, dedicated to the Slavic people’s back-to-back struggles against Nazis and then Communism. Drenched in crimson and purple and calls to mind Magneto’s costume. The angel’s wings call to mind the little ‘horns’ on his helmet.

    534B35EA-C404-409F-8F61-50B680257417.jpg

    This display is dedicated to a 19 year old Czech kid who set himself on fire, killing himself, inspiring the people to resist Communist rule.

    CA54B412-0269-4823-80A8-BB8959EC5B83.jpg

    Magneto is famously known as a WWII holocaust symbol. However, it seems like Claremont was well-traveled and observing fascist oppression is a global phenomenon that persists beyond WWII; and not just a U.S. civil rights thing.

    That said — bring back Magneto’s Crimson + Purple.
    Last edited by HomoSuperior; 08-05-2019 at 07:08 AM.

  3. #78
    Astonishing Member CRaymond's Avatar
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    Here’s a thread about adjusting Magneto’s ethnicity. It was controversial then and a locked thread now.

    https://community.cbr.com/showthread...sian-portrayal

    I’m similarly distressed at the notion that Magneto’s heritage is mutable, but sliding timescales are a thing to contend with, and inhumane cruelty is everywhere. My only creative solution is to stretch the existence of the camps. This is terribly monstrous to propose, but what if the Nazis of the Marvel Universe created a labor camp in the wilds of Africa or South America, and kept Jews as slaves for generations? It would enable a younger Magneto to emerge from a prolonged Holocaust, and have him HATE the nations of the world for declaring a war over 40-50 years before his camp was discovered and destroyed.

  4. #79
    Fantastic Member HomoSuperior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CRaymond View Post
    Here’s a thread about adjusting Magneto’s ethnicity. It was controversial then and a locked thread now. I’m similarly distressed at the notion that Magneto’s heritage is mutable, but sliding timescales are a thing to contend with, and inhumane cruelty is everywhere. My only creative solution is to stretch the existence of the camps.
    Why get so fantastical about it? We live in times where a portion of America longs to be “woke.” For the MCU — if timescales are a concern, diving deeper into Slavic Jew history, and fascism’s lesser-known mutation from Nazis into Communists, trades WWII for the Cold War. It offers the opportunity to be “woke” and resonates without prioritizing human trauma. Trust me, take a trip to Prague and the average tour guide will tell you their cultural history is defined by a constant state of resistance. Fascism’s story didn’t end with WWII and forced labor camps aren’t always obvious. Imagine being at the center of Nazis and then Communism for almost 100 years. Having world powers carve up your region and deciding your population should be “given” to the Soviet Union. That’s everyone in that region, not just Slavic Jews.

    In some ways it’s telling that an American audience “needs” it all to be “updated” or “more relevant.” Plenty of real stories to mine for allegory. Self-immolation at the age of 19 says a lot about the state of human affairs long after WWII’s victory.

    A01341F1-ED49-4C15-A74D-857B9AC5F2E0.jpg

    If our current state of affairs says anything, it’s fascism mutates and metastasizes. If the goal is to connect with others by calling attention to an ugly human truth vs. show off our imagination, let’s dig deeper into a not-so-hidden history that’s been overshadowed by WWII’s victory.

    Thanks for the engaging, respectful chat.
    Last edited by HomoSuperior; 08-05-2019 at 07:42 AM.

  5. #80
    Astonishing Member CRaymond's Avatar
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    You use of the word woke with quotes makes me question your earnestness.

    Are you suggesting an Eastern European Jewish Magneto born and raised in the Communist Bloc, and eschewing Nazi iconography for the prolonged trauma and terror of being the generations that followed the Holocaust? It’s not as bombastic, and far more nuanced —which works for me. Maybe not for others, but they’re bound to pipe up.

  6. #81
    Fantastic Member HomoSuperior's Avatar
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    Nice summary. Not as bombastic? Prioritizing human trauma is always a risky proposition, but I would argue being “given away” by the west and living at the center of normalized Communist fascist rule for 40+ years from 1945 - 1989, weighs a little more than WWII’s six-ish years. While 80s kids were hating communism like it was a team sport and listening to new wave, Czech kids were setting themselves on fire as protest. For the record I hate writing that.

    With regard to perceptions of my earnestness, yeah I’m editorializing w/those bunny ears. The word is loaded because it’s become associated with perceived self-serving competitive virtue signaling. Enlightenment is a good thing but it means nothing without selfless commitment to the story at the center.

    For example, is it better to write a fantastical allegory that results in people praising our creativity but further obfuscates an overlooked universal human tragedy. Or is it better to dive deeper into that real universal human tragedy by showing it from alternative perspective? Guess it all depends on the stakes.

    I’m not advocating. That’s all rhetorical.
    Last edited by HomoSuperior; 08-05-2019 at 08:12 AM.

