View Poll Results: Is Rachel, Scott and Jean's daughter?

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  • Yes

    75 84.27%
  • No

    14 15.73%
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  1. #1
    Super Member GSman's Avatar
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    Default Is Rachel, Scott and Jean's daughter?

    Well obviously she kind of is, but there's more layers to it. Since this is a topic that's been kind of hot as of late, I thought I'd make a thread about it. And see what people think. But yeah, to clarify we all know she's Scott and Jean's daughter from another universe, but some seem to think she's not really 616 Scott or Jean's daughter, either. So I'm curious as to what people's perspective on this is.
    Last edited by GSman; 08-07-2019 at 04:31 AM.

  2. #2
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    She is daughter of Scott and Jean from earth 811 and adopted by Scott and Jean from earth 616

  3. #3
    Fire and life incarnate! phoenixzero23's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vaishakh View Post
    She is daughter of Scott and Jean from earth 811 and adopted by Scott and Jean from earth 616
    This. I don't get what is so hard to understand.
    Yeah, it feels weird sometimes but that's how the x-men have kids. On weird ways
    My ships
    Jean/Scott, Wanda/Vision, Rogue/Gambit, Storm/Black Panther

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vaishakh View Post
    She is daughter of Scott and Jean from earth 811 and adopted by Scott and Jean from earth 616
    Yeah, I'd say that accurately sums things up.
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  5. #5
    Super Member GSman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vaishakh View Post
    She is daughter of Scott and Jean from earth 811 and adopted by Scott and Jean from earth 616
    That's true, but some people hold on to the idea that just because she's the daughter of an alternate Scott and Jean, doesn't necessarily make her 616 Scott and Jean's kid. So I was curious as to why that is. Though I guess Jean telling Rachel she's not her mother in Gold also added fuel to that fire, though that was bad writing, in all honesty.

  6. #6
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
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    She is more Cyclops and Jean's daughter than Cable is their son .

    I mean they are fans who are going to get worked up this stuff but pure definition you can make argument that she isn't but genetically she is Scott/Jean and they accept her as their daughter so functionally she is like a daughter from surrogate mom who carried a baby for them. Since I brought it up Cable is like Jean's twin sister had baby with Cyclops. Sci fi is wonky we really shouldn't try to put our interpretations of their rules from our world because they don't work one for one at times.
    Last edited by Killerbee911; 08-07-2019 at 04:47 AM.

  7. #7
    Super Member GSman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    She is more Cyclops and Jean's daughter than Cable is their son .

    I mean they are fans who are going to get worked up this stuff but pure definition you can make argument that she isn't but genetically she is Scott/Jean and they accept her as their daughter so functionally she is like a daughter from surrogate mom. Since I brought it up Cable is like Jean's twin sister had baby with Cyclops. Sci fi is wonky we really shouldn't try to put our interpretations of their rules from our world because they don't work one for one at times
    That Cable comparison doesn't fit, IMO. 616 Scott and Jean, actually spent 12 years raising him so they actually have a close family dynamic. Not to say they don't have a family bond with Rachel, but it's way stronger with Nathan. Also Maddie is a weird case, she's Jean's clone, but was also made and brought to life by a piece of Jean's soul, the PF had. Making her more of an extension of Jean herself other than a completely different person like a twin. Plus, Jean has all those memories of giving birth to Nathan and having him with Scott, so she might as well be Nathan's biological mother in everything but birth.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vaishakh View Post
    She is daughter of Scott and Jean from earth 811 and adopted by Scott and Jean from earth 616
    They adopted her? They don't spend much time together…
    If I offended you, be assured that it wasn't my intention. English is not my first language.

  9. #9
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    And didn't Jean recently tell Rachel that she wasn't her mother and then when Rachel was taken and turned into a hound Jean seemed to have cared less about helping her...

  10. #10
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    616 Scott and Jean have no legal or moral obligation of being Rachel's parents. But Scott wants to be her dad, and Rachel wants him to be, so he is. Jean seemingly is on the fence, changing depending on who's the writer, but with a tendency towards no.

  11. #11
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GSman View Post
    That Cable comparison doesn't fit, IMO. 616 Scott and Jean, actually spent 12 years raising him so they actually have a close family dynamic. Not to say they don't have a family bond with Rachel, but it's way stronger with Nathan. Also Maddie is a weird case, she's Jean's clone, but was also made and brought to life by a piece of Jean's soul, the PF had. Making her more of an extension of Jean herself other than a completely different person like a twin. Plus, Jean has all those memories of giving birth to Nathan and having him with Scott, so she might as well be Nathan's biological mother in everything but birth.
    So blood doesn't make people family imo so where I stand on the issue is clear. But you are trying to sell all the retcon stuff they added to because they made a hot trash decision with Scott storyline. Simple question if they pull Emma or Magneto reformed villain with Madelene Pryor who is Cable's mom? The person who gave birth to him or the person who raised him? I understand all the thing they did to make Jean be really the mom but Cable biological mom still isn't Jean. As a note, I am in the camp that comic should reboot and stories like this should be fixed. I am fine with a person who didn't give birth being seen as the real parent especially with the scifi angle making the biologically related. Also but I understand by a stricter definition you can say Jean isn't the mom as well. That is my opinion if people want to disagree fine but in the fiction, you can produce another person who isn't 616 Jean giving birth to a child. But once again blood doesn't make you family.
    Last edited by Killerbee911; 08-07-2019 at 06:15 AM.

