HOUSE OF X [02] : The Uncanny Life of Moira X *Spoilers*

[JKtheMac]

I don't see anything that supports the theory that those universes cease to exist once Moira dies.

If so, Destiny would not have killed her, that would have erased her own life.

She knows it will erase her own life. Hence the way she talks about her own life. It’s all there in the text.

[jwatson]

I don’t see the difference. Genocide and the art imply everything in Faraway would be destroyed. She was there, therefore she died. Hence the visual indicator that represents the end of a timeline.

So why leave it out? So we are to assume not one single person made it out. Not one single escape pod, escape route, teleporter in a whole city of mutants? I find that hard to believe. How hard would it have been to say Moira dies in Genocide at Faraway.

The art shows a clear dome with sentinels flying toward the enclosure. And we are to believe no one saw them coming? The art doesn't even show it being attacked yet.

[Havok83]

I don't see anything that supports the theory that those universes cease to exist once Moira dies.

If so, Destiny would not have killed her, that would have erased her own life.

Why wouldnt she? Destiny sees the bigger picture. It wouldnt erased her life as Destiny is very old and lived long before Moira was ever born. Only those born after Moira was could potentially be erased. For all we know Destiny forsaw Moira's existence and was preparing for it. If timeline 3 is eliminated, Destiny in timeline 4 would be able to tell that Moira's 'destiny' has been altered.

[Dark-Jacket]

Really loved the issue. I wasn't expecting any of that and was positively surprised. Moira was one of my favorite character and her death is one of the reason I stopped reading comics for a while. I was a bit upset at first she was retconned as a mutant, but it was done in a smart way. She's human until she dies. Lot of love for destiny too. That's why I hate when characters are killled. You just prevent another writer to bring a great piece with it.

I do think this is a rewound time line and basically Hickman's way of cleaning up continuity while not effectively out right deleteing anything. The fact that Moira has all knowledge means some things could have just been sped up since she got to the major players earlier. So he can at this point reference any x-men event he wants to acknowledge while not being restrained by any he doesn't.

It reminds me of The Flash TVshows were we learn in season 1 that someone messed up with the timeline and we haven't ever seen the original timeline. ^^

If we follow the marvel rules about time travel, each timeline is independant and lives on without moira.
I'm curious how much Xavier knows about the other timelines. Does Banshee knows too ? ^^

I also love the fact that, since she's creating a new timeline everytime she can't be detected. Hope she doesn't ends up a villain and we won't get a Maxwell Lord upset.

[Glio]

She knows it will erase her own life. Hence the way she talks about her own life. It’s all there in the text.

It is not at all as I interpret it. From Moira's point of view it is a long life, from an external observer there are ten clearly differentiated universes.

[jwatson]

Really loved the issue. I wasn't expecting any of that and was positively surprised. Moira was one of my favorite character and her death is one of the reason I stopped reading comics for a while. I was a bit upset at first she was retconned as a mutant, but it was done in a smart way. She's human until she dies. Lot of love for destiny too. That's why I hate when characters are killled. You just prevent another writer to bring a great piece with it.



It reminds me of The Flash TVshows were we learn in season 1 that someone messed up with the timeline and we haven't ever seen the original timeline. ^^

If we follow the marvel rules about time travel, each timeline is independant and lives on without moira.
I'm curious how much Xavier knows about the other timelines. Does Banshee knows too ? ^^

I also love the fact that, since she's creating a new timeline everytime she can't be detected. Hope she doesn't ends up a villain and we won't get a Maxwell Lord upset.

I don't think she's making new time lines, thats what makes her power so powerful. I think she is in a way reality warping and literally resetting everything like rewinding a vcr.

[Glio]

I don't think she's making new time lines, thats what makes her power so powerful. I think she is in a way reality warping and literally resetting everything like rewinding a vcr.

Reality warping is much more broken than creating new timelines.

Every time they travel through time they create new timelines in 616, it is quite discreet in comparison. If there were a mutant restarting the universe every 50 years, cosmic powers such as Eternity or Living Tribunal would have intervened.

[JKtheMac]

It is not at all as I interpret it. From Moira's point of view it is a long life, from an external observer there are ten clearly differentiated universes.

The way Destiny describes her power and how she is actively changing things, combined with the way Moira talks about being passive and active and the Observer Effect, clearly indicate she is rewinding time and starting again but this time changing things as she goes. The whole premise seems based on that idea. These are not alternative universes, this is her life and it contains a puzzle. How to make sure the world can move on beyond her normal lifespan.

We even get a hint that she can’t escape by dying before she is 13.