  7. #82
    Fantastic Member HomoSuperior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CRaymond View Post
    You use of the word woke with quotes makes me question your earnestness.
    Earnest? I mean, I tried to lighten things up a bit...

    Quote Originally Posted by HomoSuperior View Post
    Alpha-X

    X-lore continuity is fraught with baggage when you try to think of the stories in a linear sequence. Not a reboot or an alternate universe — this warp reveals the Xavier genetic line’s hidden history of traveling the globe collecting mutants like they were Starbucks “been there” series mugs. This Alpha mutant’s rallying cry? “Tumi my X-men.”
    Retail: $895.00

    Attachment 85472

  8. #83
    Astonishing Member CRaymond's Avatar
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    I’m open to all kinds; my optimism leads me into sensitive conversations where I misinterpret sarcasm and ridicule. Thanks for clarifying.

    As the origin of this topic was character consolidation, it’s problematic when we reconfigure histories in order to make parentage a key element. Moving Magneto from the Holocaust to Communist Bloc seems workable, but moving him to a completely Rwandan context in order to parent an African Ororo is not.

    I don’t have answers. Only framing the dialog thus far.

  9. #84
    Extraordinary Member spirit2011's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CRaymond View Post
    This might be controversial, but I canít stand Cable. He was a shot of new blood for the New Mutants, juiced them up with 90s testosterone, and went thru more character changes than what should be allowed.

    I donít mind hardasses from the future as a trope, but the shenanigans to build him up as a central X character always fall flat and end up returning to his introduction: gruff, heavily-armed time traveller, ie soulless trope. Itís why he works so well with Deadpool, whose entire character is irreverence.

    Iíve been trying hard to merge Cable with Bishop. Itís just coming out a completely new character.
    While Cable was born into present, then went into the future and then back to present. Bishop was born into future and then time traveled to present.
    Hard to make Cable black when he is a jean clone/Cyclops kid

  10. #85
    Astonishing Member CRaymond's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spirit2011 View Post
    Hard to make Cable black when he is a jean clone/Cyclops kid
    Being Nathan Christopher Charles Summers is the worst part of Cable’s history.

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by spirit2011 View Post
    While Cable was born into present, then went into the future and then back to present. Bishop was born into future and then time traveled to present.
    Hard to make Cable black when he is a jean clone/Cyclops kid
    They could just retcon Jean giving birth to him. Given that he is essentially her son anyway.
    One of the curious things about Cable is that he is the first X-men "kid" the second generation, the fact that he went to the future and came back as an adult from an apocalyptic future is interesting and fucked up. More than just coming form another future like Rachel or Bishop.
    It Cable's case is a dramatic change and maybe a pessimist reveal that no matter what the future is screwed but they must keep fighting anyway.
    Last edited by CuteNimrod; 08-05-2019 at 08:30 AM.

  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by CRaymond View Post
    Being Nathan Christopher Charles Summers is the worst part of Cableís history.
    It is the best part. He would only be another 90's gun man without that.

  13. #88
    Fantastic Member HomoSuperior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CRaymond View Post
    As the origin of this topic was character consolidation, it’s problematic when we reconfigure histories in order to make parentage a key element. Moving Magneto from the Holocaust to Communist Bloc seems workable, but moving him to a completely Rwandan context in order to parent an African Ororo is not. I don’t have answers. Only framing the dialog thus far.
    Keeping these portmanteaus fun, how about crossing Magneto w/Wolverine and maybe Marrow yielding “Feralous — Master of Animal Magnetism”
    Last edited by HomoSuperior; 08-05-2019 at 08:29 AM.

  14. #89
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spirit2011 View Post
    While Cable was born into present, then went into the future and then back to present. Bishop was born into future and then time traveled to present.
    Hard to make Cable black when he is a jean clone/Cyclops kid
    I kinda like a Jean Grey/Celia Reyes merging because I think Jean Grey being a doctor was one of the smartest moves that movie franchise did and filling her out bits with Celia Reyes backstory give a more complete character. But adjusting stories in fantasy thread about merging makes me a "woke" apparently

  15. #90
    Astonishing Member CRaymond's Avatar
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    I like Jean and Cecelia separate only cause I want one to be dead and the other alive, but I totally agree that Jean’s medical education was a great addition to Famke’s portrayal.

    Quote Originally Posted by CuteNimrod View Post
    It is the best part. He would only be another 90's gun man without that.
    Different strokes. IMO it’s a rickety bridge that requires a lot of upkeep. I think being a Kyle Reese type who’s working thru his dystopian trauma to build a better world and thereby building a better self is the far more compelling story. While I applaud centralizing and building relations in some cases, this one is unnecessary and convoluted.
    Last edited by CRaymond; 08-05-2019 at 08:40 AM.

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