Is Rachel, Scott and Jean's daughter?

[PrezValentine]

So Scott knocked up a firebird. The realest of heroes. Parker dethroned.

There's a reason he's the leader after all.

[Narasinha]

There's a reason he's the leader after all.

Oh... I knew there was one!

[Shreene]

Because Rachel often times ignores it herself?

LL! Fair enough (I know you really mean certain writers ).

[Drexelhand]

Actually, there is a scene in which Rachel realize that one of the pivotal moment is when Jean's father confronted her when she was turning into Dark Phoenix. In the 616, Jean's father rejected her which led to Jean turning fully into Dark Phoenix, destroying a planet and sacrificing herself on the moon. While in Rachel's universe, he didn't rejected her so she never turned into Dark Phoenix, never destroyed a planet, didn't had to die on the moon, married Scott and gave birth to Rachel.

UXM #199:

I'd forgotten about that, but the wording is still strange. Rachel says "How come you loved her enough to see that in my world, not this one." That's the closest we get to learning she may not have been cast out but we can't take Rachel's word here since a large part of her character arc here was how her memories were wrong. I do believe you are right in that Claremont did eventually plan for it to be another timeline where Scott fathered Rachel via the Phoenix itself but Days of Future Present leads credence to the one timeline theory (which itself is then shattered by Excalibur).

And then was killed when Mastermind detonated a nuke in Pittsburgh. (Which sounds suspiciously similar to the event that kicked off the original New Universe.)

There were several differences between the histories of Earth-811 and Earth-616.

This is also something I hear about that I never see a source for.

[FUBAR007]

This is also something I hear about that I never see a source for.

Excalibur vol. 1 #52.

[RachelGrey]

Rachel's uncertain memories of her world was explained in Excalibur. When Rachel recovered after sending Kate to the past to change their future, nothing had changed and everyone who had helped them were dead. Only Kate and Rachel were left alive from the escapees from the concentration camp. Rachel wanted to find out what went wrong so she followed the path she sent Kate on into the past. Rachel discovered that it was a different universe and many events were very different. She had such despair that the drifting Phoenix Force noticed Rachel's consciousness and then examined Rachel's mind and discovered that Rachel's world was dying and that she was the daughter of Jean Grey and Scott Summers from another reality. The Phoenix decided she would try and help Rachel, so Phoenix sent out an energy pulse to wake Jean inside the capsule (which also woke Madeline at the same time), then Phoenix piggy backed with Rachel into the 811 universe.

In the 811 universe Rachel fell unconscious because of the strain of carrying both herself and the Phoenix back. Phoenix spoke with Kate Pryde and talked about how she had used Jean Grey as a host for her cosmic power in another universe and because Rachel was compatible she could join with Rachel in the same way. Kate agreed to encourage Rachel to accept being the Phoenix host, in exchange Kate asked the Phoenix to hide some of Rachel's memories from her and take her back to the other universe and protect Rachel from remembering that there were two different Earths. Phoenix and Kate raided the Sentinel facility where Nimrod was being built and Kate laid down bombs to take the facility out. The idea was also to hide the portal energy that Phoenix needed to generated to transport Rachel between worlds. Kate and Phoenix were concerned that the Sentinels might be able to track the portal. They blew up the building and Phoenix opened the portal and Phoenix/Rachel stepped through into our universe. Nimrod woke up at that moment and pursued them through the portal. Kate was put into an inter-dimensional phase state because of the explosion but she was recovered by the Sentinel High Command. In 811 the Sentinel Command experimented with Kate to see if they could open a portal to follow Rachel and Nimrod to the other universe. They were now aware of other universes and intended to destroy mutants on other worlds after they destroyed them on the 811 world. In the experimentation Kate was merged into a Sentinel and became the cyborg Widget with Kate's mind in control but her memories so scattered she couldn't remember who or what she was.

