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  1. #1
    Ultimate Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    Default Zyklon - retconned "Golden Age" villain

    First appearance = All-Star Squadron #45 (May 1985):


    though readers of Wonder Woman #240 (February 1978) may have felt like they had seen Zyklon before:


    From Who's Who: The Definitive Directory of the DC Universe Vol. XXVI (April 1987)

  2. #2
    Boisterously Confused
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    One of the many reasons I was sad to see Crisis derail All-Star Squadron was that I was hoping Thomas had a story down the road where JQ gave this jerk the right-proper-@**-whup he had comin'.

  3. #3
    Extraordinary Member Dr. Poison's Avatar
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    So Who's Who got his first appearance wrong? He actually appeared in Wonder Woman before All-Star Squadron?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Poison View Post
    So Who's Who got his first appearance wrong? He actually appeared in Wonder Woman before All-Star Squadron?
    Not necessarily. The Wonder Woman story had Seigfried and the All-Star Squadron had Zyklon. Other than the similar (but not exact) costume and powers all we know is both were Nazi operatives. Could be the same guy using different codenames. Could be two operatives who underwent the same procedure with the second simply wearing a modified costume.

    Since I can't tell when the Wonder Woman tale is set, it's not even clear which came first from Earth-2's perspective. I'm guessing the Wonder Woman tale is closer to the TV timeline and thus occurs later in 1942-1943 than the published All-Star Squadron tales.

  5. #5
    Ultimate Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Clark View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Poison View Post
    So Who's Who got his first appearance wrong? He actually appeared in Wonder Woman before All-Star Squadron?
    Not necessarily. The Wonder Woman story had Seigfried and the All-Star Squadron had Zyklon. Other than the similar (but not exact) costume and powers all we know is both were Nazi operatives. Could be the same guy using different codenames. Could be two operatives who underwent the same procedure with the second simply wearing a modified costume.

    Since I can't tell when the Wonder Woman tale is set, it's not even clear which came first from Earth-2's perspective. I'm guessing the Wonder Woman tale is closer to the TV timeline and thus occurs later in 1942-1943 than the published All-Star Squadron tales.
    Actually, . . .
    "Seigried" and Zyklon were two different characters. "Seigfried" appeared many, many more times . . . but using a different name.
    (NOTE: The "Seigfried" name was just temporary for the character and for a very specific reason.)


    The Wonder Woman issue "Seigfried" appeared in was during the period where the comic book series was set during WWII and involved the Golden Age Wonder Woman on Earth-Two, all to line up better with the first season of the Lynda Carter show when it was on the ABC network here in the U.S. (After that first season, the TV show changed networks and switched the time period to the present, so the comic book stories went back to being about Earth-One Wonder Woman in the present.) One other thing about the Earth-Two Wonder Woman stories during WWII that were published in relation to the TV show: Steve Trevor (as seen in the pages from that original post) was depicted with dark hair instead of his traditional blonde hair at the same time the Steve Trevor on the TV show was played by Lyle Waggoner.



    The only reason I mention Seigfried was because of Roy Thomas basically turning the idea of "Seigfried" into an actual Nazi supervillain in All-Star Squadron.

  6. #6
    Ultimate Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    A few more pages with Zyklon fighting Johnny Quick from All-Star Squadron #45 (May 1985):



  7. #7
    Incredible Member NeathBlue's Avatar
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    I vaguely remember him, but with very little clarity...
    Must have gone over my head at the time of publication, that he's named after the gas they used.

  8. #8
    Ultimate Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NeathBlue View Post
    I vaguely remember him, but with very little clarity...
    Must have gone over my head at the time of publication, that he's named after the gas they used.
    Well, his name translated to "cyclone", and there were also pesticides/gasses that used the word in their names back around then, too.

  9. #9
    Extraordinary Member Dr. Poison's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    Actually, . . .
    "Seigried" and Zyklon were two different characters. "Seigfried" appeared many, many more times . . . but using a different name.
    (NOTE: The "Seigfried" name was just temporary for the character and for a very specific reason.)