[Glio]

The way Destiny describes her power and how she is actively changing things, combined with the way Moira talks about being passive and active and the Observer Effect, clearly indicate she is rewinding time and starting again but this time changing things as she goes. The whole premise seems based on that idea. These are not alternative universes, this is her life and it contains a puzzle. How to make sure the world can move on beyond her normal lifespan.

When she is reborn she is born again a universe exactly identical to the original until she begins to modify it, hence the Observer Effect.

In practice, the only difference is whether there is any way to travel through the multiverse where Moira 4 is or not, anyway.

The fact that the graph is represented with parallel lines seems an indication that they are parallel universes.

[Dark-Jacket]

The way Destiny describes her power and how she is actively changing things, combined with the way Moira talks about being passive and active and the Observer Effect, clearly indicate she is rewinding time and starting again but this time changing things as she goes. The whole premise seems based on that idea. These are not alternative universes, this is her life and it contains a puzzle. How to make sure the world can move on beyond her normal lifespan.

We even get a hint that she can’t escape by dying before she is 13.

Well, her power is reincarnation, it's bolded in the comics.
Which means, she's living a life again, not rewinding time.
Again while talking with Moira destiny talks about "this version of you" implying than it's more a case of traveling through alternate timelines where each moira is different rather than just going back to Year 1.
I also think everything we've seen is from Moira X's timeline.

[Glio]

We just need to use Reed Richard's Bridge for a moment and see if we can take a look at Moira's previous lives or not. In practice it is the only difference.

[TOTALITY]

I have a theory on how the timelines could work which I mentioned like 20 pages back but I’ll elaborate on it since everyone is talking about it now!

It’s that none of her lives prior to the final one really “happened” per se. That Moira’s powers are like Destiny’s (foresight presumably based on an extremely accurate extrapolation of variables, a kind of omniscience for sure, but vividly extrapolating potential/probable futures from the data of the present. Even if most of that data is well beyond the bounds of most people’s perception, and they don’t perceive the separate elements of data, just the vivid complete picture.) But in Moira’s case, she was born with 9 layers of very linear, very complete foresight, each building on the whole of the previous one(s). This is all kind of based on the notion that all time is simultaneous, and its “flow” as we experience it is entirely perception. Just endless cause and effect, every effect and every cause in the whole of existence embedded in each single “moment.” Every “us” in every point of our timelines experiencing that moment all at once, separated only by cause and effect. Etc.

So Moira is moving through this, her only life, with the complete extrapolation of what her life would have been had she lived it 9 times times prior, and taken within this idea of time as mere perception, this knowledge is functionally exactly the same as if she had lived those lives from beginning to end. And her and Destiny’s foresight are both accurate enough that they could both have a memory of the same conversation, despite it only happening as a potential future. For them, that perception is no different experienced as a preternatural extrapolation of data than having lived it in the past.

Anyway, this is mostly just a fun mental exercise and “tidying up” the timelines for tidiness’ sake — not sure what the dramatic purpose would be. Or even how it would be different from saying she lived all those lives in different timelines; just as we experience time as a steady flow even though that’s just our limited perception, even if my theory is what Hickman had in mind it might still make more sense to present as 10 lives experienced consecutively because that’s what makes sense in the language of storytelling.

[Big Joe]

Have I got this right? It is her death that creates a new universe at the point where she is in the womb. Does this mean that the previous life is wiped from existence completely? Or are those universes her deaths created still out there?

The plot is really clever so far, and very well executed, the art is exceptional as well, it is a great comic book. The criticism I have seen is around the emotion and characterisation to date, and to an extent I agree with that. Some of her previous personal relationships have been brushed over, or entirely swept aside. Of course this may well change after all we're only a quarter of the way through it all.

I'm looking forward to the rest of this, and eager to see how it plays out, I think it transcends personal views on particular characters because it could be so enormously far reaching for all of the cast. Moira's 10th life ending could recreate the entire Marvel universe, not just the mutants. She is massively powerful.

[Glio]

Have I got this right? It is her death that creates a new universe at the point where she is in the womb. Does this mean that the previous life is wiped from existence completely? Or are those universes her deaths created still out there?

The plot is really clever so far, and very well executed, the art is exceptional as well, it is a great comic book. The criticism I have seen is around the emotion and characterisation to date, and to an extent I agree with that. Some of her previous personal relationships have been brushed over, or entirely swept aside. Of course this may well change after all we're only a quarter of the way through it all.

I'm looking forward to the rest of this, and eager to see how it plays out, I think it transcends personal views on particular characters because it could be so enormously far reaching for all of the cast. Moira's 10th life ending could recreate the entire Marvel universe, not just the mutants. She is massively powerful.

That is what we are discussing right now.

[Big Joe]

That is what we are discussing right now.

Yeah I had been writing that for ages while I was thinking about how to actually put it down. I guess age has slowed me down.