Meanwhile in the 616 Rachel arrived as a latent host of the Phoenix Force. Phoenix made itself mostly dormant in Rachel but scattered Rachel's memories of her world so she was mixed up about what the 616 or 811 universes were. This is where the confusion comes from, 811 Jean never encountered the Phoenix, because the Phoenix existed only in the 616. Rachel was confused because she was mixing up memories between the two worlds. Rachel remained confused about her past memories until everything was fixed in the later issues of Excalibur after Rachel/Phoenix defeated Necrom and was resurrected, and the Phoenix told everyone that she was protecting Rachel from fully remembering all the people she lost in the other universe. After this point Rachel's mind is fully repaired and she remembers that she is from another universe and her memories are put in proper order. Rachel and Widget return to the 811 with Excalibur, they raid the Sentinel High Command and successfully change the core directive of the Sentinels from "kill all mutants" to "protect all life". The Sentinels in 811 then change to a police force that prevents people from engaging in violence against each other.

Excalibur returns to 616 but Captain Britain is lost in the time stream. Rachel and 616 Jean reconcile and Jean tells Rachel that even though Rachel isn't from their world she accepts Rachel as her daughter. Rachel also gets to meet Cable in the same issue, she realizes they have a connection, and Rachel discovers that she has the ability to interface with Professor the same way Cable can. Of course the reason being is that Rachel is also Mother Askani and she probably helped design Professor in the first place. Rachel and Cable embrace as brother and sister. They both attend Jean and Scott's wedding and Rachel is one of the wedding party wearing a bridesmaid dress. Cable decides to attend after all and he is also at the wedding. After Rachel returns to Britain she finds out that she can only restore Brian if she takes his place in the time stream. Rachel steps into the time stream and pushes Brian back into the normal reality.

Rachel is split into two while in the Time Stream. One part of her goes 2000ish years into the future sometime around 3900 I believe. This Rachel becomes Mother Askani, she leads the Askani rebellion against the Acolytes and defeats them with the remaining Phoenix Force she had. Rachel establishes the Askani Order to guide the future and past of the 616. Rachel and the Askani Order contact Jean and Scott in the past and rescue Nathan to the future when he is infected with the transmode virus. Nathan is put in stasis. Desperate to ensure the "Askani prophecy" Rachel and the Order create the clone of Nathan who does not have the virus, the boy who will one day become Stryfe. Apocalypse raids the facility and takes young Stryfe away believing that he is a cured Nathan. Rachel enacts her emergency alternative protocol and brings her Mother and Father into the Askani timeline. The Order created two clones of Jean and Scott from trace DNA they were able to recover. Rachel brings her parents consciousness into the Askani time and places their consciousnesses inside the clone bodies. Then she uses the remainder of her power to give them at least weaker versions of their present day powers. Scott and Jean place the dying Rachel into a stasis pod and they take over raising and training their son Nathan. During his upbringing Nathan talks to his sister in his dreams all the time and doesn't realize until later that it was Rachel guiding him and his parents all along. At the end of the story the dying Rachel talks to her Mom and Dad one last time appearing to them as her original teenage self and tells them she loves them and they tell her how proud they are of her and as she dies their consciousness return to their bodies in the past and the clone bodies are killed when the stop fighting. Nathan believes that his surrogate parents are dead because he wasn't told everything about where they were from. Eventually Nathan learns that Scott and Jean were also Slym and Red, and he learns that Rachel was Mother Askani.

The other part of Rachel is imprisoned by Gaunt in the prison at the end of time. He uses Rachel to goad Cable to come and rescue her because he wants to fight the "greatest warrior in history". It's kind of a silly story overall but it brings Rachel back to the present day. Rachel and her brother have a long talk and Rachel decides not to inform anyone she is back other than Cable and Blaquesmith and she decides to go to University.

Back when this was written the writer of Cable had exclusive control over using Rachel as a supporting character in Cable so she wasn't allowed to return to the X-Men. She came back to help Cable at the end of the Sisterhood Storyline.