    The Wonder Woman issue "Seigfried" appeared in was during the period where the comic book series was set during WWII and involved the Golden Age Wonder Woman on Earth-Two, all to line up better with the first season of the Lynda Carter show when it was on the ABC network here in the U.S. (After that first season, the TV show changed networks and switched the time period to the present, so the comic book stories went back to being about Earth-One Wonder Woman in the present.) One other thing about the Earth-Two Wonder Woman stories during WWII that were published in relation to the TV show: Steve Trevor (as seen in the pages from that original post) was depicted with dark hair instead of his traditional blonde hair at the same time the Steve Trevor on the TV show was played by Lyle Waggoner.



    The only reason I mention Seigfried was because of Roy Thomas basically turning the idea of "Seigfried" into an actual Nazi supervillain in All-Star Squadron.

    Thanks folks!
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    Incredible Member NeathBlue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    Well, his name translated to "cyclone", and there were also pesticides/gasses that used the word in their names back around then, too.
    Yes... but when you have a character whose a Nazi and goes by the name of Zyklon, it’s pretty obvious what the connection is.
    Don’t get me wrong, I haven’t got a problem about it... It’s a comic book character who represents one of the worst regimes in human history, and because of that, I think the name fits perfectly.
    But I’m not sure, in this overly PC society, you’d get away with naming him it as easily as was back then...

  11. #11
    Ultimate Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NeathBlue View Post
    Yes... but when you have a character whose a Nazi and goes by the name of Zyklon, itís pretty obvious what the connection is.
    Donít get me wrong, I havenít got a problem about it... Itís a comic book character who represents one of the worst regimes in human history, and because of that, I think the name fits perfectly.
    But Iím not sure, in this overly PC society, youíd get away with naming him it as easily as was back then...
    He was named in the 1980s.
    It's not like this is a character that was created / published in the 1940s.
    And I don't think most other people would really go beyond the "Zyklon" = German for "Cyclone" connection, especially with a character that runs really fast.

  12. #12
    Extraordinary Member Dr. Poison's Avatar
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    I find it hard to believe that with Roy Thomas' extensive knowledge of the World War II heroes that he wasn't familiar with Seigfriend the Speedster when he introduced Zyklon. My guess is that he just had the character take on a new name but didn't mention it in story.
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  13. #13
    Ultimate Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Poison View Post
    I find it hard to believe that with Roy Thomas' extensive knowledge of the World War II heroes that he wasn't familiar with Seigfriend the Speedster when he introduced Zyklon. My guess is that he just had the character take on a new name but didn't mention it in story.
    For anyone who hasn't read the story with "Seigfried the Speedster" back in 1978, it turned out "Seigfried" was really spoilers:
    Golden Age Flash (Jay Garrick), pretending to be a Nazi villain in an effort to have people believe in Wonder Woman again. She had been thought of as a menace because of illusions and manipulations caused by the Duke of Deception.
    end of spoilers

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    For anyone who hasn't read the story with "Seigfried the Speedster" back in 1978, it turned out "Seigfried" was really spoilers:
    Golden Age Flash (Jay Garrick), pretending to be a Nazi villain in an effort to have people believe in Wonder Woman again. She had been thought of as a menace because of illusions and manipulations caused by the Duke of Deception.
    end of spoilers
    Huh! So, assuming the WW story was set after the All-Star story, there was actually some vengeful defamation going on. Nice! It would be vintage Thomas for him to sew two such disparate things together.

    ...And BTW, Major, you once again prove that no one knows classic comics like you.

  15. #15
    Ultimate Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrNewGod View Post
    Huh! So, assuming the WW story was set after the All-Star story, . . .
    Now you're making my head spin.

    The Wonder Woman story was published in late 1977, and the All-Star Squadron first appeared in 1981. (Zyklon himself first appeared in 1985.)

    The All-Star Squadron story Zyklon was in was set in 1942, but I'm not sure what month.
    The Wonder Woman story with Seigfried would have been around "late June, 1942" according to that story.

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