  12. #12
    Ultimate Member Havok83's Avatar
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    No, at least not 616 Scott and Jean. He didnt sire her and she didnt birth her. They didnt raise or adopt her either

    Quote Originally Posted by Zelena View Post
    They adopted her? They don't spend much time together…
    They didnt.

  13. #13
    The King Fears NO ONE! Triniking1234's Avatar
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    Yes. She's Scott and Jean's daughter, just not main reality Scott and Jean's daughter. Comics!

    I'm not sure what "adopt" means where some of you come from but Scott and Jean just accept her as kin. Cable still has bragging rights.
    "Cable was right!"

  14. #14
    Astonishing Member Askani's Flame's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GSman View Post
    Well obviously she kind of is, but there's more layers to it. Since this is a topic that's been kind of hot as of late, I thought I'd make a thread about it. And see what people think. But yeah, to clarify we all know she's Scott and Jean's daughter from another universe, but some seem to think she's not really 616 Scott or Jean's daughter, either. So I'm curious as to what people's perspective on this is.
    Has it though? Also, by definition if she is the daughter of 811 Jean and Scott, she would not be the daughter of the 616 counterparts.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vaishakh View Post
    She is daughter of Scott and Jean from earth 811 and adopted by Scott and Jean from earth 616
    She is not adopted by them. She was adopted by the X-Men and made family by them. Jean and Scott accept who she is and view her as a member of their family (one more than the other).

    Quote Originally Posted by GSman View Post
    That's true, but some people hold on to the idea that just because she's the daughter of an alternate Scott and Jean, doesn't necessarily make her 616 Scott and Jean's kid. So I was curious as to why that is. Though I guess Jean telling Rachel she's not her mother in Gold also added fuel to that fire, though that was bad writing, in all honesty.
    But it is true. She is NOT their daughter. They did not have a Rachel Summers in this timeline. So while one can argue whether or not they are family, she is not their child. And Gold was bad writing but perpetuated the hot-cold relationship Jean has had with Rachel.

    Quote Originally Posted by GSman View Post
    That Cable comparison doesn't fit, IMO. 616 Scott and Jean, actually spent 12 years raising him so they actually have a close family dynamic. Not to say they don't have a family bond with Rachel, but it's way stronger with Nathan. Also Maddie is a weird case, she's Jean's clone, but was also made and brought to life by a piece of Jean's soul, the PF had. Making her more of an extension of Jean herself other than a completely different person like a twin. Plus, Jean has all those memories of giving birth to Nathan and having him with Scott, so she might as well be Nathan's biological mother in everything but birth.
    Jean is Cable's mother solely by the fact that she raised him for 11 years of his life (Maddie raised him for the first year). Maddie is his birth mother but she is entirely different than Jean, regardless of being a clone or having fragments of souls or whatever nonsense was concocted. Unless Jean's direct egg was used in utero in Maddie (which we know if not the case) then Jean can never be his biological mother. Science.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zelena View Post
    They adopted her? They don't spend much time together…
    Right? I mean granted Jean was dead most of the time Rachel has been back, or Rachel was shunted to the future to keep her away from Scott and Jean. And Scott and Rachel didn't see eye to eye on things and he kept his distance from her. He also abandoned her, Alex, and Lorna to the confines of space and never gave them another thought. So I wouldn't say adopted more as accepted her as family.

    Quote Originally Posted by LoganAlpha30X33 View Post
    And didn't Jean recently tell Rachel that she wasn't her mother and then when Rachel was taken and turned into a hound Jean seemed to have cared less about helping her...
    Yes. In a wildly contradictive 5 month period where Jean went from being caring and loving , to "I'm not your mother", to "Leave my daughter alone!", to "I couldn't save her...You are my son..." in Extermination. It reads like she's schizophrenic. Every other book she's either caring or apathetic and cold. I hope we get some closure in the upcoming X-Men book by Hickman.

    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    No, at least not 616 Scott and Jean. He didnt sire her and she didnt birth her. They didnt raise or adopt her either

    They didnt.
    QTF

    Quote Originally Posted by Triniking1234 View Post
    Yes. She's Scott and Jean's daughter, just not main reality Scott and Jean's daughter. Comics!

    I'm not sure what "adopt" means where some of you come from but Scott and Jean just accept her as kin. Cable still has bragging rights.
    Yeah Cable is the only one who was raised by them, and of course that is solely thanks to Rachel's sacrifice......which is always forgotten.

  15. #15
    Mighty Member Jesse-James's Avatar
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    Well, it is clear Scott cares about her, but seems to care more for Cable though. Jean does not really seem to care much about Rachel does she?

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