Rachel is rescued by Storm's X-Treme X-Men and by Kitty and she returns to the X-Men fold. Jean dies in New York by Xorn. Rachel finds a holocron crystal left behind by her Mom that tells her how proud her Mom is of her and how much her Mom loved her. Just like when Rachel encouraged her Mom to retake the mantle of the Phoenix and make it her own, Jean's memory in the Crystal tells Rachel to take up her Mother's mantle of Marvel Girl and make it her own.

[blanchett]

Something I am wondering is if Rachel will be retconned to be a chimera from a prior timeline of Moira's? Seems like a mutant like Rachel could be a good contingency for Moira.

I would think that you would have:

Jean Grey - Telepathy and Telekinesis
Wolverine - Healing Factor/Tracking
Sanctity - Time Travel
Larry Trask - Premonition
Adrienne Frost - Psychometry

[Havok83]

Something I am wondering is if Rachel will be retconned to be a chimera from a prior timeline of Moira's? Seems like a mutant like Rachel could be a good contingency for Moira.

I would think that you would have:

Jean Grey - Telepathy and Telekinesis
Wolverine - Healing Factor/Tracking
Sanctity - Time Travel
Larry Trask - Premonition
Adrienne Frost - Psychometry

I dont think so as the chimeras had to go through several generations before we could get to the ones in PoX. Most of the first rounds were failures. PoX is ~ 100 years in the future and presumably set in the Life 10 timeline, although it could be 6, since we dont have info on that. Even if it is, I dont see Rachel as a chimera.

Wolverine- Rachel doesnt have a healing factor. Tracking is a learned skill, not a power that Wolverine or Rachel have. He uses his hyper smell to do so and she has her TP.
Sanctity - when her powers manifested, she was thrust thousands of years in the future. She wouldnt have even been around for Moira to get a sample from, although I guess Moira could have had knowledge of her from a past life and got to her before her X-gene was activated.
Larry Trask - Rachel isnt a precog
Adrienne Frost - she doesnt quite have psychometry either

Jean's powers are the only ones that truly hold up and maybe Sanctity. I dont think this is the route they are going with her though. That would completely f--k her up though to learn that she isnt even the child of Jean and Scott from her own reality and everything she was told was a lie. Although it would explain why she's so susceptible to psychic manipulation. Im actually liking your theory now that I think about it more.

[Decoy]

From her native timeline, yes.......the main Marvel Universe......she’s considered kinda (depends on the whims of the writers/ editors) their daughter (as editorial meddling prevented the 616 Rachel from existing and that’s up in the air at this point).......in a way she’s as much of their kid as Nate Grey was (only in comics can someone have alternative reality kids/ kids sired by ones clone to be considered theirs, right?).

By a specific point of view, they have 2 kids (Ok, Nathan was Scott and Madelyn’s son, but she went crazy nutso upon learning she was a clone of Scott’s first/ true love, while Nathan as a child saw Jean as his mother, even before he was shot into the future) while Rachel is the daughter from a timeline where Jean never died on the moon/ became the Dark Phoenix ........

I swear, we need a flow chart sometimes for the Summers Family Tree......(note to Hickman, you wanna simplify this mess?)

[Triniking1234]

Who's Sanctity?

[Havok83]

Who's Sanctity?

Madame Sanctity, Tanya Trask, the daughter of Bolivar.

[Askani's Flame]

Who's Sanctity?

Madame Sanctity, Tanya Trask, the daughter of Bolivar.

When her powers were activated she was thrust thousands of years into the future and found in the time stream by Rachel. Rachel trained her in her abilities and essentially made her second in command of the Askani Sisterhood. Tanya was extremely manipulative and ruthless. She was charged with raising Cable and training him upon Rachel's death, but was kidnapped by the New Cannanites. She then realized that Stryfe had the same psi-signature as Cable so she switched sides and trained Stryfe instead.

[phoenixzero23]

Madame Sanctity, Tanya Trask, the daughter of Bolivar.

Where is this from?

[Triniking1234]

Oh. There was another Trask with mutant powers? What the heck?

[Askani's Flame]

Where is this from?

X-Man #25. It was Sanctity warning Jean that Nate had resurrected Madelyne Pryor.